Topping G5 Review (Portable DAC & HP Amp)

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

Either get the certification or stop luring iPhone users with lightning wires that only work for a single iOS cycle. If my G5 stops working on my phone, guess who I'm blaming..

Apple for creating an unnecessarily exploitive closed-walled environment?

Why should us non-Apple customers have to subsidize an MFI certification?

 

[Jimster480]

Apple for creating an unnecessarily exploitive closed-walled environment?

Why should us non-Apple customers have to subsidize an MFI certification?

True, its difficult for everyone. Either the company needs to make 2 versions (like MQA vs Non MQA) or everyone has to pay.

 

[Jimster480]

... speaking like a true fanboy. ASR is far from being 'the largest audio sites'. Maybe you vist the site 10 times every hour and it's big in your mind but look around, Darko, PS Audio, Andrew Robinson, Pursuit Perfect System, A British Audiophile, cheapaudioman, Jay, Hans and many, many others got way more subscribers than ASR.
ASR is a 'matter of fact' website so please don't spread false claims re how big it is.

I am only considering communities. Not garbage marketing sites like the ones you mentioned. I don't read reviews from marketing websites. Those sites don't have communities, just groveling comment sections (at best).

However this has nothing to do with the G5.

 

[Jimster480]

Their defensiveness is nearly palpable. Too bad they choose ridicule rather than understanding.



Then you certainly wouldn't want to be associated with the likes of us. This is clearly no place you'd want to be.

Especially since we have such a ****** "business model" of providing commentary for free and having a free community where people can donate.
I'm sure this site is a bad "business model" for @amirm since he invested probably 6 figures in all this testing equipment and gets paid $0 to do all this testing...

 

[Ken Tajalli]

This is not subject related, but absolute encouragement of the complaining member.

 

[NDRQ]

Aah , that is so sweet.
That you consider Chords seven year old, discontinued device as a reference to beat.
Chord, is humbled by your sentiment.

There is already a new version of the Mojo for much more money.

 

[Ken Tajalli]

There is already a new version of the Mojo for much more money.

You don't say!
is it for much more money?

 

[srkbear]

iOS does actually include a choice of EQ settings, including bass boost, but only for the Music app. No PEQ, though.

Yeah it does—doesn’t help for Qobuz or Tidal, but it works for the Apple Music store. I’ve never been quite sure what it does to the signal path in terms of resolution—whenever I add whatever form of EQ in the settings, the sound drops volume considerably, and to my ears sounds like it’s coming through a lead wall.

With Roon, they claim that their DSPs, including volume leveling, use algorithms that cause as little degradation to the original signal as possible—I think they have a technical white paper that explains the granular details of it, but I’ve mostly taken their word for it because I am very pleased with the results. In Apple’s case, not so much.

Regardless, I’m very pleased with my iFi-Gryphon. It has tons of power, true balanced headphone outputs, a very well-executed bass and presence boost, a working lightning OTG cable, a great digital GUI, a terrific form factor and build, and to me it sounds great. For an even more compact solution, I’ve also been very happy with my FiiO Q3, which also has a nice bass boost and a surfeit of power for my choice of cans.

I am glad to see that a FiiO portable recently got good appraisals on here, and I’m hoping for some of the newer iFi offerings to be put on Amir’s bench soon—they’ve recently cut the cord with their inviolable commitment to Burr Brown, and I’m still rooting for them despite their less-than-stellar assessments on this site.

In the past couple of years, brands like Topping, iFI, FiiO, Gustard and others have started producing some very well-made and noteworthy “audiophile” offerings that are honestly and accessibly priced. I’m determined to support such brands that demonstrate that digital audio has reached a technological age where mass-produced, extraordinary-sounding high resolution audio shouldn’t require significant expense, and should be achievable on any budget. It’s time for “premium” brands such as dCS, Chord, NAIM and PS Audio to be exposed for their felonious claims and disingenuous pricing practices.

