There’s a small “but” here, which is that some of the stereo mixes coming at the same time as the Atmos ones are still compressed. New releases in Atmos and stereo are more trouble in this regard though.
Name them please, and don't use streaming for an example
If you really care about sound quality, VINYL IS for the lowest common denominator..
I'm left using streaming as an example in most cases... but the first four tracks of "Nothing but the Truth" by Pineapple Thief, which was demonstrated to me late last year, comes to mind as something I've heard probably as downloads. Excellent Atmos, lousy stereo.
VInyl - I ditched it as well. I got that. What I meant was that the major labels think we only care about sound quality on vinyl (and now Atmos/spatial sound/multichannel) and stereo digital continues to broadly decline outside of the classical - and by that I mean big name orchestral, really - space.
We all also know well the complexities of 'just' setting up a basic set of two floor-standing speakers (as a stereo pair)... even absent of a sub...
But at what (non-monetary) cost? You've already referenced "during the height of the loudness wars" stereo recordings...
Kid-Gloves?
Good points.[imo >> I know not many will sympathize with my rant:]
Would it be considered a crime to think and treat 'music' with kid-gloves?
OR
Should it be considered a crime to process the crap out of 'music' during - not only the recording, but also - the listening stage?
I am not certain that mainstream multi-channel 'music' has really penetrated the market anymore than quadraphonics did back in the 1970s.
I ask the above primarily because the pre-standardized 2-channel 'music' recording - and playback - have been with us for over a half a century; yet we all know well that there are some very atrocious sounding stereo recordings...
We all also know well the complexities of 'just' setting up a basic set of two floor-standing speakers (as a stereo pair)... even absent of a sub...
But at what (non-monetary) cost? You've already referenced "during the height of the loudness wars" stereo recordings...
You also commented that:
Kid-Gloves?
Would you like to mix some Atmos and EQ with that order of music?
Like I said, nothing wrong with the DR on Wilson mastered 2ch
Yes, again the Wilson 2ch master has an excellent DR13 measurement.
DR13 for the Pineapple Thief album? I'm surprised. It doesn't sound like that to me... no brickwall, but no dynamics either. Then again, I heard a 16/44.1 album, not 24/48 as you are quoting. I'll investigate the 24/48, it's on Qobuz. (sometimes streaming comes up trumps after all) and a quick listen suggests it's OK.
In my opinion , there is one big black hole of ignorance for most audiophiles regarding two things :Apologies in advance if this post is meandering or unconcise, as if I need an editor, I'm going to try and write this quickly so I don't waste too much time!!!
I sometimes think about "what's next" for the advancement of audio playback and my mind keeps going back to one thing.
First, let me get this out of the way: I think that hardware is at a reasonable place. Yes, I know that transducers and electronics can and will continue to improve. Hopefully, good performance will be had for less money and more convenience in the future.
The thing that I keep thinking about is the source - as in the actual recordings. I know that this isn't a groundbreaking suggestion.
Most of us here know about the "loudness wars".
There's been a million (conservative estimate) circular arguments online that go "digital measures better", "but the vinyl masters are better", "the vinyl pressing masters have been the same as the digital masters for the last 30 or whatever years except with the bass taken out", etc.
Since the introduction of red book CD-DA we've seen plenty of new takes on digital audio:
I'm sure some will disagree with me, but I've written off a lot of above for various reasons: not enough media supported, gimmicky, proprietary hardware or software required, the implementation of the media is questionable, etc.
- Hi-Res
- SACD
- DVD-Audio
- DSD
- DXD
- MQA
- Apple Spatial Audio
- Dolby Atmos
- etc
All of this is to finally bring me to the point I'm trying to make:
I'm beginning to increasingly feel like this hobby is a futile exercise.
We could spend thousands of dollars on the newest and greatest gear.
But to play what? Our poorly mastered records?
Tidal and Apple espouse their new fancy formats that we never wanted or asked for. I get it - the formats can be used as a marketing tool for their streaming platforms, so there's actually a financial impetus there.
The labels don't want to pay money to remaster the compressed records that people are happily buying and streaming. Fair enough.
But why should I spend my money for increasingly incremental improvements when the record labels are the ones with the ability to make the biggest improvements to fidelity?
To those who actually enjoy "audiophile music" and audiophile recordings exclusively: I envy you.
Me? I'm forfeiting my audiophile membership card until there's media that incentivises me to join the club again. I'll stay on the forums tho, that's still fun.
I wrote this while listening to the following record on Spotify through my Bose QuietComfort 35. AAC Bluetooth. No EQ.
View attachment 266987
I am not going to look up your definition of that word!
Not all gear is the same, not all releases are the same. That has been true since the beginning of music recording.
Mt first common law was more excited than I about the new stereo gear I would bring home and so we got along well that way. The second common law was commenting about my big KEF speakers, the 3 amps and PEQ crossover assorted stuff. I simply agreed with her that they are large and I dropped the topic...LoL. She certainly did not complain about having music to listen to and movies through the speakers too.
Mine likes having the stereo, definitely. I’ve involved her in choosing things and it’s all OK. But her hearing problems are such that she can’t cope with surround sound in cinemas, to the extent that she has had to walk out.
Hmmmz... I never heard of that kind of hearing issue but it makes sense to me that it would be annoying and awkward to listen to. I thank my lucky stars that my hearing is still decent for my age. Considering all the outdoor equipment I've operated extensively. Like bucking up fire wood with 2 stroke chainsaws for about 10 years of winters, a lawn mower for a acre of grass cutting one to two times a week for the entire summer for ~15 years and very loud 2 stroke motorcycles for about 12 years.
You could always leave the surround off when she's listening and turn it on for you?
My last few visits to the cinema have found they often have audio issues, often simply too loud for the particular content (especially content before the movie). I suspect the personnel at the theaters have little actual audio expertise. At least at home you can control the volume and loudness effects.
Agreed. Much if not most of the theater sound is too loud. Specially when I go to the local IMAX theater, which is about the only one I've gone to in years. I love the SciFi, StarWars, StarTrek, Marvel type films and I want to experience them in their best theater presentation. BUT there's no way in hell they have to be so loud to cause phyiscal pain and ear ringing after exit. I did miss the IMAX run of Guardians Of The Galaxy 3 but since I just got my new 85" Samsung I don't think I'll be too disappointed when the 4k BD is released.
Truth. We are now at the point where bad recordings sound bad if you listen critically. Good recordings sound quite good even on crap systems. It is amazing how the source recording is so important and we have no choice in much of that. I think myself and many others would gladly pay extra for recordings or streaming, that had the same volume from song to song. Also, they were all very high quality in that they were recorded extremely well. I think of the old Telarc recordings for setting up surround sound systems gack about 20 -30 years ago. Once you hear great recorded music or special effects it stays with you on how great it plays.I'm flabbergasted to observe how the quality of recording can be so different, even sometimes on the same album, not all the tracks are equal. I have been caught in the Dr. Tool "circle of confusion" for a while, trying to find my system's weakness until I concluded that, when fed with high quality recordings, my system is absolutely great and there is absolutely no need to upgrade anything: the problem is in the studio, not in my listening room. Unfortunately, high quality recordings are more than ever a very scarce ressource
Yes, but one thing is that it sits there as an annoying reminder of her problems: and also just fitting multichannel into our living room is a genuine headache.
