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Why has the loudness war not ended yet?
- Thread starter abdo123
- Start date
This is your very first post:
(and I know Sound Check is not enabled by default since I use Apple Music on macOS and iOS).
But anyway to answer your thread title question , the loudness war will be officially over if/when normalization is enabled across all the biggest streaming services and there is no option to disable/ change this by the user.
We're not there yet but it's been heading in the right direction.
We're not there yet but it's been heading in the right direction.
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Correct - producers are servants of the market, not its directors. Compression is here to stay, because the vast majority of end-use cases benefit from it. And things will get worse - with majority use of soundbars and pod speakers, we'll migrate to mixes with all the narrative elements clumped together in a "fat mono" center, with L & R confined to wispy reverbs that can be phase-manipulated by the gear for a "spacious" effect. The tide is going out for us, never to return.
Taketheflame
Member
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I think things have actually gotten better in recent years, and seem to be heading in the right direction. There are some great sounding modern recordings I've come across, at least in some electronic, pop, and indie rock styles.
But as others have said, with the masses more likely to be listening on earbuds, soundbars, or Bluetooth/smart speakers these days (as opposed to a traditional hi-fi system), many engineers are going to optimize recordings for that hardware.
But as others have said, with the masses more likely to be listening on earbuds, soundbars, or Bluetooth/smart speakers these days (as opposed to a traditional hi-fi system), many engineers are going to optimize recordings for that hardware.
Could it be "going for the money"? Not much money in music anymore unless it is from a nationally or internationally known group. Plus lifestyle concerns are currently ruling audio design and manufacture for the masses. I guess it is what it is!
Very well observed.
It's really sad to think that CDs recorded and mastered in the mid to late 1980s, i.e. over 30 years ago, were the pinnacle of recorded quality, and it's been downhill ever since.
Especially galling as the technical quality of digital players has never been higher, (albeit inaudibly better than older devices) yet what we have to play on them is so much worse.
I'm grateful that I kept all the CDs bought in the 1980s and can play the original releases rather than later remasters.
Streaming has done nothing for quality in spite of 'Mastered for iTunes' and the like, given that the recordings are made with earbuds and Bluetooth / Alexa playback in mind.
I'm glad for specialist labels like Chandos, but regret that they're unable to fund recordings of major large orchestral works given the relatively small audience.
S.
Robin L
Master Contributor
Unless the dynamics are limited, the sound will be useless for most listeners.
I listen to lots of music from the past. In the 78 era, the recordings were dynamically limited because of the self-noise of 78s. When LPs happened, most popular music was first heard on AM radio. That music was [heavily] compressed because the stations wanted as much range as possible and the playback devices included a lot of portable radios and car radios. When CD happened, some of the early productions emphasized the potentially high dynamic range, but the market spoke and said it wanted everything louder.
The issue of "Brickwalling" is a first world problem, and not much of one at that. The music that actually requires wide dynamic range ["Classical", some Jazz, mostly] doesn't get brickwalled. The pop stuff is going to be played back in less than ideal conditions. Being an "audiophile" is mostly a set of first-world problems.
So should one give up on high fidelity stereo? Serious question.
The overriding opinion in this thread seems to be that mastering/compression does not, and will not favor 2channel stereo listening.
The overriding opinion in this thread seems to be that mastering/compression does not, and will not favor 2channel stereo listening.
Robin L
Master Contributor
The stuff that sells will be the stuff that sells. The "audiophile" community is small and is going to stay small. The market for compressed music will always be larger, it always has been.
Right. But my point is, if the mixing/mastering is optimized for ear buds/soundbars, why would one waste any resources on hifi 2 channel gear?
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Zensō
Major Contributor
I think the answer to your question depends a lot upon the type of music one listens to.
Robin L
Master Contributor
Because that's the gear they will be using? I don't know what Amazon HD does as regards dynamics, but I've streamed Classical recordings I've got from CDs that I've ripped, they sound the same unless they're from a different master, and those different masters of Classical music almost always have the same dynamics as earlier versions. Right now I'm listening [via headphones, most of what I listen to these days is via headphones] A collection of AM radio hits from the 1960's. It's real easy to hear all the compression artifacts. This is the stuff played back via the best gear of that time as well. There's plenty to appreciate here ["Lost & Found in the Sixties", Liberty Records, EMI stuff mostly] even though this music is all heavily compressed. "Spooky" sounds just fine, thank you very much. "Gimme Some Lovin" sounds like crap, just like it always has.
Yep. So the next question I would have is what types of music are optimized or al least not crushed so that a hifi system will have utility?
Zensō
Major Contributor
Right. Generalizing, I’d say classical, jazz, and perhaps some electronic music such as ambient and experimental, in that order. Oh, and some soundtracks in those genres. I’m probably overlooking something...
Robin L
Master Contributor
Acoustic music. Classical, Jazz, Folk, various genres under the rubric of "World Music". Most pop music has some compression, all "Rock" is compressed. If it's "ultimate fidelity" you seek, then you're seeking the obscure because most really popular music is produced for the largest audience.
This is a lovely obscurity that takes full advantage of the potential dynamics, a funny and very well realized parody of the concept of the "Audiophile" record:
Robin L
Master Contributor
Follow the money.
The well-known [in audiophile circles] story of the "Hot", bass-heavy cut of Led Zep II is a sterling example, the original pressing having enough bass in the groove as to make the arm fly out of the groove of less than stellar turntables. The company decided to remaster with less bass. The original version sells for a lot used, is valued by collectors. But part of the reason it's valueable is that there are few copies, a situation akin to the "Butcher" covers of "Yesterday & Today". The reality is that catering to the whims of audiophiles is not in the monetary interests of the big corporations that supply us with recordings of popular music.
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Explain please. Why is having high dynamic range through transducers like earbuds and BT speakers a bad thing?
