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Purifi: which of these 2 cases is better?

sbergert

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Hi everyone,

I want to get a Purifi - Amp and want to buy it from Audiophonics, the cheapest option for me (I‘m from northern Germany).

They have 2 case designs, one larger and one smaller. The larger one has a trigger, and off-course more space inside, costs 150 USD more. The internal setup is otherwise the same (power supply, modules,…).

I have no idea about electronics, interference, DIY etc, but I could imagine that it might be worse in the more crowded space inside of the small case? Or does it make no difference?

They don‘t offer the ASR -tested version but have a board with OP-amps … luckily they state I can select a bypass mode…would this correspond to the ASR -tested version then (with „no gain“ - performance)?

Thanks for some input,
Best regards,
Joe
 

RickSanchez

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You may want to check out this thread:

The OP (@Buckeye Amps) is a U.S.-based amp designer / builder, and that thread is specifically about a Purifi build. He might have some good insights for you.
 

Rja4000

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Hi everyone,

I want to get a Purifi - Amp and want to buy it from Audiophonics, the cheapest option for me (I‘m from northern Germany).

They have 2 case designs, one larger and one smaller. The larger one has a trigger, and off-course more space inside, costs 150 USD more. The internal setup is otherwise the same (power supply, modules,…).

I have no idea about electronics, interference, DIY etc, but I could imagine that it might be worse in the more crowded space inside of the small case? Or does it make no difference?

They don‘t offer the ASR -tested version but have a board with OP-amps … luckily they state I can select a bypass mode…would this correspond to the ASR -tested version then (with „no gain“ - performance)?

Thanks for some input,
Best regards,
Joe
That's all good questions.
I guess we need to send both to @amirm for proper testing...
 
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sbergert

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For me it would be sufficient if somebody here who is a DIY-guy could offer his opinion, if shielding is a big problem with a smaller case (or if the current or voltage is not big enough or not affecting anything audible)
 
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sbergert

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Sparkos, wide case 1890€

Audiophonics Interface Board : Sparkos Labs OPA & Regulators​

The two modules are driven in opposite phase, to cancel the "Power Supply Pumping" effect. This allows a greater stability of the power supply, distributing alternately on each rail the current calls, and thus increasing its capacities.

We opted for a two-level voltage regulation to optimize the power supply to the PDUs and the auxiliary voltage supplied to the modules. In this Sparkos Edition, no less than four Sparkos Labs SS7915 and SS7815 discrete voltage regulators are used. These easily outperform all monolithic TO-220 format regulators in terms of output noise, transient response and load regulation.

Two Sparkos Labs SS3602 dual discrete PDUs are also used. These Sparkos PDUs are more efficient than the LM4562s of the standard HPA-S400ET and offer lower noise and higher output current with Class A bias. The PDUs are mounted on a DIP8 socket, allowing replacement if necessary.

To suit all uses, we have opted for three gain settings, switchable by jumper on the interface board:

  • Gain of +7.2dB, i.e. a total of 20dB - Max power reached with a signal of ~4.2V RMS
  • Gain of +12.5dB, that is to say a total of 25.3dB (by default) - Max power reached with a signal of ~2.25V RMS.
  • Bypass : In this case, the signal goes directly from the inputs to the modules, allowing the lowest possible gain of 12.8dB. This mode can be interesting when using a vigorous preamplifier, capable of driving a 2 to 4kΩ load and reaching a voltage of ~10V RMS.

or Wide case HPA 1490€

Audiophonics Interface Card​

Both modules are driven in opposite phase, to cancel out the «Power-Supply Pumping» effect. This allows greater stability in the power supply by alternately distributing current draws on each rail, thus increasing its overall capacities.

We opted for a two stage voltage regulation in order to optimize the power supply to the OPAs and the auxiliary voltage supplied to the modules.

A Texas Instrument LM4562 OPA per channel is used, these are very low distortion AOPs offering the greatest transparency with a very low THD. They are mounted on socket allowing their replacement if necessary

To suit all uses we opted for 3 gain settings, adjustable by jumper on the interface card:

  • Gain of + 7.2dB, for a total of 20dB - Maximum power reached with a signal of ~ 4.2V RMS
  • Gain of + 12.5dB, for a total of 25.3dB (default) - Maximum power reached with a signal of ~ 2.2V RMS
  • Bypass: in this case the signal passes directly from the inputs to the modules, allowing the lowest possible gain of 12.8dB. This mode can be interesting when using a powerful preamplifier, capable of driving a load of 2 to 4kOhm and reaching a voltage of ~ 10V RMS
or narrow case LPA with same Audiophonics interphase 1389€


Audiophonics has also 3- and 4-channel versions with their own interface
Thread of HPA https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ophonics-hpa-s400et-class-d-purifi-amp.11887/

ATM sells buffer with different OPAS, and Sparkos has least distortion... (Audiophonics is not tested)

Hi Juhazi

Why did you post all this? This is in no way related to my question (different case size gives problems: elec. interference / heat / etc … yes or no)
 

phoenixdogfan

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VTV does offer a version of the Purifi identical to the one Amir tested for $1139 which is also the cheapest price on the market. It's also possibly the best b/c the version Amir tested had the best performance. Those versions with the "improved" interface board/premium opamp all seem to test a little poorer in addition to adding a large premium to the price. The VTV comes with speakon connectors and a 12v trigger. It uses the Ghent case which is perfectly fine though not a super fancy showpiece. I assembled mine from parts and the VTV is cheaper and gives you someone to go to if it does not play when you plug it in. As someone who went the diy route, and who had the thing not play,I can tell you having an OEM manufacturer to turn to is worth its weight in gold--particularly if you're paying less for the complete unit than you would pay for the separate parts if you assembled it yourself.
 
