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Pearlsparrow

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Jan 19, 2025
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Hello everyone, i am new here. This is my first post. My name is Panos and i live in Greece. Nice to meet you all.

Let's start with my setup and what i am doing with it.

Audio interface: Focusrite 6i6 2nd gen
Headphones: Sennheiser HD560s, Sennheiser HD595
Monitors: JBL LSR305, Edifier MR4

I use this for Music listening, Music recording and production in my home. So it's a mini home studio where i play game write music etc.

What's the problem you are trying to solve?
Nothing! There is no problem with my setup. Volume is enough through 6i6 2nd gen's headphone amp. Just wanted a better, fuller sound maybe.

So what's the question?
Upgrading to a nice headphone amp will give me a better sound quality for my headphones?

Budget:
200-300€

Any amp you liked?
I had my eyes on the Topping L70 because of the balanced inputs (so i can connect it to my audio interface) and balanced outputs so i can buy a DAC later on and use that for my monitors also.

So please share your thoughts with me. Is this a viable option? Maybe i am overspending? Spending 200-300€ in another product is a better idea(like a new interface maybe)?
 
Hi Panos! Welcome to ASR.

Upgrading to a nice headphone amp will give me a better sound quality for my headphones?
Unfortunately not.

Buying a dedicated headphone amp would make sense if you were planning on switching headphones to something like the DCA Aeon, which your Focusrite would definitely struggle with

With your Sennheiser headphones however, no audible difference can be expected.

The best way to get a better, fuller sound out of your headphones is to apply frequency response correction.

For games, YouTube etc on Windows, this can be done using Equalizer APO.

For music production via ASIO, you could use the MathAudio Headphone EQ VST plug-in.

You can find EQ presets for the 560S and 595 below:
https://autoeq.app/
https://www.reddit.com/r/oratory1990/wiki/index/list_of_presets/?rdt=45736

The .txt files can be imported into Equalizer APO like so: https://youtu.be/jkgcsVNTJvc

Edit:
I've converted oratory's PDF presets for the 560S into .txt files which you can import into EQApo as shown in the YouTube clip.

The files are attached below.

Lastly, a trick for Equalizer APO:
Try deleting the first line of the .txt files that contains the Preamp values, then add a Preamp block above the Include block and copy the preamp value in there. Should look like this:
Screenshot 2023-11-22 161053 (2) (1).jpg

With that done, you can toggle just the EQ adjustment on and off and listen to the difference without a jump in volume.

Also, if you copy the preamp value in there and EQApo returns Peak gain >0dB and marked in red, simply reduce the Preamp until it's below zero:
Screenshot 2024-11-11 201236.png
 

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  • HD560S to Optimum HiFi (oratory1990) (-3,8dB).txt
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  • HD560S to Harman OE2018 (oratory1990) (-5,4dB).txt
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That was an incredible answer to my question! I am impressed. Thank you for your time StaticV3. I will try your recommendation. I had my eyes on a software called Sonarworks SoundID reference. I like your method though and i will test it out. Thanks for the files, very helpful.
 
The 6i6 Gen2's output level for headphones is +13 dBu (balanced) according to the manual. Since both outputs are single ended, this is either typo or with channels 3&4 being the inverse of 1&2 or 2&4 being the inverse of 1&3 and the inverse being connected to the negative terminal of the headphone. If its a typo, you may be able to quadruple your power that way. Of course, this requires that your headphones can be run balanced which yours however cannot.

One concern with interfaces is that the output impedance of the headphone output is high. This can lead to drops in levels and changes in frequency response.

If you want to buy a DAC anyways, consider getting an all-in-one with a headphone amplifier. Several good ones can be had in your budget.
 
One concern with interfaces is that the output impedance of the headphone output is high. This can lead to drops in levels and changes in frequency response.

If you want to buy a DAC anyways, consider getting an all-in-one with a headphone amplifier. Several good ones can be had in your budget.
Indeed both those headphones change tonality when driven from high impedance output:

https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/brands-s-se/hd595/

https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/brands-s-se/hd-560s/

so if interface output impedance is > 50 ohm it's already making the sound "fuller" (or "muddier", depends on how you look at it).
 
The 6i6 2nd Gen's headphone output impedance is unknown, but likely between zero and 10Ω, judging from other Scarlett models.

If OP is curious, output impedance can be measured using a basic multimeter and something like this.

E.g:
 
The 6i6 2nd Gen's headphone output impedance is unknown, but likely between zero and 10Ω, judging from other Scarlett models.

If OP is curious, output impedance can be measured using a basic multimeter and something like this.

E.g:
What load did you use? Is it on the multimeter?

Alternatively, since a low load impedance gives the greatest difference, he can try an interconnect cable or a headphone cable. However, the latter may be too low for the amp. For instance, the HD650 cable should be around 0.5 Ohm plug to terminal connector judging by this.
 
The 6i6 Gen2's output level for headphones is +13 dBu (balanced) according to the manual. Since both outputs are single ended, this is either typo or with channels 3&4 being the inverse of 1&2 or 2&4 being the inverse of 1&3 and the inverse being connected to the negative terminal of the headphone. If its a typo, you may be able to quadruple your power that way. Of course, this requires that your headphones can be run balanced which yours however cannot.

One concern with interfaces is that the output impedance of the headphone output is high. This can lead to drops in levels and changes in frequency response.

