Topping D90 Balanced USB DAC Review

[Veri]

Also don't buy audioquest cables or other bullshit expensive-fancypants brands.

 

[fendy323]

Also don't buy audioquest cables or other bullshit expensive-fancypants brands.

the sound quality is same?
i buy directly on china marketplace but only find
- 0,5meter xlr cables with 54$ this one (pairs)
- 1meter xlr cables with 5$ this one (pairs)
- 1meter xlr cables with 56$ this one (pairs)
- 0,25 meter rca to rca topping with 26$ this one (pairs)

which one should i buy?
1meter vs 0,5meter is it matters? or same quality result?
it's a little hard find cheaper 0,5meter xlr, they usually sell 1meter minimum

 

[Chippyboy]

Not sure if my opinion matters because I use the MQA feature with Tidal. I think the differences between 24 and 32 bits could only be an issue if you listen to a lot of 32 bit files. But both are high res. Is a higher bit depth beyond 24 bits something we can distinguish? I don’t know, maybe... maybe my teenager son could

You do realise that the only thing the bit depth influences is the SNR? More bits does not provide any greater "resolution". This silly image that people have in their heads (propagated by a hifi industry desperate to sell kit) of a stepped sine wave and then another "Hi Res" 24 or 32 bit one with smaller "steps" is a complete myth. The steps do not exist in any signal, 16/44.1 or 24/96 or 24/192 or 32/192. The higher bit-depth signals just have a lower noise floor, that is all. And since the 16 bit noise floor is perhap 100 dB down, then the benefits are moot, at best.

 

[fendy323]

You do realise that the only thing the bit depth influences is the SNR? More bits does not provide any greater "resolution". This silly image that people have in their heads (propagated by a hifi industry desperate to sell kit) of a stepped sine wave and then another "Hi Res" 24 or 32 bit one with smaller "steps" is a complete myth. The steps do not exist in any signal, 16/44.1 or 24/96 or 24/192 or 32/192. The higher bit-depth signals just have a lower noise floor, that is all. And since the 16 bit noise floor is perhap 100 dB down, then the benefits are moot, at best.

for me as a new user, which one better sir?
d90 standard or mqa version?
need 1 time purchase for a long time

 

[auronthas]

.

 

[jason.voegele]

for me as a new user, which one better sir?
d90 standard or mqa version?
need 1 time purchase for a long time

If you use Tidal as your source of music, you could consider getting the MQA version, since Tidal uses MQA for their "master" quality recordings. It is not strictly necessary, though, since the Tidal app can decode the MQA data and just send PCM to the DAC. You might prefer to have the DAC fully handle the MQA data, though, as I do myself, and in this case you would want the MQA version of the D90.

If you do not use Tidal and you do not have any downloaded music in MQA format (if this is even possible?), then there is probably no reason to go with the MQA version of the D90 and you should just get the standard D90.

 

[Vladecrni]

Here's one Palantir-type question:

What do you think, will these units be discounted anywhere in EU any time soon? 800€ is a bit steep for my taste to shell out for a DAC, so I'm hoping to find at least 650€ discounted/refurbished/demo version, or 550 for a used one.

Do Prime day / summer sales / Cyber Monday influence price for this type of stuff at al?

Do Topping items ever go on sale, since they are a fair bit cheaper than products with comparable specs?

When can one hope to find these start popping up on used market ?

Question goes to someone who follows the market for while now, as I got interested in audio only couple of months ago, and don't really know how the market moves, or what to expect...

 

[fendy323]

If you use Tidal as your source of music, you could consider getting the MQA version, since Tidal uses MQA for their "master" quality recordings. It is not strictly necessary, though, since the Tidal app can decode the MQA data and just send PCM to the DAC. You might prefer to have the DAC fully handle the MQA data, though, as I do myself, and in this case you would want the MQA version of the D90.