 

[srkbear]

Apple for creating an unnecessarily exploitive closed-walled environment?

Why should us non-Apple customers have to subsidize an MFI certification?

We all pay for any number of licensing fees to listen to music—from mastering rights to codecs to the choice of DAC chips and other proprietary hardware components. And Google is hardly exempt from such practices—Android licensing fees are astronomical.

I think Apple’s MFI certification costs somewhere in the neighborhood of 4 bucks per unit—you’re surely right that it’s a ripoff, but for the portable market, manufacturers wouldn’t survive if they didn’t attempt to make their products as democratically compatible with as many phone platforms as possible—and that’s primarily what market these DAC/amps are being paired with.

I haven’t seen the numbers—perhaps Amir or others on this site have access to some unpublished info from these manufacturers—but I wouldn’t be surprised if licensing fees in general contribute a sizable dollar amount to every audio component we buy on the market. How should we decide whose technology is prioritized and what market segment gets short shrifted?

 

[staticV3]

How should we decide whose technology is prioritized

Let me try:
Prioritize standards like UAC2, Power Delivery, DisplayPort, AV1, FLAC that mainly aim to improve UX
Deprioritize standards like MFi, MQA, HDMI that mainly aim to collect royalties

 

[Rottmannash]

Yeah it does—doesn’t help for Qobuz or Tidal, but it works for the Apple Music store. I’ve never been quite sure what it does to the signal path in terms of resolution—whenever I add whatever form of EQ in the settings, the sound drops volume considerably, and to my ears sounds like it’s coming through a lead wall.

With Roon, they claim that their DSPs, including volume leveling, use algorithms that cause as little degradation to the original signal as possible—I think they have a technical white paper that explains the granular details of it, but I’ve mostly taken their word for it because I am very pleased with the results. In Apple’s case, not so much.

Regardless, I’m very pleased with my iFi-Gryphon. It has tons of power, true balanced headphone outputs, a very well-executed bass and presence boost, a working lightning OTG cable, a great digital GUI, a terrific form factor and build, and to me it sounds great. For an even more compact solution, I’ve also been very happy with my FiiO Q3, which also has a nice bass boost and a surfeit of power for my choice of cans.

I am glad to see that a FiiO portable recently got good appraisals on here, and I’m hoping for some of the newer iFi offerings to be put on Amir’s bench soon—they’ve recently cut the cord with their inviolable commitment to Burr Brown, and I’m still rooting for them despite their less-than-stellar assessments on this site.

In the past couple of years, brands like Topping, iFI, FiiO, Gustard and others have started producing some very well-made and noteworthy “audiophile” offerings that are honestly and accessibly priced. I’m determined to support such brands that demonstrate that digital audio has reached a technological age where mass-produced, extraordinary-sounding high resolution audio shouldn’t require significant expense, and should be achievable on any budget. It’s time for “premium” brands such as dCS, Chord, NAIM and PS Audio to be exposed for their felonious claims and disingenuous pricing practices.

memo to self-must use the word "surfeit" in a sentence every day.

 

[srkbear]

memo to self-must use the word "surfeit" in a sentence every day.

Sorry boss, once an English major, always an English major—it’s a permanent curse

 

[srkbear]

Let me try:
Prioritize standards like UAC2, Power Delivery, DisplayPort, AV1, FLAC that mainly aim to improve UX
Deprioritize standards like MFi, MQA, HDMI that mainly aim to collect royalties

You have my full agreement. If I could have that world and not have to use a phone that was incompatible with my work IT infrastructure, I’d try to avoid products that eschew licensing fees! I’d also love to ditch Tidal altogether—if only in many instances they didn’t have access to better quality masters than other streaming services. But we live in a free market society—with choice comes compromise. How exactly do you want me to prioritize and deprioritize the assets you mention above? I’m hardly in control of such things.