If you want to buy a DAC anyways, consider getting an all-in-one with a headphone amplifier. Several good ones can be had in your budget.
I believe that Sennheiser sells cables that can make the 560s Balanced (because i think that it is balanced but it comes with an unbalanced connection).
 
Indeed both those headphones change tonality when driven from high impedance output:

https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/brands-s-se/hd595/

https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/brands-s-se/hd-560s/

so if interface output impedance is > 50 ohm it's already making the sound "fuller" (or "muddier", depends on how you look at it).
According to this screenshot (source: Julian Krause Youtube Channel) the 2i2 2nd gen has 10ohm impedance. So i can assume that my unit also has 10ohm. So this slightly changes the tonal characteristics of the audio as i see it.
 

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I believe that Sennheiser sells cables that can make the 560s Balanced (because i think that it is balanced but it comes with an unbalanced connection).
I just found it. For 99€. And you still need to go from 2xTRS 6.35mm to TRRRS 4.4 mm. You are probably looking at a custom cable for that connection.
 
According to this screenshot (source: Julian Krause Youtube Channel) the 2i2 2nd gen has 10ohm impedance. So i can assume that my unit also has 10ohm. So this slightly changes the tonal characteristics of the audio as i see it.
As a rule, the output impedance being at most 1/8 of the headphone impedance is okay. It might do a little but it should not be a dramatic difference compared to a near 0 output impedance.
 
I just found it. For 99€. And you still need to go from 2xTRS 6.35mm to TRRRS 4.4 mm. You are probably looking at a custom cable for that connection.
Not worth the money and the clutter in my honest opinion. I'd rather buy an amp and call it a day. :D
 
10 ohm would still be low enough to make almost inaudible difference.
That sound great. So the only upgrade path to a better audio experience is just better headphones. To be honest i just bought them and i love the sound so far. They are like the HD595 but more dynamic and fuller with more extension in the low frequencies. But i thought that buying a dedicated amp will allow the headphone to play as good as they can. I did not know that an amp wont a make a difference. So that is good new and bad news. Good news (i do not have to spend money) - Bad news (no new toys for me).
 
What load did you use?
Click the link :)

Is it on the multimeter?
It's on the load board

For instance, the HD650 cable should be around 0.5 Ohm plug to terminal connector judging by this.
How would OP use a headphone cable alone as test load?
It cannot be connected to a headphone output, without also connecting the headphone.

Disconnect the headphone and the cable is floating, not loading the Amp.
 
As a rule, the output impedance being at most 1/8 of the headphone impedance is okay. It might do a little but it should not be a dramatic difference compared to a near 0 output impedance.
1/10 is the general rule of thumb.
 
Click the link :)


It's on the load board


How would OP use a headphone cable alone as test load?
It cannot be connected to a headphone output, without also connecting the headphone.

Disconnect the headphone and the cable is floating, not loading the Amp.
I know the value. I meant the component which you said now was the load board.

You are correct. I thought of measuring the voltage between ground and signal at the end of the cable since the cable has positive impedance but since there is no connection there is no load other than the meter. It can be bodged with a small wire by pinning it to the connectors using the multimeter's probes. Also, the low impedance of the headphone cable may short the amp.
 
I know the value. I meant the component which you said now was the load board.

You are correct. I thought of measuring the voltage between ground and signal at the end of the cable since the cable has positive impedance but since there is no connection there is no load other than the meter. It can be bodged with a small wire by pinning it to the connectors using the multimeter's probes. Also, the low impedance of the headphone cable may short the amp.
I plug a short TRS male-male cable into the hp output then alligator clips connecting one resistors like this to the other end and the digital multimeter


21S40H5jRgL.jpg


a bit unhandy but if you have to do it just every now and then and already have the resistor it's ok, otherwise the load board is much easier.
 
Something else that bothers me: As a recording musician (electric guitar) i am playing with amp sims mostly that needs good latency, something like 64 buffer size and 4-5ms is fine. If i bypass the DAC of the focusrite 6i6 2nd with the SPDIF -> Dac -> Headphone amp will this introduce more latency or it will be almost the same as before?


Update: Something like this will introduce a better sound overall? Dac/Amp SMSL DL200
 
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I plug a short TRS male-male cable into the hp output then alligator clips connecting one resistors like this to the other end and the digital multimeter


21S40H5jRgL.jpg


a bit unhandy but if you have to do it just every now and then and already have the resistor it's ok, otherwise the load board is much easier.
A possible issue with using such low resistor values is that one reaches current limits of the amp which might paint an incorrect picture of the actual output resistance of the amp.
It can be used but only while looking at the waveform using a scope (or soundcard that is used as a scope).

When using such a low value resistor and not able to monitor wave-forms the open voltage (so without a load) should not be higher than 0.2V as most amps can deliver 20mA.
When one is using 1V open voltage then the amp in question must be able to source at least 100mA.

Update: Something like this will introduce a better sound overall? Dac/Amp SMSL DL200
What it will do is ensure you can play the headphone a LOT louder without running into distortion and as it has a low output resistance it won't modify the tonal balance of headphones.

It is severe overkill in headphone power and perhaps only really needed when attempting to play inefficient planar headphones really loud.
Not that this is a problem with normal usage but some headphones are rated 30mW and when lying on a desk and accidentally playing such a headphone really loud that headphone could blow up in seconds.
 
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