KZ ZVX - Possibly a revision - Opinions

[OK1]

Thought it good to start a thread, to discuss just one IEM the KZ ZVX. Single DD.

I ordered and received mine 2 days ago. Not opened it to see the internals. Most likely will NOT. With some EQ, best most detailed IEM I have at this time. Very comfortable. One thing I'd like to know - is this an open back or semi open design. I see some grills which are common to all versions of the KZ ZVX. BUt have no clue, are these merely decorative, or they have an active function.

The bass does not sound like a closed back design, like the CCA CRA 2023 revision.

 

[OK1]

https://www.reddit.com/r/iems/comments/1d1vzoa/kz_zvx_has_a_different_driver

Found this (link above) ve which shows KZ has done it again. Changed the design mid stream. One account is obviously not conclusive. Would be interested in collating other opinions.

That's the second KZ IEM I have bought, without being aware that there may have been a revision, along the product cycle. For it to happen once, with the CCA CRA, was a shock to me, and then again on the ZVX, is discomforting. I thought I had done ample research before choosing the ZVX, but apparently NOT. If this revision pans out to be true, it is disappointing. The real issue is - when I look at the graphs that have been made by others, or when I read reviews, I have no clue if what I read or hear from Youtube reviews, has any bearing on my copy of the KZ ZVX. Pretty $issed off about this discovery.

I went through an experience where I bought 3 different Samsung dongles, and all three were fake. Question in my mind - are other suppliers now faking KZ IEMs or it's KZ themselves doing these things. Not sure anymore what I'm listening to with KZ IEMs. Thought I had arrived at an IEM I could keep for a while, before thinking of another purchase, now that hope is dashed.

 

[markanini]

KZ are well known for silent revisions so don't be surprised. I heard Castor bass edition shares some internals with Vader and/or Trio now and measure virtually the same. There are reasons why I don't recommend this brand. Fake Samsung dongles that's new to me. I've heard about Apple dongles being plagued with fakes, even when you order from some large retailers. I haven't heard of any CX31993 dongle fake so far, it's my go-to recommendation for moderately sensitive IEMs.

 

[OK1]

KZ are well known for silent revisions so don't be surprised. I heard Castor bass edition shares some internals with Vader and/or Trio now and measure virtually the same. There are reasons why I don't recommend this brand. Fake Samsung dongles that's new to me. I've heard about Apple dongles being plagued with fakes, even when you order from some large retailers. I haven't heard of any CX31993 dongle fake so far, it's my go-to recommendation for moderately sensitive IEMs.
View attachment 380489

I made the effort to document my recent horrific experience with 3 separate attempts to purchase a Samsung dongle. All bought from reputable stores in the United Kingdom.

Well intentioned reviews VS the real world with product revisions and substitutes(aka fakes) - Samsung Dongle version X?

This is specifically about the Samsung USB-C to 3.5mm DAC/Dongle. I bought this item three times Why did I want a Samsung dongle. It had been reviewed favorably on both the ASR and Julian Krause's Youtube website. Two credible sources. I'm about to listen to what the 3rd incarnation of this...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[markanini]

Rest assured it gets better once you can identify brands and retailers that are trustworthy. Most of the time someone found out before you and shared this valuable information on the internet. Reviews are definitely time capsules

 

[OK1]

Rest assured it gets better once you can identify brands and retailers that are trustworthy. Most of the time someone found out before you and shared this valuable information on the internet. Reviews are definitely time capsules

Thankfully I have not yet too much on this. If I add the fake Samsung dongles and the revised KZ/CCA that I was not aware of prior to purchase, it's now about $50 to $60 in total. Not negligible, but it's beginning to add up. I think I got a refund on the 1st fake Samsung dongle, so that brings the total down to about $50, so far.

It is a bit of a shock, cos in the professional audio world, such fakes are a bit rare (well except for fake Shure SM58's and SM57's). It is the human in us, diesel gate - yeah top German car makers got in on the act too, fake Extra Virgin Olive Oil., designer clothes/bags/sports team shirts, even right here in the supposedly protected consumer market in the UK, it happens in certain products, and it is impossible to curb. Social engineering, we wanting something for very little. The issue with KZ is these are not counterfeits, but deliberate product changes.

It explains the temptation, the low cost, which was a major factor in the purchase of the CCA CRA, and the KX ZVX. Albeit the ZVX, was largely based on quite a bit of research. But I did not check for revisions, in my research.

It does hurt, but I'll recover. It does make me 2nd guess - what exactly am I listening to, cos I cannot relate what I am hearing, to any reviews, nor to any measured frequency responses, of these models. Guess it's all part of the learning curve. On dongles I am very satisfied with the TempoTec Sonata BHD. The CX I have - I do not think it's fake, cos it registers with the right driver name, behaves ok, is stable, and the microphone works fine. Just has a different sound from the TempoTec Sonata BHD - the CX being a definitely brighter sound, with less low end, in comparison, more sibilance, definitely clear, no noises, but best to take off any IEMS 1st to avoid the static sound on insertion and removal of IEMS, which does not occur on the BHD. In a way it is good to have these experiences. We learn.

I like some things about the CX sound., it's not a bad sound just different. Hard to sometimes compare these things, cos where there are Frequency Response differences, it becomes hard to do a proper loudness matching, cos at best even with a measuring tool, you'll only match at a specific frequency !

I'll most likely take a much longer period of slow research, to find a replacement for the KZ ZVX. This time no hurry, and lots of thinking before I buy anything else.

On the bright side, better that I discovered my error on the ZVX so soon after the purchase, rather than find out only after months of listening.!

Thank you for all your help and advice.

 

[OK1]

Looks like there is a pattern. As soon as a KZ/CCA product becomes popular and begins to sell well, they dumb it down and cripple it, to apparently lower the cost, and improve their profits.

It has happened to at least three products that I am aware of.

1. CCA CRA
2. KZ ZVX
3. KZ PR2 - this one I knew about and avoided, cos I was aware of the revision.

So maybe, its best to avoid the highly acclaimed or best selling KZ/CCA products, unless you but them early in the product lifecycle, before they get "greedy", and modify the product.

I wonder which other KZ/CCA products have had silent revisions?

 

[muza_1]

I read the Castor Bass was retuned but this time was for the better.

 

[OK1]

I read the Castor Bass was retuned but this time was for the better.

Not another revision !!.

Please if you have a link to the source of this information, please post here.. Even if it was improved, it introduces a dilemma. Which version of all those lovely frequency graphs will we believe?,

KZ/CCA already bombards us with at least 10 new IEM's per year.

Model Zombie - which is revised to
Model Zombie Pro
Model Zombie Pro X
Model Zombie Pro 2

Sometimes you also get a

Model Zombie Plus version.

Would it not be nice if they just for honesty sake added a

Model Zombie v 2 and
Model Zombie v 3

Or if it was one of the other updated products, we can have something like a - Model Zombie Pro X v 2.

What are they running away from :

1. The cost of changing their publicity/marketing material - it can't be that hard in today's world, where all of this is in electronic format
2. The cost of sending out these new versions to reviewers, to review again?

It has been a while since I heard of a business in the audio world that so deliberately shoots itself in the foot, like KZ/CCA. No need for this cloak and dagger behaviour.

 

[OK1]

I read the Castor Bass was retuned but this time was for the better.

And thank you for sharing this info with me.

From what I can see, the trend is clear - igh once the product is well received, and is selling well - they tweak it for whatever reason. Typically I suspect, to make more profit.

If they simply restored trust in their brand, they would make more money. And they do not have to cut prices so low. We'd all be ready to pay $5 to $10 more, for a product we can trust.

The sonics of whatever version of KZ ZVX I have is not bad, but unless i have my own measuring tools, I cannot tune it, cos I do not know what frequency to tune. If the product were the OG, not messed around with changes, I could trust the measured frequency responses on Squig links, but in my case, I cannot.