Honestly, I don’t mind paying an extra $4 for a solution compatible with my phone, just as I don’t mind paying whatever fees are incurred by Google’s Android platform—even as much as I revile their draconian third party advertising practices and assaults on the privacy of its users. It sure beats paying Chord an extra $13,750 just to say I own the hallowed DAVE…

 

[tomli747]

If it's not MFI certified by Apple, it's simply not compatible with the iPhone regardless of the cable used.

Even if it works for now, future iOS updates can and will render the G5 useless.

Incorrect. The Apple Camera kit should support USB DAC, but it is quite bulky for portable use.

 

[srkbear]

Incorrect. The Apple Camera kit should support USB DAC, but it is quite bulky for portable use.

I tried it actually, with two other portables that have lightning cables in the box—a FiiO Q3 and an iFi xDSD Gryphon—and neither worked with the data connector on these devices. I even verified that my CCK was on the latest firmware. Both of these worked fine with their included lightning OTG cables, but when I tried to connect them via the CCK accessory I got a “device not compatible” error. This was with both the powered and unpowered CCK.

I don’t know if the same issue would occur with this Topping unit, but although I never had a problem using the CCK with older devices, either it is no longer compatible with the latest iOS versions, or there’s something different about the data ports for devices that have included lightning port cable accessories. Anyone else have any hypotheses about this?

 

[Jimster480]

We all pay for any number of licensing fees to listen to music—from mastering rights to codecs to the choice of DAC chips and other proprietary hardware components. And Google is hardly exempt from such practices—Android licensing fees are astronomical.

I think Apple’s MFI certification costs somewhere in the neighborhood of 4 bucks per unit—you’re surely right that it’s a ripoff, but for the portable market, manufacturers wouldn’t survive if they didn’t attempt to make their products as democratically compatible with as many phone platforms as possible—and that’s primarily what market these DAC/amps are being paired with.

I haven’t seen the numbers—perhaps Amir or others on this site have access to some unpublished info from these manufacturers—but I wouldn’t be surprised if licensing fees in general contribute a sizable dollar amount to every audio component we buy on the market. How should we decide whose technology is prioritized and what market segment gets short shrifted?

Android is free, there are no licensing fees.

You have my full agreement. If I could have that world and not have to use a phone that was incompatible with my work IT infrastructure, I’d try to avoid products that eschew licensing fees! I’d also love to ditch Tidal altogether—if only in many instances they didn’t have access to better quality masters than other streaming services. But we live in a free market society—with choice comes compromise. How exactly do you want me to prioritize and deprioritize the assets you mention above? I’m hardly in control of such things.

Honestly, I don’t mind paying an extra $4 for a solution compatible with my phone, just as I don’t mind paying whatever fees are incurred by Google’s Android platform—even as much as I revile their draconian third party advertising practices and assaults on the privacy of its users. It sure beats paying Chord an extra $13,750 just to say I own the hallowed DAVE…

Apple has actually much more atrocious practices and assaults on the privacy of its users. It just lies to you about what it is doing and pretends like it is a company that gives a crap about its users. Actions speak louder than words though and as such; everything they have done in the last decade shows that they only care to screw their customers, sell them out in every day and make every literal penny they can while doing it.
When it comes to something like the G5; there is no reason that anyone wants to pay for apple's dead standard. They shouldn't be allowed to have it, but people keep buying their shoddy locked down products.
Therefore you cant enjoy nice things because you chose to use apple. That is the price you pay for purchasing garbage. Nobody else should be forced to pay a single cent for your bad decision. (By Your, I am not referring specifically to YOU but just anyone who owns Apple products in general).

 

[srkbear]

Android is free, there are no licensing fees.

