28 inch Squared Flat Subwoofer (ascendo the28) - What is it?

[digital_av]

A 28" squared subwoofer landed(allegedly does single digits to 600hz linear<unknown SPL>).
As it happens it's very shallow which makes it very appealing for some people (like me) so I have to ask: What's the catch? Why nobody else thought to build shallow subs like this? How does this compare with a refrigerator sub like (JTR 2400 ULF - https://www.jtrspeakers.com/jtr-captivator-2400ulf )

Fun fact: Maybe I didn't hear it right but heard it handles 40 KW of power.

At 31.5" wide x 39.4" high and an overall depth of just 12", it’s extremely room-friendly;

ASCENDO developed a 28-inch composite sandwich cone from multiple layers of rohacell and advanced composite materials. With the cone area equivalent to a 32-inch subwoofer,

Ascendo Drops an Infrasonic Bombshell with Groundbreaking The28 Sub Squared Pro, Adds The 16Sub Pro Passive to Lineup

(August 29, 2024) Ascendo Immersive Audio isn't shy about flexing its low-end muscle, having used the grand stages of CEDIA 2022 and 2023 to showcase its massive infrasonic and formidable kick sub designs. This year is shaping up to be another statement showing, as the company has revealed plans...

www.avnirvana.com

 

[Joffy1780]

A 28" squared subwoofer landed(allegedly single digits to 600hz linear).
As it happens it's very shallow which makes it very appealing for some people (like me) so I have to ask: What's the catch? Why nobody else thought to build shallow subs like this? How does this compares with a refrigerator like (JTR 2400 ULF - https://www.jtrspeakers.com/jtr-captivator-2400ulf )

Fun fact: Maybe I didn't hear it right but heard it handles 40 KW of power.

At 31.5" wide x 39.4" high and an overall depth of just 12", it’s extremely room-friendly;

ASCENDO developed a 28-inch composite sandwich cone from multiple layers of rohacell and advanced composite materials. With the cone area equivalent to a 32-inch subwoofer,

Ascendo Drops an Infrasonic Bombshell with Groundbreaking The28 Sub Squared Pro, Adds The 16Sub Pro Passive to Lineup

(August 29, 2024) Ascendo Immersive Audio isn't shy about flexing its low-end muscle, having used the grand stages of CEDIA 2022 and 2023 to showcase its massive infrasonic and formidable kick sub designs. This year is shaping up to be another statement showing, as the company has revealed plans...

www.avnirvana.com

Looks awesome, but $30,000 is a lot for a subwoofer, Magico territory.

 

[AudiOhm]

Did I hear that right, power handling over 40Kwatts.

Ohms

 

[kemmler3D]

What's the catch?

Apparently that it costs $30K, seems like a minor snag...

Why nobody else thought to build shallow subs like this?

They have, in fact @sigbergaudio makes one.

 

[digital_av]

Apparently that it costs $30K, seems like a minor snag...

They have, in fact @sigbergaudio makes one.

that doesn't look square flat panel (I mean the driver).

 

[kemmler3D]

that doesn't look square flat panel (I mean the driver).

Oh, I see what you mean. Square sub cones aren't super rare (you can find some in the car audio world) but I think because voice coils are round it just makes things a lot easier if the cone is also round. Square cones get you more surface area but probably at the cost of more difficult engineering or worse distortion.

 

[DVDdoug]

The fan subwoofer is around the same price but it requires some architectural modifications.

I've always sort-of lusted for a pair of "Earthquake" subwoofers But I don't have the space or budget, and although they can "blow out your neighbor's windows" they don't go down to 20Hz.

 

[Ktacos]

"Nobody has ever done a sub like that before"

Except the brand car sub brand kicker, square drivers in general have been around for awhile.

How'd they determine the price? Throw darts as a wall?

 

[earik]

It's cool, but it's also 4x as tall as it is deep, which means when you throw 40kw of power at it, there's no way it's going to be able to stay standing upright. My guess is that it throws itself through the wall out into the backyard way before you hit max excursion.

 

[pderousse]

Just a ‘tad’ beyond my budget.

For that price I could get 30x my current 4 18” infinite baffle sub - 120 subwoofers, now that’s a thought.

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

A 28" squared subwoofer landed(allegedly does single digits to 600hz linear<unknown SPL>).
As it happens it's very shallow which makes it very appealing for some people (like me) so I have to ask: What's the catch? Why nobody else thought to build shallow subs like this?

A square subwoofer with side length L only has ~27% more surface area than a circular subwoofer with diameter L. This 27% additional surface area increases overall output by less than 0.1dB while increasing distortion due to decreased radial symmetry (all other factors kept consistent).

Massive low-profile subwoofers are uncommon because they combine all of the engineering challenges of low-profile and massive subwoofers while limiting their market to low-profile subwoofer customers.

