Abyss Diana V2 Review (headphone)

[_thelaughingman]

I would recommend looking at the users posts over at headfi to see what you're getting into.

Honestly don’t think it’s worth his time to go look at a flame war because people disagree with his measurements.

 

[Tachyon88]

Honestly don’t think it’s worth his time to go look at a flame war because people disagree with his measurements.

Wasnt really for him, but others who have the time on their hands and bored enough to write lengthy replies.

 

[WickedInsignia]

Just a heads-up: Fullbright is another bleed-over from HeadFi, same as Assaf and Skeptic.
In my experience there she was subjective and derogatory to the extreme. She has no intentions to be productive and has joined the wagon to come here and throw rocks.

@amirm I strongly suggest you close this thread, it's just attracting an influx of users with the the sole purpose of trolling everyone else. At this point we are willfully participating in arguments that waste everyone's time. No-one is being informed nor enriched here.

 

[amirm]

If we close the thread, then they will say we didn't know how to defend our position. What they should know is that I have two other Abyss headphones to test so they better watch out!

 

[Vini darko]

 

[WickedInsignia]

If we close the thread, then they will say we didn't know how to defend our position. What they should know is that I have two other Abyss headphones to test so they better watch out!

I don't think our priority is in defending a position we don't have. These people will not start singing your praises if you prove them wrong, they will simply huff and keep bashing you on their forum.
If we don't defend our position, we are weak. If we do defend our position, we are too self-assured and unmoving. You can't win here, and there are no benefits to winning apart from clout. These people's opinions are completely inconsequential.

Our priority should be in fostering a positive and informative environment and encouraging others to participate. We don't need to defend our position, because it will speak for itself to the people that matter and are reasonable.
People like Fullbright and Skeptic are not reasonable, and neither is the place from whence they came. They don't survive here: they simply peter out and leave, at the cost of everyone else's time.
Maybe you're having too much fun with this, but it invites drama into a place many people came to avoid it.

Anyway, that's my stance. Since I'm sure we'll be on this merry-go-round with a second bout of measurements, it would be good practice to let it cool off.

 

[WickedInsignia]

BTW, not suggesting you don't measure more Abyss headphones Amir. By all means!
Maybe we can attract DMS here to talk about their $5000 cables. Even better, maybe he can measure them for us!

@franspambot , to your point: at least all of this is contained in a single thread. These people don't tend to spill out and cause havoc elsewhere. I am simply being the angel on Amir's shoulder, for lack of a better metaphor. I'm just beyond the point of feeling that ASR has anything to prove.

In any case, let's continue being as measured and reasonable as we can. I have nested here because the discourse was legitimately the most sensible and productive of any other audiophile space I'd been. I have a deep appreciation for the attitude fostered here, however contrary to that my points may seem.

 

[617]

My retirement fund is entirely Dogecoin and expensive headphones

 

[Somafunk]

My retirement fund is having an unnecessary kidney

 

[Jimbob54]

My retirement fund is entirely Dogecoin and expensive headphones

Between Amir and Musk, your retirement fund is having a pretty shocking year.

 

[Zensō]

Does anyone really care what goes on at Head-Fi? That place has been a cesspool of subjective nonsense for years.

 

[NDRQ]

Does anyone really care what goes on at Head-Fi? That place has been a cesspool of subjective nonsense for years.

Also full with paid "reviews".
SBAF is the place to go, if you want to read subjective opinions about headphones.
While the source topics are full with nonsense audiophile blabla, the headphone threads are pretty good, full with valuable infos.

 

[Deleted member 31750]

How about that. People on various forums rave about Abyss 'phones. Those measurements - especially the distortion plots - look simply horrible.

If you consider distortion as something that is alway bad. Some people actually look and want some kind and type of distortion. That’s why measurements can be useful. Drivers distorting at 114db wouldn’t consider it as an issue.

 

[MayaTlab]

If you consider distortion as something that is alway bad. Some people actually look and want some kind and type of distortion. That’s why measurements can be useful. Drivers distorting at 114db wouldn’t consider it as an issue.

Their FR alone is enough to question what's the point of Abyss making headphones when $200 headphones don't have anywhere near the amount of problems these have in the range where headphones measurements on dummy head are the most representative of what individuals will hear (but I'd argue that the 1266 is even worse).

 

[Deleted member 31750]

Their FR alone is enough to question what's the point of Abyss making headphones when $200 headphones don't have anywhere near the amount of problems these have in the range where headphones measurements on dummy head are the most representative of what individuals will hear (but I'd argue that the 1266 is even worse).

Some call it problems, some call it pleasure. For example you are mentioning the FR graph. One thing is the measurement to be accurate representation the other thing is that some might actually like this sonic signature. The 1266 for example is the most impressive headphone I’ve ever tried. Measurements tell you only one side, observation is another. What are your observations on these headphones following the measurements?

 

[MayaTlab]

What are your observations on these headphones following the measurements?

In regards of the 1266, lots of high magnitude high / medium Q peaks or dips, some with asymmetrical slopes, even between 300-4000hz where measurements are the most representative of what you'll hear, that would manifest themselves one way or another if we were to measure them with probe microphones near your eardrum, that makes them unEQable to any one target in particular, have no rational justification, and are likely to result in significant masking.
You can add to that the massive null at around 6-7kh. This is in the range where measurements are less reliable but it's so massive that it's likely to manifest itself on your own head one way or another.
It's one of those headphones which FR is so bad I don't even need to try them to know that I won't care for them one bit.
The Diana V2 is actually better in that regard and I don't think that I would hear with most recordings some features of the FR raggedness.
In that regard both of them are easily bested by $200 headphones from the 90s.
At the price point they're going at this is shoddy engineering.

