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Advice Needed with Denon 1700NE

Bart1927

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Since my old amplifier (actually, it's a 5 channel AVR, but I'm only using the 2 front channels) has been giving me some issues, I decided to try out some new amps. I must admit I'm a bit of a newbie on the subject, so there's bound to be stuff that I don't understand correctly.

The first amp I tried out at home was a Denon 1700NE. Compared to my old amp (a Cambridge Audio 351R) it has a lot more power. The Cambridge is rated at 70 W @ 8 Ohms (2 channels driven) and there's no rating at 4 Ohm. Actually, the manual specifically instructs to use only 8 Ohm speakers. However, I did contact the manufacturer and they told me that using 2 4 Ohm front speakers wouldn't be a problem, as long as I didn't use 5 of them.

The Denon is also rated at 70W per channel at 8 Ohms (just like the Cambridge), but at a whopping 2x140W @ 4 Ohms,

My speakers are a pair of Dynaudio 2/7. They are 4 Ohm and have a sensitivity of 86dB. From what I've read they are considered a little insensitive, hard to drive, and need a powerful amp.

I did some comparing between the 2 amps. Now I know that there has been some heated debate on the subject, and a lot of people claim that basically all amps sound the same, and all differences you may hear are the result of incorrect testing and are all in the mind. It's not my intention to stir up that discussion again, and I'm inclined to believe the statement is basically true. But I wondered, to what extent is it true? Is there really no audible difference between a 100$ amp driving a pair of bookshelf speakers and a 2000$ (or a 20.000 $ one) driving those same speakers? Or do I misinterpret the statement, and is it only true when comparing amps with (pretty much) the same specs.

The reason I'm wondering about this is because I really believe I'm hearing a difference between the Denon and the Cambridge when driving my Dynaudio 2/7 speakers. Not in terms of coloration. The Denon doesn't sound warmer or brighter or whatever. But I do believe I hear a difference in the way the sound is dispersed. I don't know how I should describe it. It is as if the sound has more depth to it. The Cambridge sounds flat by comparison. I should mention that I basically only play music from the 1920's and '30's, so it's all in mono.

So my question is basically this: This difference that I hear, is it all my imagination? Or is it really possible that the Denon sounds better since it has more output power than my Cambridge and should therefore be better at driving my so-called difficult to drive speakers?

Any feedback is appreciated!
 
It's not a myth. There is different in sound come out between cheap vs high end amp. I'm on the way to get my new amp and I got the PMA-900hne at very good deal. I tried it with my speakers set, it was good until I got the PMA-1700ne in (also at on sale). Big open soundstage, more bass bunch and tight, clean/clear sound even at high volume. I know it is more expensive but I like it. Build quality also much better and heavier. We do karaoke too, and you can hear significant difference on vocal when compared the 2 amps side by side.
I did not have the Cambridge but I don't think this receiver can compare with Denon 1700ne, they are at different levels. Even the pma-900hne will perform much better than your Cambridge Audio 351R. If you are on budget, I suggest the pma-900hne, that is sweet spot for the money.
Hope this help! Cheers
 
The denon 1700 ne is for sure a nice amplifier. But it's not a 2000 USD one. I see it discounted to 1499 euro in a shop.
 
I have the 900HNE as well and am looking at a used 1600NE or a 1700NE
 
Anyone can compare Denon PMA 1700ne with Denon AVR X3600h for stereo listening to music?
 
Amplifiers definitely can sound different depending on the characteristics of the speakers they are driving. If a speaker has a difficult impedance curve where the impedance may range from 10+ ohms to around 2 or 3 ohms, the amplifer must be able to supply higher current into low impedances to get a flat response. If you try to drive speakers that dip to low impedances with an amplifier that cannot provide additional current to low impedances, the amplifier acts like a tone control.

I happened to do an extreme comparison when my Krell KSA 300S (300 watts into 8 ohms, 1200 watts into 2 ohms) had to get recapped. I'm running a pair of Thiel CS6 speakers which are a notoriously difficult load (86 dB sensitivity, impedance dips to around 2 ohms). I had an Onkyo AV receiver lying around and I tried hooking it up to my Thiels to have something to listen to while the Krell was away. I literally laughed out loud when I played the first song. The Onkyo sounded like an AM radio. The soundstage collapsed and the presentation was simply awful. All I can say is that if anyone thinks that all amplifiers sound the same they should try a similar test with a weak amp and difficult speakers. For example, you don't see Wilson speakers being run by low wattage tube amps for a reason.

If you read the speaker tests in Stereophile or ASR you will see that many new speakers are quite difficult to drive and need a beefy amp to present a flat frequency response. I don't know the impedance curve of your Dyaudios but I have seen tests on several other of their models and they are usually fairly difficult to drive. Bottom line, I don't think the difference you hear is your imagination.
 
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