Any link i cant find it the hifi critic review of the 11 shows rather elevated treble fwiw
-
WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!
ATC speakers / Monitors
- Thread starter Pearljam5000
- Start date
ELACs beaming in HF is still more proportional to directivity of frequencies before 10khz compared to ATC. ELACs have better controlled directivity than ATCs. That doesn't mean that Elac's are accurate speakers though, ATC prides itself for making very accurate speakers. ATC speakers should have better power response than this.
I had owned ATC SCM20ASL pro for 6 months by the way. I liked them but I like my KH420s more.
I have both the 20 and the 40 no comparison to the 3 ways if you compare side to side which you probably have not done.
He is pretty right though. There is more than one form of knowledge. Propositional/explicit knowledge, and practical/tacit knowledge are probably the main ones.
You inevitably need a balance of both to 'make' things in this world. No acoustician gets paid to jiggle with a clients room design over and over and over again while they try and get it right. No audio engineer gets paid over and over again while they try and figure out why the top end of their mixes made using 8361A's just don't translate in a way that the 8361A's would lead them to believe.
The development of tacit knowledge comes from doing things over and over again. It is the 10,000 hours that invariably leads to an understanding of how all that explicit knowledge that form idealistic concepts and idealised goals, gets sifted down into processes and designs that are physically obtainable in the real world, under a whole slew of constraints that reality inevitably sends your way. The more bespoke the thing being made is, the more it relies on tacit knowledge to execute within any commercial context.
Tacit knowledge obviously takes on a different form than explicit knowledge, but ironically that also makes it much easier to demonstrate with evidence.
There are a lot of us who enjoy talking about stuff, but find making things far more challenging and satisfying. This place would be far more civilised if people appreciated that individual outcomes aren't necessarily all aligned to the same goal. Some people are probably here purely for rigorous debate, which is totally fine... but there is absolutely no scientific evidence that supports the need to be a complete and total jackass in the process...
I thought that was precisely what acousticians were paid for, still no measurements from Northward I suppose.
Keith
Keith
Waiting for you to have a look at those few questions I asked before I agree to do that... Looks like I'm not sharing?
Here they are for my room. These are point measures, not aggregated across listening area, thus not fully representative. But they should give you a topic to discuss. This is all before Dirac correction.
SPL vs. frequency:
Distortion Left:
Distortion Right:
Step Left:
Step Right:
Group Delay Left:
Group Delay Right:
RT60 Left:
RT60 Right:
T
Is yours a Northward room?
Keith
No. This is a room at my home with ATC100 speakers. I am not a pro, thus it represents a real life use case.
Looking incredibly entitled and vastly incompetent.
I presume you do make measurements or are the rooms just sold on aesthetics alone?
I really fail to understand why you wouldn’t want to share, if I made outstanding product I would want everyone to know.
Keith
I really fail to understand why you wouldn’t want to share, if I made outstanding product I would want everyone to know.
Keith
What amazes me is how much time some of you people are prepared to spend talking about a brand you clearly don't like. You are so obsessed with ATC that it seems you are not very happy with the speakers you have at home. 
tuga
Major Contributor
You do.
BrokenEnglishGuy
Major Contributor
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2020
- Messages
- 2,028
- Likes
- 1,199
I don't have any speaker in my home, i don't how to feel about this heheWhat amazes me is how much time some of you people are prepared to spend talking about a brand you clearly don't like. You are so obsessed with ATC that it seems you are not very happy with the speakers you have at home.
Dial down the personal comments folks.
That is probably more revealing of your level of understanding of what they do than anything else, Keith. Nobody is really going to come out looking very good if we start trying to diminish what people do to naively simple terms...
- Joined
- Jan 15, 2020
- Messages
- 6,948
- Likes
- 17,155
Unfortunately not online yet, but you can buy the magazine here. https://abo.audio.de/einzelhefte/audio-ausgabe-10-2022.html
If you want though just the measurements send me a PM.
I am intrigued Turnip if an acoustician doesn’t get paid to make the room sound good what does he actually do?
If you could keep it simple commensurate with my level of understanding.
Keith
Just like a pimply-faced teenager working in a burger joint, do you just get paid to hand a customer a cardboard box containing a product? Or is your job in reality, more nuanced?
Do you take great effort to understand the things you are selling? Do you take great effort to listen to the things any specific customer is trying to achieve, (specific purposes, sound quality, physical size, aesthetics, etc)? Do you take great effort to understand the kinds of budgets or timeframes your customer may have? Do you then distill all that information down in an attempt to offer the best possible solution for the best possible price, within an otherwise competitive market?
Simple enough?
I spent some time with an acoustician a few years ago. I rocked in a bit smug because I know how to use REW, and I have read many acoustic forums, and I have a measurement mic. It was nothing like what the acoustician did. The shear volume of measurements he took was off the charts. In locations I never would have bothered. Each with quite specific data points that he was extracting to build a bigger picture of the complexities of what was occurring in the room. How do complex things get represented in simple terms?
Here is a waterfall of my centre channel. If you have any feedback on the problems this room has and how to make it better, I am all ears. I stupidly saved over the original empty room benchmark after three glasses of wine, and a fun old time messing with audio stuff late one evening. The room is something like 3.5 x 3.15 x 2.4m which is... not ideal, but them the breaks.
Attachments
Last edited:
