Assemble best budget system for under $2500 ?

[greenfingers]

Hello good people of ASR! Last 2 months had been fun and frustration putting together a budget stereo sound system. Started with $300 Elac bookshelf speakers….4 sets later, I now settled with MartinLogan 40i floor speakers. Well, you got the idea. Cheap won’t be good enough.

I will explore Tidal and Qobuz later. I need to build out the system first as I am still within refund period for the HTA200 amp.
Current system: streaming Spotify on Laptop, USB-C to aune X8 DAC to Dayton HTA200, tube pre-amp and AB class amp to MartinLogan 40i, and RCA to Velodyne 1000 watts sub.

I was happy with this budget amp at first pumping 200W to bookshelf speakers. I recently questioned if I need to spend more for higher fidelity. Notably I am lacking crisp tight bass.
Since almost 100% source is lossy Spotify format, will get better sound upgrading amp and DAC?

I now know the importance of quality DAC, so looking at 1 of 3:

RME ADI-2 FS DAC $1300
Denafryps Aries II $700 approx
Musical Fidelity MX-DAC $600 approx

I am open to upgrading 2 channel amplifier.

So I could use wealth of knowledge from the good people here! TIA

 

[ZolaIII]

How about that you buy your self a measurement microphone and a DSP (ADC-DSP-DAC) like UMIK-1 + MiniDSP Flex. Iron out the bass response, isolate - decouple the sub from the floor (with isolation stands, packs or both) and do a partial room treatment (wall behind speakers with rock wool 4" panels and corners). Best budget system is what you catch on sail without obvious flaws which cannot be corrected and will differ by region where you live. Of course you do need to have a plan what you hope to achieve in the first place like listening distance, room size, desired SPL.
Best regards and have a nice time.

 

[sweetchaos]

Welcome to ASR.

Your speakers are by far more important than your choice of DAC or amp.

I'm not impressed by Martin Logan. Here's a review of 4i (smaller brother to your towers):

If you're lacking bass, then I would upgrade your subwoofer, otherwise, if you're keen on keeping your towers.
See my 'subwoofer comparison' spreadsheet for top-tier subs.

Choosing a capable DSP (aka room correction) solution comes right after capable speakers and subs.
DAC+amp comes after DSP, in terms of priority.

 

[Power Pop 23]

Consider auditioning 'Dirac Live' in your set-up. You will need to secure a calibrated microphone like MiniDSP's UMIK-1 to measure your listening space

 

[LightninBoy]

I recommend buying a measuring mic and learning about bass management and room eq. And only buy other new equipment if it has the bass management or EQ capabilities you need to solve your bass problem.

 

[Count Arthur]

I doubt changing the DAC will make much difference; decent DACs tend to be pretty much indistinquishable from one another.

Changing speakers/subs/rooms pretty much always makes more difference than anything else.

I don't know much about the Dayton HTA200, but it's a rare valvle amp that will outperform a good solid state amp.

 

[Ron Texas]

Buy a $200 Topping DAC and spend more on loudspeakers. Also, get a UMIC-1 microphone for $100. That and learning how to use REW is the most you will ever get from your audio money.

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

How important are looks? You can currently get a pair of JBL Studio 590s for $800, and @MKR can attest that they're pretty unbeatable for the sub $1k per speaker class (IIRC he's been enjoying them while he searches for his endgame $30,000 system).

I'd get a pair of 590s, a minidsp flex with the optional 2-channel DIRAC license, and a umk1 for $1600.
You can upgrade the amplification if you want, but you probably won't need to.

 

[greenfingers]

Wow, thank you all. I realized this is a science based forum so responses are kinda technical for me. Musical bliss has its price (literally) and I remind myself not to get too far down the rabbit hole. So I was hoping to just invest a few more $$ for better gear for the sake of quick gratification to just enjoy a system that is deemed good enough, but i know the science of audio certainly isn't simple. : )

 

[sweetchaos]

I’ll make this as simple as possible.

Your choice of speakers, subwoofer(s) and room correction software will make the biggest audible difference.

Your choice of amplifiers or DACs will make the smallest audible difference.

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

I’ll make this as simple as possible.

Your choice of speakers, subwoofer(s) and room correction software will make the biggest audible difference.

