28 inch Squared Flat Subwoofer (ascendo the28) - What is it?

[MAB]

Sure but for how long can it run? Seconds, maybe minutes. Running that vs a 40kW sub doing club duty all night at full tilt are two very different things.

I'm trying to sidestep the 40kW part, and the statement about not breaking a sweat...
In most industries, engineering department is facepalming when marketing or CEO says "it can do xyz with it's eyes closed".

 

[digital_av]

Measurements are now available:

https://www.aia-cinema.com/products/2023_Products/THE_28_SUB_PRO_SQUARED/THE_28_SUB_SQUARED_MeasurementReport.pdf

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

Measurements are now available:

https://www.aia-cinema.com/products/2023_Products/THE_28_SUB_PRO_SQUARED/THE_28_SUB_SQUARED_MeasurementReport.pdf

Tbh the measurements don't really look that great if you're looking for high-quality sub-bass. You'd need ~17dB of DSP to make it flat out to 20Hz, so the distortion would be quite high.

 

[Old_School_Brad]

Or pull the rest down 17 dB whilst feeding it 30 kW peak to obtain 120 dB 20 Hz.

Room gain will probably help a ton down there though.

 

[DonH56]

Square/rectangular drivers have been around for a long, long time. Apart from the novelty of the look, technically they usually exhibit higher distortion and greater modal breakup due to higher stress in the corners. One solution, at least partial solution, is to also use a square (or rectangular) voice coil to drive the diaphragm. It can quickly become a manufacturing problem. Panels driven across the surface, like an ESL or planar dynamic driver, are a different beast.

I'll just keep using my little cheap dynamic servo subwoofers.

 

[3ll3d00d]

Tbh the measurements don't really look that great if you're looking for high-quality sub-bass. You'd need ~17dB of DSP to make it flat out to 20Hz, so the distortion would be quite high.

This is par for the course for a pro audio style driver, use a large negative high shelf to bring it down

 

[MAB]

Measurements are now available:

https://www.aia-cinema.com/products/2023_Products/THE_28_SUB_PRO_SQUARED/THE_28_SUB_SQUARED_MeasurementReport.pdf

I just noticed too.
Quite incredible SPL capability. Per my previous comments to you, comes in a very stout box! And needs an appropriately stout amplifier plus DSP. Are you still considering these? It's well out of my price range , but looks great if you need subsonics.

 

[Axo1989]

Looks awesome, but $30,000 is a lot for a subwoofer, Magico territory.

Magico price without aluminium? They'll never make @Pearljam5000's wish list. I expect Magico would add a zero though.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Magico price without aluminium? They'll never make @Pearljam5000's wish list. I expect Magico would add a zero though.

Waiting for Genelec to make a 50 inch aluminum sub similar to this one
Then I'll buy it for sure

 

[digital_av]

Are you still considering these? It's well out of my price range , but looks great if you need subsonics.

I still do consider them because there is nothing else on the market in that form factor(shallow) but depends if the dealer can/is willing to accommodate my "special" requests.

 

[DonH56]

I still do consider them because there is nothing else on the market in that form factor(shallow) but depends if the dealer can/is willing to accommodate my "special" requests.

For the price you could purchase an array of smaller (10" or 12") subs and stack them, or look at in-wall sub formats like JL or Revel offer in their architectural series.

 

[MAB]

I still do consider them because there is nothing else on the market in that form factor(shallow) but depends if the dealer can/is willing to accommodate my "special" requests.

I would say nothing in the large, single-driver, square form factor is out there. However, this sub is not particularly shallow, in fact not as shallow as 18" and 21" subs. It is only slightly shallower than Ascendo's own 24" and 32" subs which significantly outperform this square sub by their own test data.

You give up lots of performance and pay an incredible premium for this square driver, and you end up with only one sub. But if you have to have only one sub, and it needs to be square, and 28", and require an amp that needs a dedicated industrial electrical drop, then I guess this is indeed the only one.

 

[kyuu]

For the price you could purchase an array of smaller (10" or 12") subs and stack them, or look at in-wall sub formats like JL or Revel offer in their architectural series.

Eh? Revel has in-wall subs?

 

[digital_av]

I would say nothing in the large, single-driver, square form factor is out there. However, this sub is not particularly shallow, in fact not as shallow as 18" and 21" subs. It is only slightly shallower than Ascendo's own 24" and 32" subs which significantly outperform this square sub by their own test data.

You give up lots of performance and pay an incredible premium for this square driver, and you end up with only one sub. But if you have to have only one sub, and it needs to be square, and 28", and require an amp that needs a dedicated industrial electrical drop, then I guess this is indeed the only one.

I might be wrong but I can’t find even an 18” (apart from Ascendo) shallow as this sub(I.e 30 cm). I mean commercial subwoofer not a driver to diy. As I said it’s the form factor (and decent performance) that makes it attractive to me.

 

[DonH56]

Eh? Revel has in-wall subs?

Yes. It's a dual 8" and does not go super low, however. https://www.revelspeakers.com/produ..._B28W-_color=Black-US-Current&cgid=subwoofers

JL and many others make in-wall subwoofers. SVS has a fairly nice and relatively inexpensive one: https://www.svsound.com/products/3000-in-wall-subwoofer

 

[digital_av]

Yes but I can’t use that in a Trinnov Waveforming configuration (double bass array)

 

[MAB]

I might be wrong but I can’t find even an 18” (apart from Ascendo) shallow as this sub(I.e 30 cm). I mean commercial subwoofer not a driver to diy. As I said it’s the form factor (and decent performance) that makes it attractive to me.

It is a very unique driver.
The do have a nice looking line of slim subs 18" and below. The square unit gives quite a bit of raw performance compared to the 32" conventional sub (if you can call 32" conventional). And even more performance compared to four of their own shallow 18" subs.

This is from Ascendo's own MAX-passed data they provide, I superimposed it onto one plot. The square sub only barely outperforms the 32 round at 15-20Hz, and gives up as much as 10dB of raw performance above 20Hz, plus rolls off faster at 10Hz if that octave is really important . The quad-sub setup wins everywhere. I just think this is too big of a tradeoff. In any case, all of these are above my target SPL.

 

[Old_School_Brad]

It is a very unique driver.
The do have a nice looking line of slim subs 18" and below. The square unit gives quite a bit of raw performance compared to the 32" conventional sub (if you can call 32" conventional). And even more performance compared to four of their own shallow 18" subs.
View attachment 395035
This is from Ascendo's own MAX-passed data they provide, I superimposed it onto one plot. The square sub only barely outperforms the 32 round at 15-20Hz, and gives up as much as 10dB of raw performance above 20Hz, plus rolls off faster at 10Hz if that octave is really important . The quad-sub setup wins everywhere. I just think this is too big of a tradeoff. In any case, all of these are above my target SPL.

 

[MAB]

View attachment 395050

Yeah. Need to call the electrician, and the power company.