Why Do Old Technologies Persist in Audio?

[Frgirard]

It is concerning that the author of the thread cannot envision a world other than his utilitarian view.

 

[EJ3]

Oh, I think the audible performance of my ES gear is as good as anything. Once you reach transparency then it is mission accomplished, and both amplifiers and CD players achieved that years ago. However newer gear would almost certainly measure better for those into measurement, have way more functionality (streaming, wireless capability, USB, possibly built in room correction and DSP etc) and would use less energy (I suspect that a Class D amp would give a noticeable reduction in electricity consumption). However from what I can see I would have to pay frankly silly money to get anywhere near the build quality and tactile feel.

& paying that "silly money" would cause it to be a long, long time before you were to break even on the electricity savings, not to mention the environmental savings by keeping the gear that you have up, running & out of the land fill stream. That "keeping what you have "ENVIRONMENTAL" savings is what the folks promoting getting new gear are completely forgetting about when you are being told that you should by new gear (which likely will not be repairable but be disposable & need replacement at 4 or 5 times the rate that what you have will finally need replacement (but shouldn't need replacement if the individual caps, etc where still available). Things like Hypex not selling an individual amp module (which seems to be an industry norm now) to someone who had one burn up seems to be proof that the industry as a whole isn't considering that aspect of the environment & conservation but only the electrical efficiency side of the coin. (Which they promote like crazy).
That is only a small part of the big picture. The ability to get parts that will replace the ones that fail & the ability to fix the unit (or have it fixed) is also a major part of the environmental & conservation equation. What are the environmental & conservation costs of having to dispose of something that is broken only because of being unable to obtain a replacement part? (especially when the part is in current manufacture but the company refuses to sell it to individuals or their technician/repair facilities?).

 

[3dbinCanada]

Back in the 60's we all spun vinyl and used tube electronics because that's what was available. Solid state electronics and digital audio came along. We are now in yet another era with switching power supplies, Class D amplification, and the move away from CD's to downloads and streaming.

Somehow the old technologies persist. I can sort of see with vinyl there is the ritual of handling the media. The rest of it is bewildering.

I dont want to pay for a music streaming service. Enough of my money is going out for Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc. Its as simple as that.

 

[JJB70]

& paying that "silly money" would cause it to be a long, long time before you were to break even on the electricity savings, not to mention the environmental savings by keeping the gear that you have up, running & out of the land fill stream. That "keeping what you have "ENVIRONMENTAL" savings is what the folks promoting getting new gear are completely forgetting about when you are being told that you should by new gear (which likely will not be repairable but be disposable & need replacement at 4 or 5 times the rate that what you have will finally need replacement (but shouldn't need replacement if the individual caps, etc where still available). Things like Hypex not selling an individual amp module (which seems to be an industry norm now) to someone who had one burn up seems to be proof that the industry as a whole isn't considering that aspect of the environment & conservation but only the electrical efficiency side of the coin. (Which they promote like crazy).
That is only a small part of the big picture. The ability to get parts that will replace the ones that fail & the ability to fix the unit (or have it fixed) is also a major part of the environmental & conservation equation. What are the environmental & conservation costs of having to dispose of something that is broken only because of being unable to obtain a replacement part? (especially when the part is in current manufacture but the company refuses to sell it to individuals or their technician/repair facilities?).

I agree, buy right, buy once, move away from the throwaway society.

 

[lewdish]

I'm curious as to why there's less adoption of the Nutube technology to replace the regular tubes, at least in more budget oriented gear? They seem to solve a lot of issues in regular tubed products and are a lot easier to handle as a consumer.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

They certainly do, however flash drives and harddisk do lack certain archival quality when compared to any optical media.

Not if you think about having multiple off-site backups.

 

[EJ3]

Back in the 60's we all spun vinyl and used tube electronics because that's what was available. Solid state electronics and digital audio came along. We are now in yet another era with switching power supplies, Class D amplification, and the move away from CD's to downloads and streaming.

Somehow the old technologies persist. I can sort of see with vinyl there is the ritual of handling the media. The rest of it is bewildering.

There are many places that I go (& have a home) that streaming is not even an option (nor is cable).
CD's (when done right) are not perceptible as being inferior. CD or other digital files (I can make archival 20 bitperfect CD's from my vinyl and digital files for when something happens to the SSD, Flash Drive or whatever) & a good ADC/DAC do work, no compromise.
Since I have multiple CD players (some have been used only once for a functional test) & spare parts for them (that are kept at or under 74 F), I can be with this tech through out the rest of my life. (the only major piece of equipment that I own that would be difficult, if not impossible to get repaired is a Technics SL-M3 due to the early 1980's era computer controls).
New music is still available to me in either cassette, vinyl, CD or even FM (because I do get over the air FM & TV) or (download from a place where I do get a digital signal, when I am there).
Old music which never even made it to CD is still available to me through my vinyl rig or through archives like the Smithsonian, as is ethnic music (a large portion of what I play) from many sources.
Even if I had streaming (and I am certainly not against using it) it would be only a small part of the music I listen to. If I only had streaming, I would not be happy to be so limited in what I want to listen to.
I have records that have been in my family since 1927, film of my family since 1934 & family photos since way before those times.
As JJB70 said: "buy right, buy once, move away from the throwaway society".

