Not me, I like DSP/EQ - I think well built passive speakers can benefit greatly from that technology.
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KEF LS50 & LS50W - Why the huge price difference
- Thread starter JJB70
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Not me, I like DSP/EQ - I think well built passive speakers can benefit greatly from that technology.
BillG
Major Contributor
A number of consumer actives do allow line level analog input; the LS50W does.
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What I meant is that with the actives it isn't possible to avoid DSP processing. Look back and you will see the comment is in response to those with passive speakers wanting to avoid DSP entirely, thus giving up access to EQ in the digital domain.
In theory you should be able to achieve the same performance by just running Dirac Live on the LS50 with a decent amp, minus the extra periphery features like streaming.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #106
I have just got into the sort of scenario which makes me reluctant to spend a lot of money on active digital speakers. I bought a pair of AKG N90Q active digital headphones with auto-calibration and DSP two months ago, B stock from Harman/AKG's direct sales channel.
As with active speakers, these do have performance benefits and the performance is superb. Unfortunately this weekend the things went tango uniform and die after five minutes of use. I contacted AKG and the first response was that they won't do a return as they're over 30 days old, ignoring my summary of the technical problem and request to provide info on where I send them for return or exchange. I followed up pointing out politely that the reason for wanting to contact their returns department was that the things had crapped out and were defective. Now I have another e-mail asking for the info I gave in detail in the first message I sent.
Now I'm sure it'll be resolved, but the initial response is disappointing, it'd be disappointing for any product but more so for an expensive and allegedly premium statement product to just get a "you bought it over thirty days ago, bog off" response to a request for a warranty return for repair or replacement with details of what was wrong. I'm just getting a bit fed up of this as it isn't the first product I've bought which has gone tango uniform after a short time to be met with a less than great response from the manufacturer. Now I know passive speakers and headphones can break too, as can an integrated amplifier, but these complicated integrated units seem more susceptible.
As with active speakers, these do have performance benefits and the performance is superb. Unfortunately this weekend the things went tango uniform and die after five minutes of use. I contacted AKG and the first response was that they won't do a return as they're over 30 days old, ignoring my summary of the technical problem and request to provide info on where I send them for return or exchange. I followed up pointing out politely that the reason for wanting to contact their returns department was that the things had crapped out and were defective. Now I have another e-mail asking for the info I gave in detail in the first message I sent.
Now I'm sure it'll be resolved, but the initial response is disappointing, it'd be disappointing for any product but more so for an expensive and allegedly premium statement product to just get a "you bought it over thirty days ago, bog off" response to a request for a warranty return for repair or replacement with details of what was wrong. I'm just getting a bit fed up of this as it isn't the first product I've bought which has gone tango uniform after a short time to be met with a less than great response from the manufacturer. Now I know passive speakers and headphones can break too, as can an integrated amplifier, but these complicated integrated units seem more susceptible.
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You are doing pretty good to stay flat to 40 hz.
Very unimpressive response. What was the guarantee, the standard EU 2 years?
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tango uniform=tits up
I suspect pro audio studio monitors are more ruggedly built than the LS50W. Even the inexpensive JBL LSR series gets an extensive run in at the factory before shipping. Also, concentric drivers have to be replaced in their entirety if a tweeter blows. However, I do know KEF customer returns are refurbished and sold through Accessories4less. They always have refurbished LS50's in stock, but rarely have the actives. That doesn't necessarly mean the actives are especially reliable, but there are fewer returns, probably because the actives are more likely to sound good out of the box than the passives when hooked up to some random gear.
I suspect pro audio studio monitors are more ruggedly built than the LS50W. Even the inexpensive JBL LSR series gets an extensive run in at the factory before shipping. Also, concentric drivers have to be replaced in their entirety if a tweeter blows. However, I do know KEF customer returns are refurbished and sold through Accessories4less. They always have refurbished LS50's in stock, but rarely have the actives. That doesn't necessarly mean the actives are especially reliable, but there are fewer returns, probably because the actives are more likely to sound good out of the box than the passives when hooked up to some random gear.
Surely they are, and yours is probably not the first in a row which were reported to fail and asked for return, which is probably the reason for all the "kindness"..