 

[Deleted member 31750]

In regards of the 1266, lots of high magnitude high / medium Q peaks or dips, some with asymmetrical slopes, even between 300-4000hz where measurements are the most representative of what you'll hear, that would manifest themselves one way or another if we were to measure them with probe microphones near your eardrum, that makes them unEQable to any one target in particular, have no rational justification, and are likely to result in significant masking.
You can add to that the massive null at around 6-7kh. This is in the range where measurements are less reliable but it's so massive that it's likely to manifest itself on your own head one way or another.
It's one of those headphones which FR is so bad I don't even need to try them to know that I won't care for them one bit.
The Diana V2 is actually better in that regard and I don't think that I would hear with most recordings some features of the FR raggedness.
In that regard both of them are easily bested by $200 headphones from the 90s.
At the price point they're going at this is shoddy engineering.

Are you saying that you don’t include observation in your approach?

 

[MayaTlab]

Are you saying that you don’t include observation in your approach?

I don't know what you mean by "observation". If by that you mean actually listening to headphones, well, the value of dummy heads measurements for me is precisely to not bother with headphones which exhibit some deficiencies in their FR of a certain nature to such a degree that I can very effectively correlate these deficiencies with me not liking how they sound.
The 1266 is one of those - particularly since several copies have been measured by different people with similar results (Crinacle).
Another, good example would be the B&W PX7 (turns out that I did listen to these and my ears still haven't forgotten me).
The deficiencies of both of these are of such a nature and degree that Harman's research would probably suggest that they'd loose to more preferable FR curves in blind tests for most people.

Once measurements pass the "good enough" threshold for me is when I want to listen to them before expressing a preference for one or another. Typical headphones of that kind would be the K371, HD650, HD560S, AirPods Max, Sundara, Empyrean, etc. It doesn't mean that I'll like all of them, far from it.
The gist of the idea is that all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares. Ie all the headphones I've enjoyed and kept in the long run measure reasonably well on a dummy head, but I don't necessarily enjoy all headphones that measure reasonably well in these conditions.

Most headphones would actually land in the "meh not a priority" category based on their FR measurements and if I'm kind the Diana V2 would barely get in it.

I would also suggest not relying one someone else's subjective observations for the most part as headphones' FR can vary quite a bit from person to person if it were to be measured on their own head, particularly at the two extremes of the spectrum. Here an example of how the HD820 varies on five different humans below a few hundred Hz :
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-3-1/graph#669/3185
And the methodology : https://www.rtings.com/headphones/tests/sound-quality/frequency-response-consistency
The reason I can easily pass judgment on the 1266 is because it show gross deficiencies in the area where these variations will be the lowest.

 

[Deleted member 31750]

I don't know what you mean by "observation". If by that you mean actually listening to headphones, well, the value of dummy heads measurements for me is precisely to not bother with headphones which exhibit some deficiencies in their FR of a certain nature to such a degree that I can very effectively correlate these deficiencies with me not liking how they sound.
The 1266 is one of those - particularly since several copies have been measured by different people with similar results (Crinacle).
Another, good example would be the B&W PX7 (turns out that I did listen to these and my ears still haven't forgotten me).
The deficiencies of both of these are of such a nature and degree that Harman's research would probably suggest that they'd loose to more preferable FR curves in blind tests for most people.

Once measurements pass the "good enough" threshold for me is when I want to listen to them before expressing a preference for one or another. Typical headphones of that kind would be the K371, HD650, HD560S, AirPods Max, Sundara, Empyrean, etc. It doesn't mean that I'll like all of them, far from it.
The gist of the idea is that all squares are rectangles, but not all rectangles are squares. Ie all the headphones I've enjoyed and kept in the long run measure reasonably well on a dummy head, but I don't necessarily enjoy all headphones that measure reasonably well in these conditions.

Most headphones would actually land in the "meh not a priority" category based on their FR measurements and if I'm kind the Diana V2 would barely get in it.

I would also suggest not relying one someone else's subjective observations for the most part as headphones' FR can vary quite a bit from person to person if it were to be measured on their own head, particularly at the two extremes of the spectrum. Here an example of how the HD820 varies on five different humans below a few hundred Hz :
https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-3-1/graph#669/3185
And the methodology : https://www.rtings.com/headphones/tests/sound-quality/frequency-response-consistency
The reason I can easily pass judgment on the 1266 is because it show gross deficiencies in the area where these variations will be the lowest.

Understand your approach but I am interested in science only and science as a process requires observation-research-hypothesis-test-data analysis-conclusion and back to observation to confirm your findings. Personally I understand your view I am just not interested in a subjective interpretation of the test which is important but just a part of science. Yes, trying the headphones is an integral part of science as a process and without it you are left with the interpretation of a test which is subjective.

 

[amirm]

Understand your approach but I am interested in science only and science as a process requires observation-research-hypothesis-test-data analysis-conclusion and back to observation to confirm your findings. Personally I understand your view I am just not interested in a subjective interpretation of the test which is important but just a part of science. Yes, trying the headphones is an integral part of science as a process and without it you are left with the interpretation of a test which is subjective.

Arguments like this don't belong in review threads. Please take it elsewhere.