Wondering - how much would it cost to get a good measuring rig. I already have some very good audio interfaces, with very high quality ins and outs. I have some experience with measuring speakers in my room, using a measurement microphone.

Come to think of it, with a measurement rig, maybe I also could become a Youtuber or online reviewer, and spew out some esteemed wisdom, every so often !!!

 

[muza_1]

Please if you have a link to the source of this information, please post here.. Even if it was improved, it introduces a dilemma. Which version of all those lovely frequency graphs will we believe?,

I don't have a link but I read it on the KZ thread on Head-Fi around two or three weeks ago, there was a graph too showing a more tamed high-end.

I read of other brands doing the same (and viewed the graphs) and some times with IEM multiple times the price of KZ, I read from a reviewer (also on Head-Fi) of some brand changing a well known BA driver for generic one on a $500+ IEM (there were measurements) but I don't believe every thing I read even with measurements. The report on the ZVX was only one person with no corroboration, there were some measurements but they look almost exactly like the ones in KZ promo materials for both of the IEMs involved (also the ZVX was marked as "New Product" even when is a year old and the description of the driver in question apply to both IEMs so it might be some kind of vague "announcement" for people to know the change).

Sorry I don't save or even bookmark the posts.

On a side note I got both the D-Fi (no switch) and ZVX at the same time from AliExpress and although the measurements look similar the ZVX is more bassy and a bit darker than the D-Fi (even the EDX PRO X has the same amount of bass and more treble), and I didn't want to order the EDX PRO X just to check. So I really don't know anymore.

This is the only one I found taken by the same reviewer.

 

[OK1]

I have to be honest, whatever they did with the revised ZVX, is disingenuous, and untrustworthy, but and a big but, these are very highly resolving headphones. They are the best things I have ever listened to. They can be a bit bright, but that's something that can be tweaked to personal taste via EQ.

On the positive side, they for the most part, deliver what is in the music, especially in the mids and highs. Crystal clear, and the distortion, in my subjective opinion, must be low. in the mids and highs. The spinfits eartips that came with them are not the most airtight, so maybe the bass does suffer a bit, if one is used to more bass, e.g like what I experienced on the CCA CRA revision. But whatever bass is on the ZVX is accurate, if a bit on the tame side - volume wise. This ZVX is a detail monster, and I have never heard high frequencies (when they are present in the recording) so pin sharp before.

And on one listening session, I realised I had turned off my custom EQ, it still sounded incredibly good. I think that the most important issue with the frequency response are the frequency response of the base product - drivers, shell, nozzle. etc. Then the tips, and insertion depth. It is impossible to know how each listener or reviewer sets insertion depth, so we are never all going to be listening to the same result. I find making minor adjustments to insertion depth probably the most important tweak, to dialing in a good result. EQ, is then icing on the cake.

Unfortunately its impossible to exactly duplicate insertion depth, from one listening session to another, and even while listening, yawning, having a drink or eating, the insertion depth will change just a bit., cos of micro changes in the position thereof, deeper into or out of the ear canal.

What I like about the spinfit tips, is even the large ones, fits, without applying too much pressure and pain, and one can forget about the earpieces. I fell asleep for the 1st time with these in my ears, and they were comfortable to go to bed with them in my ear, not that I would want to make this a habit.

 

[OK1]

I am, in spite of whatever KZ may or may not have done, had the best listening experience ever on a headphone/IEM with the KZ ZVX + a bit of my custom EQ. It makes me want to listen to everything I have ever heard, again. When one has the time, or while doing other things, can listen for hours. No fatigue (my EQ correction takes care of the minor fatigue that the Unequalized version delivers).

I would recommend the ZVX revision as a decent starting point for anyone testing the IEM market. Yes without EQ it's a tad bright. May not suit everyone. But with EQ - perfect, and very very good value for money.