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sbergert

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Maybe I should emphasize my original question:
…They have 2 case designs, one larger and one smaller. The larger one has a trigger, and off-course more space inside, costs 150 USD more. The internal setup is otherwise the same (power supply, modules,…).

I have no idea about electronics, interference, DIY etc, but I could imagine that it might be worse in the more crowded space inside of the small case? Or does it make no difference?


And:

Is the bypass-option bypassing OP-amps (like sparks, sonic, weiss etc) and offering a no-pre-gain output like in Amir’s measurements?


Somehow I‘m getting recommendations for VTV, complete cooy&paste of audiophonics product-features, requests for stuff being sent to Amir for measurements.

I really appreciate replies and don‘t want to sound harsh, I just don’t want to start other topics on the Purifi which exist already here in the forums again. I just want somebody with electrical knowledge, maybe a DIY-person, to tell me, if interference or other nasty stuff might be expected in this half-size case for the Purifi. And, what bypass actually bypasses :)


@phoenixdogfan:
I know VTV offers that unit, but there were some posts here that some wiring was wrong / incorrect and some safety related issues as well - that’s why I considered the audiophonics.

Also, 1139 USD does not really have to be the cheapest option, it depends on import taxes and shipping costs (that’s why I wrote „ the cheapest option for me (I‘m from northern Germany).“ in my original post).
 

shal

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In the audiophonics description :
" Similar electronically to the HPA-S400ET, this version is mounted in a more compact box making it easier to use in an environment where space is limited, its architecture also limits the length of the internal connections."

So if you have place , take the big one (better for thermal control)
 

phoenixdogfan

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Maybe I should emphasize my original question:
…They have 2 case designs, one larger and one smaller. The larger one has a trigger, and off-course more space inside, costs 150 USD more. The internal setup is otherwise the same (power supply, modules,…).

I have no idea about electronics, interference, DIY etc, but I could imagine that it might be worse in the more crowded space inside of the small case? Or does it make no difference?


And:

Is the bypass-option bypassing OP-amps (like sparks, sonic, weiss etc) and offering a no-pre-gain output like in Amir’s measurements?


Somehow I‘m getting recommendations for VTV, complete cooy&paste of audiophonics product-features, requests for stuff being sent to Amir for measurements.

I really appreciate replies and don‘t want to sound harsh, I just don’t want to start other topics on the Purifi which exist already here in the forums again. I just want somebody with electrical knowledge, maybe a DIY-person, to tell me, if interference or other nasty stuff might be expected in this half-size case for the Purifi. And, what bypass actually bypasses :)


@phoenixdogfan:
I know VTV offers that unit, but there were some posts here that some wiring was wrong / incorrect and some safety related issues as well - that’s why I considered the audiophonics.

Also, 1139 USD does not really have to be the cheapest option, it depends on import taxes and shipping costs (that’s why I wrote „ the cheapest option for me (I‘m from northern Germany).“ in my original post).
The wiring is the easiest fix in the world. Just order a set of wires from Ghent for around $39, and take the SMPS, unscrew it from the case, turn it 180 degrees so the heat shield faces the case front and rewire with the Ghent wires. The reason to do this is to obtain the shortest signal path which will add a few do of S/M ratio (possibly) b/c the wiring is correct just seems awkward to some of the perfectionists on this site (me included). Will take you five minutes.

As for the case, the VTV case is perfectly fine. It looks very good and is more than adequate for heat sinking and ventilation, and, above all, grounding--so it's safe, very safe. I know this b/c I have one for my Purifi.

If I were you I would at least look into the VTS's costs. I'll bet it's very competitive with anything you could buy from the EU, and probably a better performer as well.

Don't know what the import taxes are, but I'd bet the VTV will be competitively priced with anything you could source from the EU, and a better performer as well.
 
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sbergert

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@shal
Well, limited length of internal connections sounds to me like a „pro“-argument (not so long wirings) ‍ ?

Thermal stability was really not my concern, I just listen for max 30 minutes and then let everything cool down. Electrical interference is more what I might expect when everything is assembled closer together, but I am not an expert, so that’s why I‘m asking the knowledge-guys here ;)

@ Phoenixdogfan
VTV: 1089 USD + 125 USD shipping
+19% tax 230 USD +2% customs handling 29 USD + ~ 7 USD DHL customs processing (UPS and FedEx is even more)

= 1480 USD (1300 Euro) plus possible credit card fees for foreign currencies

The audiophonics - small case-size - costs 1350€ with the advantage of easy replacement / handling on warranty issues.

I really thank you again for recommending your VTV, but I looked at all the VTV options more than a week ago, there are a lot of topics here mentioning it (I used the search function).

Primarily I‘m more interested in getting answers to my questions though.


Maybe I should edit my first post and remove every Purifi mentioning there and just insert the interior pictures of the cases?
 

My adventures in stereo

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I have the monobloc version of the Audiophonics Purifi, it comes in a small case
2 cases as I have monoblocs
They run cool, even at peak load
I have them sitting in a well ventilated rack & currently on my desktop

Hope that is helpful
 
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sbergert

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Hi :)
Thermal issues are not really my concern, but do you have a photo of the inside of your monoblocs? Are the modules quite „crowded“ inside and is there lots of electromagnetic interference? Or is there shielding between the power module and the Purifi modules?
 

My adventures in stereo

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I had opened them up to adjust the gain settings, felt well put together
I have observed no hiss, ears to the speakers
 

My adventures in stereo

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sbergert

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Looks like way more space than in the small case of audiophonics Purifi setup

Small case-size:
 

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Axel Endriss

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Hi Sbergert, because I'm thinking about these two options: Have you bought one of them and if so are you satisfied? Regards Axel
 
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