 

[egellings]

I don't get it. Why such huge power in a residence? Why does anyone want windows blown out and eardrums ruptured? I could see that in a movie threater, but 40kW in a home? Are residences even wired for that much electrical power?

 

[MAB]

A 28" squared subwoofer landed(allegedly does single digits to 600hz linear<unknown SPL>).
As it happens it's very shallow which makes it very appealing for some people (like me) so I have to ask: What's the catch? Why nobody else thought to build shallow subs like this?

Companies have done square drivers for a long time. Like this totl Sony APM-8 from 1979:

This arrangement trades traditional cone breakup modes for different modal distortion modes on a square planar surface. Likely with higher distortion since you loose the structure of the cone.
Practically speaking, when the surround rotted, replacement was way more difficult.
All of the square drivers I have seen look much more complex to manufacture than a coned woofer:

And you can make a darn good cone with a piece of paper.

There are tons of shallow woofers that are not square, like this SB acoustics:

Shallow typically leads to asymmetric linearity in Bl as in the case of the SB Acoustics example:

Test Bench: The SW26DBAC76-4 Shallow-Mounting Subwoofer from SB Acoustics

This Test Bench article analyzes the popular SW26DBAC76-4 10" low-profile subwoofer from SB Acoustics, specifically designed (and patented) for applications that require a subwoofer that will fit into very shallow-depth enclosures. The SW26DBAC76-4 has a unique and interesting feature set that...

audioxpress.com

Or if the tradeoffs are not manage, highly non-linear Bl. Shallow limits the geometry of the motor.

There are really massive number of shallow subs in all shapes and sizes, mostly for lifestyle and space constraints. Just look up Auto, Boat, RV installations. People been developing these for some time. I am not sure how I could be both contemplating 28" subwoofers and simultaneously space constrained.

Ascendo is always doing absolutely outrageous subwoofer designs, all of them 100x my budget. Are you actually considering subs in this price range?

 

[win]

Since when is 12" shallow

 

[MAB]

Since when is 12" shallow

Good grief, I missed that.

 

[sigbergaudio]

Apparently that it costs $30K, seems like a minor snag...

They have, in fact @sigbergaudio makes one.

Companies have done square drivers for a long time. Like this totl Sony APM-8 from 1979:
View attachment 391299

This arrangement trades traditional cone breakup modes for different modal distortion modes on a square planar surface. Likely with higher distortion since you loose the structure of the cone.
Practically speaking, when the surround rotted, replacement was way more difficult.
All of the square drivers I have seen look much more complex to manufacture than a coned woofer:
View attachment 391301
And you can make a darn good cone with a piece of paper.

There are tons of shallow woofers that are not square, like this SB acoustics:
View attachment 391302
Shallow typically leads to asymmetric linearity in Bl as in the case of the SB Acoustics example:

Test Bench: The SW26DBAC76-4 Shallow-Mounting Subwoofer from SB Acoustics

This Test Bench article analyzes the popular SW26DBAC76-4 10" low-profile subwoofer from SB Acoustics, specifically designed (and patented) for applications that require a subwoofer that will fit into very shallow-depth enclosures. The SW26DBAC76-4 has a unique and interesting feature set that...

audioxpress.com

Or if the tradeoffs are not manage, highly non-linear Bl. Shallow limits the geometry of the motor.

For the record (since our Inkognito subwoofer is mentioned in the thread), we do not use a "shallow" driver, but a traditional one without these typical challenges.

 

[voodooless]

It can handle 40 kW of power? In this small box? With todays compressed music, let’s assume a crest factor of 10 dB, then the thing still needs to dissipate 4 kW of heat!

 

[kemmler3D]

the thing still needs to dissipate 4 kW of heat!

Not pictured: Large watercooling rig, radiator, and fans.

 

[voodooless]

Not pictured: Large watercooling rig, radiator, and fans.

Seriously?

 

[digital_av]

I am not sure how I could be both contemplating 28" subwoofers and simultaneously space constrained.

Are you actually considering subs in this price range?

You may have a "wall" available. That doesn't mean you have a half a meter or a meter depth as well available to place subwoofers. The wall is already used for the LCR loudspeakers and the projector screen/TV. With only 30 cm (12") or 20 cm (8") depth as this subwoofer I think most people could accommodate them between the LCR speakers.
Actually I do. The price may be an issue but I have to see what I can work with the dealer. I've been looking for a shallow subwoofer(less than 35 cm deep) that can do single digits to 120hz with super low distortion and "no compression" at reference levels for quite some time.
Maybe I'm missing something but I couldn't find such thing googling for Marine "subwoofers". I know JL Audio does that but none of them are 18" or more.

It's cool, but it's also 4x as tall as it is deep, which means when you throw 40kw of power at it, there's no way it's going to be able to stay standing upright.

Stability is one of my concerns as well.

Since when is 12" shallow

I think since all the other commercial subwoofers are usually double of that.
Also:
; customers can even request a custom option that shrinks the enclosure to as shallow as 8".