And you want to listen to every album - over and over and over again. That is something I have not felt for a while. There was a period where I was quite jaded about a lot of music, but these ZVX's make me want to hear everything, very engaging and revealing, able to easily hear into the music, if it has been well recorded/mixed/mastered. The volume control is our friend, every track needs its own slight adjustment to level, to bring the volume to an optimal level for that song. Even on the same album, from track to track, level adjustments as small as 0.4dB can make a significant difference to how I hear a track. It's "opened" up my listening. Brought the musicians, so much closer, heightened the emotional transfer I get from a music piece. Awesome listening tool.

 

[phoenixsong]

Looks like there is a pattern. As soon as a KZ/CCA product becomes popular and begins to sell well, they dumb it down and cripple it, to apparently lower the cost, and improve their profits.

It has happened to at least three products that I am aware of.

1. CCA CRA
2. KZ ZVX
3. KZ PR2 - this one I knew about and avoided, cos I was aware of the revision.

So maybe, its best to avoid the highly acclaimed or best selling KZ/CCA products, unless you but them early in the product lifecycle, before they get "greedy", and modify the product.

I wonder which other KZ/CCA products have had silent revisions?

Not KZ or CCA but throw in the QKZ VK4 as well. I forgot if it was Joker or Crinacle or someone else (a renowned and respected reviewer it was) who gave that iem a very positive review for its price, only for horrified users to find out later that they have been receiving something wholly different from what was expected. In that case however, it was apparently a silent "official update" done by QKZ so... Never again did I look toward that brand/company. Same thing about TRN in the past and their "16 core" cables which did not have all 16 properly soldered to a connection

 

[OK1]

Not KZ or CCA but throw in the QKZ VK4 as well. I forgot if it was Joker or Crinacle or someone else (a renowned and respected reviewer it was) who gave that iem a very positive review for its price, only for horrified users to find out later that they have been receiving something wholly different from what was expected. In that case however, it was apparently a silent "official update" done by QKZ so... Never again did I look toward that brand/company. Same thing about TRN in the past and their "16 core" cables which did not have all 16 properly soldered to a connection

Wow. I had a problem with my KZ ZVX, the IEM developed an imbalance, where one earpiece was louder than the other, so it's no longer in use. Some of us are easily taken in by the lower cost of many of the KZ/CCA products.

I've since moved almost all my listening to an ARTTI T10 IEM, which is planar magnetic, and sounds so much better than any other of the KZ/CCA IEM's. It does have a slight imbalance with one earpiece a bit louder than the other, but this seems to be an issue with planar magnetics, due to difficulty with consistent manufacture of planar magnetics.

For mobile listening, I use the CCA CRA (2023 Edition) which sounds OK, for non critical listening - e.g listening to Youtube interviews.

 

[phoenixsong]

Wow. I had a problem with my KZ ZVX, the IEM developed an imbalance, where one earpiece was louder than the other, so it's no longer in use. Some of us are easily taken in by the lower cost of many of the KZ/CCA products.

I've since moved almost all my listening to an ARTTI T10 IEM, which is planar magnetic, and sounds so much better than any other of the KZ/CCA IEM's. It does have a slight imbalance with one earpiece a bit louder than the other, but this seems to be an issue with planar magnetics, due to difficulty with consistent manufacture of planar magnetics.

For mobile listening, I use the CCA CRA (2023 Edition) which sounds OK, for non critical listening - e.g listening to Youtube interviews.

Something to note that may or may not be unrealated- iems with filters in the nozzles frequently develop imbalance over time, *regardless of cost or quality. I've had a few encounter this. Just replace the filters if they come with replacements (Moondrop Aria/Tripowin Olina and similar) or take the filters out, wash them, and pop them back right in (7Hz x Crinacle Salnotes Zero 2 and similar)
*Added

 

[OK1]

Something to note that may or may not be unrealated- iems with filters in the nozzles frequently develop imbalance over time, *regardless of cost or quality. I've had a few encounter this. Just replace the filters if they come with replacements (Moondrop Aria/Tripowin Olina and similar) or take the filters out, wash them, and pop them back right in (7Hz x Crinacle Salnotes Zero 2 and similar)
*Added

Thanks. There are no washable or replaceable filters on the KZ ZVX.