Your choice of amplifiers or DACs will make the smallest audible difference.

Agreed, unless the DAC also has DSP capability al la minidsp.

 

[Timcognito]

One box does it all with Dirac DSP, streaming, Roon, Volmino, 120 w/ch and great specs.
"Chromecast Built-in, Apple AirPlay, and a headphone output, the SHD Power includes features not normally found in a budget integrated amplifier-DAC: Roon Ready network streaming capability, parametric equalization, Dirac Live room correction, and adjustable high-pass/low-pass crossover filters. The SHD Power also runs the open-source Volumio music player, which is accessed through a web-based interface and supports Tidal, Qobuz, HighResAudio, Spotify (via a plugin), and internet radio. Considering its reasonable price, the SHD Power is remarkably fully featured."

SoundStage! Hi-Fi | SoundStageHiFi.com - miniDSP SHD Power Integrated Amplifier-DAC

www.soundstagehifi.com

 

[Chrispy]

I wouldn't bother with changing dac, perhaps get rid of the tube stuff. Bass could be a variety of things and better integration tools or even simple placement might be a way to go about that.

 

[Sgt. Ear Ache]

The importance of a quality DAC is sort of a loaded notion. You can get a DAC of essentially perfect quality (in a sound quality sense) for a couple hundred dollars. There's no need to spend more than that unless there's some specific feature you need that a standard dac doesn't offer. I don't know what your amp is like really (although the tube thing could be iffy), but I doubt changing it would make much audible difference unless you are finding it to be underpowered for your needs. I also personally wouldn't really describe a $2500 system as a "budget" system. It's just a system. I would say if you are lacking crisp tight bass, and you haven't done any EQ and room setup/correction yet, that's your best option before looking at new gear.

 

[greenfingers]

Greetings! Just like to provide an update on my bass issue. On my quest to A/B test numerous, speaker cables, RCA cables, USB cables, DAP’s, laptop manufacturers, subwoofers and lastly speakers. I‘ve lost sight of progress and it turned out I was using Fork Spade Plug to Binding Post Banana Female Jack to connect to Amp to feed the sub and main speakers. I don’t know the technical term but I messed up impedance output from the amp? Well now sub has more bass than I can handle, volume only about a quarter turn.

I not into technical measurements and room correction process. Why? Because this system is in my kitchen for crying out loud. Right speaker against the corner with curtain a foot away, kitchen table, chairs in front 3 or 4 feet away from speakers….well you get picture of the crib.

Source: I found I like the sound produced by bang and olufsen tuned HP laptops over same budget Dell and others makers. Of course, Qobuz even with Non-Hi Res streaming still has better sound than Spotify.

DAC/Amp: Now the internal DAC of the Dayton HTA200 was not too shabby compared to Gustard X18 DAC. Of course X18 has better vocals but is it worth $750+tax? Also tried Gustard U18 DDC but likely settled for iFi iPurifier3 USB Audio and Data Signal Filter/Purifier

All in all, the only component I didn’t change was Dayton HTA200, preferred this to the Cambridge Audio AXR100 amplifier.

Speakers: thank you Elitzur–Vaidman for suggesting JBL 590. These were out of stock so I tried 580, better bass than MartinLogan 40i, but mids and highs were too laid back for me. I am so pleased with Focal Chora 816 speakers! Very musical and balanced tone from top to bottom. I am still in awe how good they are.

Subwoofer: Replaced Velodyne sub with Klipsch sub.

Now I am testing with different brand of long USB cable (AudioQuest Pearl USB A to B Cable 15 feet gives me control of Qobuz) vs ones costing 20 bucks

I also have Musician Audio Pegasus R2R DAC on the way so I am not quite done yet but with every component tested and as cost increases, the sonic satisfaction also increases. Yikes!

 

[Chrispy]

All this is in the kitchen? Mine certainly has no space for such gear (and one of the few rooms in the house I don't have a system in, but the system in the adjacent room works fine while I'm cooking); no room for table and chairs in my kitchen either tho. More curious, why the kitchen? Why use fraudioquest cables? The gain position on the sub is more about the level of the signal you're feeding it with rather than some sort of indicator of capability. Sometimes just trusting well measuring equipment with the features you want is more time-effective, too (hard to imagine one dac particularly affects vocals).

