Another platinum thread: Adam T5V upgrade

[uwotm8]

Sup ASR

After 1.5 years with T5V I found myself thinking about an upgrade, but kinda struggling without no option to listen anything other way than order and return (not a huge fan of such business).
So far getting experience is limited to a sort of echo chamber containing reviews and youtube 'listening" Count that as a disclaimer.

The setup was, is and will be desktop/nearfield in a pretty bad positions in typical rooms.
0% work, only music listening.

OK, starting with what I like...
+ overall comfortable signature
+ very nice and deep soundstage, "immersive" sound that feels untied from speakers
+ (maybe illusion of) transparency (mostly... not across all range)
+ pretty deep bass for what they are

...and what could be better in T5Vs:
- tricky positioning for optimal bass output, lika a few inches away from the wall and you lose it, few inches closre and it's bloated
- while they try to play low, enclosure is very lively and overall bass quality is not impressive
- sound stays "clean" and "dynamic" to my taste only below 80-85 dB @1 m, then it degrades fast (not a problem for 95% of time but for some reason I want to FEEL THA POWAH!)
- I don't hear heavy coloration but they definitely have a special signature
- midrange/low midrange sucks compared to HD6xx (yes, headphones, I know); quantity is enough, quality - not so much
- overall, there could be (a lot?) more clarity and richness across all range except airy HF which are fine (?)
- all said before goes for both EQ/non-EQ listening (EQ doesn't deeply change their nature but improves nicely, thx @Maiky76 !)

So, upgrading these I want to get all mentioned downsides fixed while keeping what I like (classic, right?).
Oh, and even more important! I'm a sort of fan of Dynaudio in-house sound, and overall want to find a balance, sort of "flat but audiophile/hi-fi'ish" sound.

These are models I consider from least to most favorable:
Kali IN-5 - like them the least, dull by measurements, dull/"cheap" by youtube listening, I suspect that even T5Vs will outplay them in terms of "audiophilia". But 3-way and that hype!
Tannoy* Gold 7 - like the look, like AB amps and more power compared to typical 50+50W; there will be some coloration but midrange and clarity should definitely be better that with T5Vs; kinda uncertain of Behringer QC and reliability. Mixed reviews, but rather positive sound wise. Perfect pricing tho
*we know it's not Tannoy
Adam A7V - sort of dark horse and an obvious choice at the same time, not sure if I will get what I want - the same sound but better? Overall rather mixed reviews, fairly high price. Ugly look I'd say.
Genelec 8030C - amazing look, close-to-perfect graphs, a lot of people who love them but some other who find them too bright; reasonable price ~580 eur;
Neumann 120 II - most loved nearfield ever, definitely a youtube listening champion in terms of staying as close to record as possible, perfect graphs except kinda narrow directivity (must be good for an engineering tool tho). Mixed opinions about soundstage and overall feel; some people call it dull and prefer Genelec (even Amir when compared 8030 to KH 80). ~720 eur, highest price of all.

So, I just need a Ultimate Answer to Life, The Universe, and Everything a simple question: which one of mentioned above will give the most audiophile/immersive experience while being precise and deliver tons of midrange joy like HD6xx do? Yes, they require EQ to bring bass and HF to the party but still.

Here in my echo chamber it feels like Genelec deliver more audiophilia while Neumann are that "ideal headphones simulator" but can make me miss some bells and whistles of even T5Vs.

plese halp

P.S. There's a sort of sound which I rageously hate - typical PA sound and that feel of two big boxes yelling loud at you for no reason lol.
Flat, no stage, chest knocking instead of deep bass. The worst I can imagine followed closely by KZ IEMs

 

[AnalogSteph]

My two cents:

...and what could be better in T5Vs:
- tricky positioning for optimal bass output, lika a few inches away from the wall and you lose it, few inches closre and it's bloated

Someone needs a measurement mic.

- while they try to play low, enclosure is very lively and overall bass quality is not impressive

Not totally surprising in an inexpensive monitor like that. DIY bracing / damping may be an option.

- sound stays "clean" and "dynamic" to my taste only below 80-85 dB @1 m, then it degrades fast (not a problem for 95% of time but for some reason I want to FEEL THA POWAH!)

Again, not totally surprising in this class. This is an area where both going bigger and spending more money can yield some substantial improvements.