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Yes I would have faith they would sort it at this stage as well. Credit card chargeback is also a good fall back, if you have good evidence the vendor is not being helpful they usually side heavily with the customer.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #114
This is why I buy local for bigger purchases. Yes you can save by buying from overseas and yes most overseas sellers are good and offer good customer care. However if it does go pear shaped then I feel more comfortable about exercising my rights at home. And by the time you factor in shipping, VAT (if buying from outside Europe) and handling charges etc you may not save much anyway. Hence in many cases a lot of Chinese bargains are nothing like as much of a bargain, especially when domestic sellers often have promotions, sales, ex-demo stock etc.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #116
I guess to close out this thread I bought the Technics SB C700 speakers. I found a dealer still with a pair and they impressed me, quite how What Hifi gave them a 2* review is a mystery as I've heard an awful lot worse, often selling for a lot more. They satisfy me, are pretty compact and very nicely finished. The dealer also had a matching Technics lifestyle system (SC550) and my wife took a liking to it so we bought it. I think I the dealer must have been glad to offload both items as he did the combined package for less than the SRP of the speakers. I know lifestyle systems aren't the darling of audiophiles but on the outside at least it is beautifully built with a properly good tactile feel and first class fit and finish using excellent materials. The speakers have a superb sound (IMO) and the centre unit seems pretty much transparent, it does what it needs to do and appears to do it well. Although it wouldn't have been my choice the wife and kids love it and I have to admit I have no complaints about it, at SRP the price was ridiculous but at the price we paid it's a lovely little system. And it leaves me with my real audio gear hobby upstairs with my battleship like Sony ES stuff.
maty
Major Contributor
Mysterious? Their reviews are clearly biased towards British products. After reading a few, years ago, and then having a look at the measurements published in other places I decided that I would not take such a partial magazine seriously.
https://www.stereophile.com/content/technics-premium-class-sb-c700-loudspeaker-measurements
A good coaxial speaker offers a sound very different from the traditional ones. What I call magic.
maty
Major Contributor
https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/279383-coaxials-flat-woofers.html September 2015
Technics SB-C700
Measurements from:
[German] https://www.hifitest.de/test/vollve...-c700-technics_st-c700-technics_sb-c700_10486
Technics SB-C700
Measurements from:
[German] https://www.hifitest.de/test/vollve...-c700-technics_st-c700-technics_sb-c700_10486
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The WHF review basically ensures that Technics probably isn't going to get a foothold anytime soon despite a very very well-engineered product. But it also means you get good deals for those in the know. Enjoy them!
OP
- Thread Starter
- #120
What Hifi has been a baleful influence on audio for many years. They're one of the worst cheerleaders for subjectivism as not only do they buy into all the snake oil, they aren't even entertaining. I mean I don't like all the snake oil but some of the practitioners of that voodoo can at least write an entertaining 1000 words and can be good fun at times, even if in a car crash sort of way. What Hifi combines the mysticism with a complete lack of the entertainment that can be a partial redeeming feature of some other purveyors of snake oil. As well as being blatantly biased in favour of British products, they're blatantly biased in favour of boutique audiophile type suppliers against big mainstream suppliers. I remember in the 80's and early 90's when companies like Pioneer, Sony, Marantz, Yamaha, Kenwood, Sansui etc were at their peak and making exquisitely engineered products with measured performance that would still be impressive today WHF routinely slated their products and awarded glowing reviews to shoddily made crap from over priced boutique suppliers.
On the current iteration of Technics, my experience is obviously very limited, but I will say that the tactile feel and visible build quality is quite outstanding and very reminiscent of the old Japanese companies in their prime, and the speakers are really excellent. Crappy remote though, for some reason they put an awful lot of effort into the materials, fit and finish and feel of the centre unit and speakers then included a remote control which is like something you'd expect to buy for less than a fiver in the centre aisle at Aldi (no offence to Aldi).
On the current iteration of Technics, my experience is obviously very limited, but I will say that the tactile feel and visible build quality is quite outstanding and very reminiscent of the old Japanese companies in their prime, and the speakers are really excellent. Crappy remote though, for some reason they put an awful lot of effort into the materials, fit and finish and feel of the centre unit and speakers then included a remote control which is like something you'd expect to buy for less than a fiver in the centre aisle at Aldi (no offence to Aldi).
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