 

[kemmler3D]

Greetings! Just like to provide an update on my bass issue. On my quest to A/B test numerous, speaker cables, RCA cables, USB cables, DAP’s, laptop manufacturers, subwoofers and lastly speakers. I‘ve lost sight of progress and it turned out I was using Fork Spade Plug to Binding Post Banana Female Jack to connect to Amp to feed the sub and main speakers. I don’t know the technical term but I messed up impedance output from the amp? Well now sub has more bass than I can handle, volume only about a quarter turn.

I not into technical measurements and room correction process. Why? Because this system is in my kitchen for crying out loud. Right speaker against the corner with curtain a foot away, kitchen table, chairs in front 3 or 4 feet away from speakers….well you get picture of the crib.

Source: I found I like the sound produced by bang and olufsen tuned HP laptops over same budget Dell and others makers. Of course, Qobuz even with Non-Hi Res streaming still has better sound than Spotify.

DAC/Amp: Now the internal DAC of the Dayton HTA200 was not too shabby compared to Gustard X18 DAC. Of course X18 has better vocals but is it worth $750+tax? Also tried Gustard U18 DDC but likely settled for iFi iPurifier3 USB Audio and Data Signal Filter/Purifier

All in all, the only component I didn’t change was Dayton HTA200, preferred this to the Cambridge Audio AXR100 amplifier.

Speakers: thank you Elitzur–Vaidman for suggesting JBL 590. These were out of stock so I tried 580, better bass than MartinLogan 40i, but mids and highs were too laid back for me. I am so pleased with Focal Chora 816 speakers! Very musical and balanced tone from top to bottom. I am still in awe how good they are.

Subwoofer: Replaced Velodyne sub with Klipsch sub.

Now I am testing with different brand of long USB cable (AudioQuest Pearl USB A to B Cable 15 feet gives me control of Qobuz) vs ones costing 20 bucks

I also have Musician Audio Pegasus R2R DAC on the way so I am not quite done yet but with every component tested and as cost increases, the sonic satisfaction also increases. Yikes!

2 things:

Your choice of cable won't make any difference in the sound. You'll definitely HEAR one but 999/1000 times it's your brain playing tricks on you. Especially USB cables - they either work or don't. Bits are bits because they all go into buffers anyway.

You should really look into room correction; the worse the room, the more you stand to benefit, in fact.

IMO if you want to make the most of $2500:

Get the cheapest Topping, JDS or SMSL DAC that has the connectivity you need.

Get a used Mini-PC for about $50-100 that you can use for room correction EQ.

If you need to, get something you can use for a preamp (Topping has some all-in-ones with XLR out that should work...)

At this point you should have spent less than $500. Throw in that UMIK-1.

Spend the remaining $2000 on 2 mains that go pretty low (-3dB no higher than 40hz), with the flattest response and smoothest directivity you can manage, any amp you can find with more than 100WPC and 2 matching powered subs. Go secondhand to maximize your dollar here.

Use the UMIK and Mini-PC to integrate the subs and mains and correct the room.

You should have a pretty credible, if not high-end hifi system by this point.

 

[greenfingers]

fraudioquest! Haha. Kitchen because after breakfast and dinner I linger at the table wasting life away on YouTube watching all the talking heads pumping up the latest n greatest DAC! Those guys never heard a new DAC they didn’t like

TY for pre amp with XLR suggestion too! If I like the Pegasus. Can get better sound with XLR > RCA

 

[Chrispy]

fraudioquest! Haha. Kitchen because after breakfast and dinner I linger at the table wasting life away on YouTube watching all the talking heads pumping up the latest n greatest DAC! Those guys never heard a new DAC they didn’t like

TY for pre amp with XLR suggestion too! If I like the Pegasus. Can get better sound with XLR > RCA

They are mostly a fraud rather than audio particularly. LOL the dac pumping may have to do more with another type of male individual pumping activities.

 

[Deleted member 48726]

They are mostly a fraud rather than audio particularly. LOL the dac pumping may have to do more with another type of male individual pumping activities.

LOL -"DAC pumping". -Why am I thinking of a certain Audioman, which is Cheap..