 

[Ron Texas]

This thread has set a record for people quoting the original post and very few likes. I feel underappreciated considering the entertainment value I have provided.

As for CD's you can argue all you want, but sales have declined enormously and soon they will be in the VHS zone. I doubt they will make a comeback as vinyl has.

 

[Frgirard]

This thread has set a record for people quoting the original post and very few likes. I feel underappreciated considering the entertainment value I have provided.

As for CD's you can argue all you want, but sales have declined enormously and soon they will be in the VHS zone. I doubt they will make a comeback as vinyl has.

By reading your post, how to like a troll? The second-hand CD market is endless.

 

[JeffS7444]

This thread has set a record for people quoting the original post and very few likes. I feel underappreciated considering the entertainment value I have provided.

Alright, I've given you one, but IMO, "Likes" are often for superficial stuff which made a person smile and nod for a moment but which are then immediately forgotten. And they're not necessarily a good measure of the thought-provoking value of the topic.

 

[Ron Texas]

By reading your post, how to like a troll? The second-hand CD market is endless.

I'm not trolling and a second-hand market is hardly a measure of success. Just because you don't agree or don't like what someone says, that's not trolling when it's supported by facts. I did not intend to step on anyone's toes so stop being oversensitive.

 

[Ron Texas]

Alright, I've given you one, but IMO, "Likes" are often for superficial stuff which made a person smile and nod for a moment but which are then immediately forgotten. And they're not necessarily a good measure of the thought-provoking value of the topic.

Well, this provoked a lot of thought and some anger from CD lovers.

 

[Robin L]

Well, this provoked a lot of thought and some anger from CD lovers.

That "forever" part of "Perfect sound forever" guaranteed that CDs would lose value over time. While it's possible to destroy a CD, they turned out to be far more durable than LPs. LPs wear out and lots of people unwittingly play LPs on equipment that will quicky destroy them. So, LPs become more collectible over time because they wear out faster---the number of playable copies can only go down. Go figure. And the sound of the CD is exactly the same as a rip of high enough quality. Right now, I've got over a thousand CDs I don't play because playing the rips is easier. So, CDs, with their stingy cover art and easily broken/damaged jewel cases, are inherently less collectible than their LP counterparts. Modern LPs seem more collectible than CDs. As you know, a significant number of new LPs are never played.

 

[JeffS7444]

I know that some of you really like the algorithms used by streaming services which are used to determine additional programming that you might like based on previous choices, and which act as an automatic, endless playlist. But I am less enthusiastic: Maybe I'm just the oddball, but to me it often feels like I'm being fed a bunch of lookalike/soundalike content which becomes progressively less interesting, and I am sufficiently restless not to sit through it.

One difference that I enjoy with old-fashioned radio or non-interactive streaming services is how they can still deliver the element of surprise, because content cannot be tailored to the individual listener, and at some level, someone is still required to act as curator.

 

[JeffS7444]

My main dislike of CDs, DVDs/B-D/UHD has to do with the needless bulk of the packaging. But physical media provides a legal means for me to watch movies and listen to music not otherwise distributed in my region of the world. And while much bonus content included on movie disks is unremarkable, Criterion Collection disks would be a notable exception, and the quality and quantity of Criterion's extras can add considerable real value.

 

[storing]

Maybe I'm just the oddball, but to me it often feels like I'm being fed a bunch of lookalike/soundalike content which becomes progressively less interesting

Understandable. Haven't used any such service myself except for some short tries just for this reason. But on the other hand: I do often visit forums and other online groups, and in the end that is sort of the same principle. Especially communities related to specific genres aren't much better in that regard, being not much more than an echo chamber.

old-fashioned radio

Exactly. We have a local fairly alternative station and almost every non-mainstream genre gets played there. It exists for at least 3 decades already but it's still a breath of fresh air compared to other stations and as you say: full of surprises.

 

[Frgirard]

That "forever" part of "Perfect sound forever" guaranteed that CDs would lose value over time. While it's possible to destroy a CD, they turned out to be far more durable than LPs. LPs wear out and lots of people unwittingly play LPs on equipment that will quicky destroy them. So, LPs become more collectible over time because they wear out faster---the number of playable copies can only go down. Go figure. And the sound of the CD is exactly the same as a rip of high enough quality. Right now, I've got over a thousand CDs I don't play because playing the rips is easier. So, CDs, with their stingy cover art and easily broken/damaged jewel cases, are inherently less collectible than their LP counterparts. Modern LPs seem more collectible than CDs. As you know, a significant number of new LPs are never played.

The big collectors of lp digitize them.

 

[BinkieHuckerback]

Is there a FAX number to reply to this thread?

 

[EJ3]

I dont want to pay for a music streaming service. Enough of my money is going out for Netflix, Amazon Prime, etc. Its as simple as that.

I don't pay for any streaming (of course no streaming is available in most of where I stay. But I likely wouldn't pay for it if it was). The selection of what I listen to is at least 50% not available on streaming. I only listen to some stuff that is "popular" enough to make it worthwhile for them to stream.

 

[EJ3]

The big collectors of lp digitize them.

I don't buy for collectability, I buy for a combination of things that means I like the songs & the sound. And I play it. If it turns out that it is not something I play, off it goes to the record store used 9album, CD, DVD, whatever) bin.