Apple has actually much more atrocious practices and assaults on the privacy of its users. It just lies to you about what it is doing and pretends like it is a company that gives a crap about its users. Actions speak louder than words though and as such; everything they have done in the last decade shows that they only care to screw their customers, sell them out in every day and make every literal penny they can while doing it.
When it comes to something like the G5; there is no reason that anyone wants to pay for apple's dead standard. They shouldn't be allowed to have it, but people keep buying their shoddy locked down products.
Therefore you cant enjoy nice things because you chose to use apple. That is the price you pay for purchasing garbage. Nobody else should be forced to pay a single cent for your bad decision. (By Your, I am not referring specifically to YOU but just anyone who owns Apple products in general).

OK I get it, you don’t like Apple. I don’t have the time to verify all your claims, but I use Apple because my work infrastructure uses Apple, and unapologetically, I enjoy my devices. I have no problems with any of the issues you have raised. I’m not alone, and it’s a bit tiresome to hear this argument that my preferences are the result of some moral weakness or intellectual vacuity. I think Android is a preposterously clumsy ecosystem, but I don’t think you’re a pinhead for using it.

 

[Madlop26]

Android is free, there are no licensing fees.

Apple has actually much more atrocious practices and assaults on the privacy of its users. It just lies to you about what it is doing and pretends like it is a company that gives a crap about its users. Actions speak louder than words though and as such; everything they have done in the last decade shows that they only care to screw their customers, sell them out in every day and make every literal penny they can while doing it.
When it comes to something like the G5; there is no reason that anyone wants to pay for apple's dead standard. They shouldn't be allowed to have it, but people keep buying their shoddy locked down products.
Therefore you cant enjoy nice things because you chose to use apple. That is the price you pay for purchasing garbage. Nobody else should be forced to pay a single cent for your bad decision. (By Your, I am not referring specifically to YOU but just anyone who owns Apple products in general).

lol, well is hard to believe a company that "gives a crap about its users" can get to the level Apple is right now, you can fool people, but not forever. I use Apple and android cells , if i have to choose, I would go for apple anytime, usability and reliability are the kings even above versatility in my priorities, and I suspect also in millions. You are falling in a cognitive bias, if a brand is not good for you does not mean it will not be quiet good for others. Perspective my friend perspective.

 

[Jimster480]

lol, well is hard to believe a company that "gives a crap about its users" can get to the level Apple is right now, you can fool people, but not forever. I use Apple and android cells , if i have to choose, I would go for apple anytime, usability and reliability are the kings even above versatility in my priorities, and I suspect also in millions. You are falling in a cognitive bias, if a brand is not good for you does not mean it will not be quiet good for others. Perspective my friend perspective.

Yep you are right. Apple is inferior in usability, inferior in features, inferior in stability, inferior in software quality, inferior in hardware quality, inferior in repair-ability (unless you have an oldschool model upto like iPhone 8).
Apple is the most exploited, has had the most security holes uncovered, has lost the most customer data, had the most hardware scandals... and yet people continue to buy their garbage and actually pretend like they give a crap about their users. They are making their phones harder and harder to repair, integrating their circuits through backroom deals so that there is no way to obtain parts to repair your devices and locking down the OS from their own hardware chips so you can only run their approved software.
iOS overall is extremely unfriendly to use; here in 2022 it doesn't even have a proper file system. It doesn't allow any kind of file to be stored and accessed easily, it doesn't work with external devices unless they have "certifications". Hell they don't even have expandable storage or secondary browser capabilities... All browsers use their garbage safari engine which they have total control over.

Literally nothing about apple is good in any sense of the word. Everything about their cheap shoddily made sweat shop Indian and Chinese (they don't even hire upstanding good wage factories with actual ethical practices unlike most Chinese companies do) made garbage is exactly what it sounds like. Overpriced scams to rake unsuspecting people of their cash, just like their little lightning certification scam.

So nobody should ever pay a single cent for that certification and I for one specifically only purchase products that DON'T have lightning certification so I don't donate money to a company that chose to use neurotoxins in its factories for product assembly because they could save a few cents per device vs clean chemicals.

 

[Labjr]

Apple now has their own spyware to search for whatever they deem are illegal files. So they have allowed a back door to pander to every government. Their security claims are a lie.