- I don't hear heavy coloration but they definitely have a special signature
- midrange/low midrange sucks compared to HD6xx (yes, headphones, I know); quantity is enough, quality - not so much

The low midrange still has a lot to do with "the room" (which tends to be dominant up to ~500 Hz), so I suspect this is at least part of the issue.
Someone needs a measurement mic.[2]

- all said before goes for both EQ/non-EQ listening (EQ doesn't deeply change their nature but improves nicely, thx @Maiky76 !)

Anechoic EQ is all fine and dandy and may very well be all that you need past 2-3 kHz, but again, you're not shaking off the room especially around 500 Hz and below.

T5Vs are a bit notorious for being hissy, have you had any issues with that so far?

These are models I consider from least to most favorable:

OK, what's your listening distance there? The A7Vs may be out if you're very close, as in <0.7-0.8 m.

I suspect that in terms of sheer level handling, the Neumanns may be near the top of the heap. I once subjected my K+H O110s (their grandad from 2009) to some bass IMD testing to see whether I could get them to break a sweat... my hearing was waving the white flag first. (Monitors like that are built for 85 dB levels in heavily treated studios, and it shows.) Next probably the A7V. I would expect the Tannoys to be relatively unimpressive for the size, traditional coaxes just need to be one size up (can't do much excursion or Doppler distortion will get you, and cone and surround design have to be a compromise towards dispersion). The 7 is about the minimum I'd consider, and you may actually want the 8 instead.

The Genelecs would count as being the most "eco-friendly". At 3 W idle they barely even need auto-standby, though they also do have that. Dispersion is fairly wide, contributing to people's impression of them being on the brighter side in-room. In a nearfield scenario, you may not hear it all that much post-EQ and appreciate the wider range of movements it affords instead.

The KH120 II is neat in that it ships with a digital input out of the box that should fundamentally work even with an onboard Toslink output with the right adaptation (Toslink to coax, coax to AES3). The reports of issues with waking up from auto-standby are less encouraging, particularly since 12 W idle each isn't so little that you'd want them running all day without worrying about it... an eco-friendly computer and monitor setup might sip less power than they do.

Another avenue that may be worth exploring is the used market. Generally more bang for the buck there. That's how I picked up my K+Hs as well... thankfully just prior to the pandemic, the market went a bit nuts then for a while. Looks like a pair of "old" KH120As may be going for little more than a single KH120 II at times, at least around here where Neumanns traditionally are quite popular.

 

[uwotm8]

Someone needs a measurement mic

Someone tried taming LF resonances down by ear using tone generator which resulted in rather unpleasant and bass deficient sound. Music wise; those tones were nice and even. Knowing the fact that the harder you correct with PEQ the more you insult the phase response - and keeping in mind that T5Vs require PEQ just to become... well, I'd say remotely linear - I want next speakers to demand as less PEQ as possible. Call me audiofool, but with all respect to tonality improvements I always note that PEQ kinda takes away some breath and "ease", for both speakes and cans. Sometimes it's definitely worth it, sometimes it's a tradeoff where I lose not much less than I gain.

Someone needs a measurement mic.[2]

I criticize neither quantity or tonality of LMF. It just does not reveal much, same as overall sort of laid back sound - except HF. Timbres could be richier.

T5Vs are a bit notorious for being hissy

I barely detect their hiss from 0.5m in almost silent room with gain knob at 0. At max (+18 dB?) it is simply unbearable.

"Eco" is not a factor of choice at all, as far as 15W 24/7/365 means 131 kWh yearly which will cost ~10 euro per year. My PC drains like a dozen times more.

Toslink output with the right adaptation (Toslink to coax, coax to AES3

AES version extra cost makes it completely not interesting

Next probably the A7V

I'm assuming these will be the most smooth and easy upgrade with no surprizes which is a good thing for me.

Thanks!

P.S. Sound and Rocording measured A7Vs and I think I like it (BR port null is acceptable, it's stupid but unlikely that I'll hear it)

PIR seems really nice tho

And yes, Sonarworks calibration if once I will want to

 

[uwotm8]

Well I ende up getting A7Vs and they deliver basically they fixed all I didn't like in T5Vs.
But also they are simply delicious.

 

[Juhazi]

I bought T7V and that is super fine too, the reflex port is on the backside. Box could be better braced.