Is power the only way to compare amplifiers in terms of how loud they can make headphones?

[solderdude]

Asgard can go 1.9dB louder (output power)
The Asgard will have 11.2V out the Magni3+ 8.9V out.
15dB gain = 5.6x so with 2V in 11.2V can be reached.

The Fostex'es are notoriously inefficent and reach 104dB SPL @1V so with 11.2V: 124dB SPL peak can be reached.
Dunno if one can reliably tell 124dB and 122dB SPL apart.

So.. Asgard can go 2dB louder on a 2V DAC where Modi would already be clipping when the digital signal actually reaches 0dBFS.

 

[MkgandKembaFan]

The only thing I can ascertain from the specs is that it appears as though Flux Lab amps have much higher gain settings than the two Schiits; all of their amps appear to have over 10db of gain on their minimum level, and up to 20+ on the highest levels, meaning highest gain is what, audibly 4 times as loud as the source? Are you using the FA-12's balanced output or SE? Are you running in an exclusive mode with your DAC? Seems like the difference between the two Schiits could merely be of topology, not necessarily of one being rather that much powerful than the other. Could also be that the extra power of the Asgard means being able to drive heads with much higher impedance, not necessarily driving the same, fairly low impedance (though low sensitivity as well) headphones noticeably louder, though someone correct me if I'm way off base with that one.

How do the pot positions fair for what you'd deem a comfortable listening level, out of curiosity? To me, if they're the same give a few degrees at your preferred listening level, then for the purposes of your fostexs and your preferred listening level, they're about the same power. Plus all those power numbers from manufacturers can be a bit fudged, as we've seen from Amirm's reviews, or simply tested in incongruent ways between manufacturers.

I run fully balanced from my zen dac to my drop thx amp to my casns, but testing my HE-4XX's, about the same sensitivity, 15 ohm lower impedance though, completely single ended, full pot medium gain (1x) is pretty painful, and full pot low gain (0.33x) is pretty close to the highest I'd listen to comfortably. Not sure how the THX compares to any of the mentioned amps, or if 15 ohm is significant or not, but I hope that info is useful to some degree.

So the gain level is a much better determinant of loudness than total power? Balanced on the FA-12. On the Magni 3+, about 1:30 and 12:45 on the Asgard 3. Thank you!

 

[MkgandKembaFan]

Experience is a good teacher.

Unless you have something that already attenuates/amplifies by specified decibels, download Audacity and import an Audio Track (or create test tones) and attenuate/amplify to demonstrate the effect.

Will do!

 

[MkgandKembaFan]

Asgard can go 1.9dB louder (output power)
The Asgard will have 11.2V out the Magni3+ 8.9V out.
15dB gain = 5.6x so with 2V in 11.2V can be reached.

The Fostex'es are notoriously inefficent and reach 104dB SPL @1V so with 11.2V: 124dB SPL peak can be reached.
Dunno if one can reliably tell 124dB and 122dB SPL apart.

So.. Asgard can go 2dB louder on a 2V DAC where Modi would already be clipping when the digital signal actually reaches 0dBFS.

Thank you! I'm a complete noob, so could you give me a run down or point me to some resources on how you did your calculations and what the terms specifically mean?

 

[solderdude]

It's all calculated from info found here and there on the web, Ohm's law and deciBell calculations on some of the outcomes.

In any case both amps can reach the peak values when the 2V DACs are used without any volume control and digital signal's are unaltered and actually reaching peak levels.

Peak levels (mostly in the lows) are definitely not the same thing as the 'average level' warning stuff you see here and there.

 

[metaleggman]

So the gain level is a much better determinant of loudness than total power? Balanced on the FA-12. On the Magni 3+, about 1:30 and 12:45 on the Asgard 3. Thank you!

Not necessarily. I was more just saying that the Flux Labs amp had pretty big high gain settings compared to the schiit ones, so with the same pre-amp input, and all amps on highest gain, it makes sense it would be louder. But I'm glad I asked about the balanced, because that might be why it was louder as well. Balanced is always going to be louder, since most topologies that I'm aware of feed twice the power into the balanced connections. It's part of why I can't use my really sensitive IEMs with my desktop stack atm. Essentially, it's the difference between powering your stereo with a stereo amp vs two monoblock amps. Theoretically the gain could be why the Flux Labs seems so louder, but I would actually peg it at the use of balanced outputs.

Also good lol, I was low key worried you were listening on maximum pot or something haha