If you do not use Tidal and you do not have any downloaded music in MQA format (if this is even possible?), then there is probably no reason to go with the MQA version of the D90 and you should just get the standard D90.

so the different only on mqa version? how about the other type ?

like play on apple music/spotify/etc
i mean any different for that? or totally same?
i saw the last post said different bit ?
mqa version 22bit
standard version 32bit (CMIIW)
it's mean without mqa, the standard version have a better format?
is it a problems? or only the gimmick ?

so for now there is no downloaded music in mqa format right?
for this below statement, i still don't understand

It is not strictly necessary, though, since the Tidal app can decode the MQA data and just send PCM to the DAC. You might prefer to have the DAC fully handle the MQA data, though, as I do myself, and in this case you would want the MQA version of the D90.

 

[EchoChamber]

so the different only on mqa version? how about the other type ?

like play on apple music/spotify/etc
i mean any different for that? or totally same?
i saw the last post said different bit ?
mqa version 22bit
standard version 32bit (CMIIW)
it's mean without mqa, the standard version have a better format?
is it a problems? or only the gimmick ?

so for now there is no downloaded music in mqa format right?
MQA is only on the physical cd and tidal?

I believe the MQA chip limits the DAC input implementation to 24 bit. Not an issue.

if you listen to Tidal, MQA might be something you could be interested in because you could take advantage of it. If you don’t think you’ll ever subscribe to Tidal than just get the non MQA version.

 

[fendy323]

I believe the MQA chip limits the DAC input implementation to 24 bit. Not an issue.

if you listen to Tidal, MQA might be something you could be interested in because you could take advantage of it. If you don’t think you’ll ever subscribe to Tidal than just get the non MQA version.

basiclly mqa version is the top format for hifi audio right?

so the standard version have 32bit? in the paper the standard have a better sound quality , isn't it ?
if mqa version and standard version play music source by spotify/apple , is there any different quality? or totally same?

 

[Veri]

basiclly mqa version is the top format for hifi audio right?

No. just marketing.

 

[Dclone]

the sound quality is same?
i buy directly on china marketplace but only find
- 0,5meter xlr cables with 54$ this one (pairs)
- 1meter xlr cables with 5$ this one (pairs)
- 1meter xlr cables with 56$ this one (pairs)
- 0,25 meter rca to rca topping with 26$ this one (pairs)

which one should i buy?
1meter vs 0,5meter is it matters? or same quality result?
it's a little hard find cheaper 0,5meter xlr, they usually sell 1meter minimum

My experience with xlr (and other cables) is that the shielding of the cable and its connectors must be good. My thumbrule is to have shortest possible, but still practical, length. I use Supra Lo Rad cables which are not expensive and You can order them in any length You need. They are well shielded and have good connectors.

 

[bboris77]

@JohnYang1997, are there any technical downsides to the MQA version of the D90 compared to the regular version? The reason I am asking is because I am able to pick up the MQA version locally in Canada and I would not have to wait for shipping from China. I sometimes listen to the MQA versions of songs on Tidal but don't really care about the format particularly.

 

[Chippyboy]

so the different only on mqa version? how about the other type ?

like play on apple music/spotify/etc
i mean any different for that? or totally same?
i saw the last post said different bit ?
mqa version 22bit
standard version 32bit (CMIIW)
it's mean without mqa, the standard version have a better format?
is it a problems? or only the gimmick ?

so for now there is no downloaded music in mqa format right?
for this below statement, i still don't understand

It is not strictly necessary, though, since the Tidal app can decode the MQA data and just send PCM to the DAC. You might prefer to have the DAC fully handle the MQA data, though, as I do myself, and in this case you would want the MQA version of the D90.

MQA is a lossy format which "hides" compressed high frequency components in the (hopefully) inaudible parts of a regular 16/44.1 signal. It is then processed to "unfold" this signal into either a 24/96 signal or a 24/192 signal. The Tidal app will only do the first unfold to 24/96. If you want the 24/192 signal, that final decoding has to be done by an MQA dac.

So bottom line is if you want "full" MQA, you need an MQA dac. Now does any of these make any difference? Of course it doesn't. No adult can hear 20 KHz, let alone 48 KHz or god forbid 96 KHz. And neither can they feel it, sense it, smell it any more than they can see ultraviolet or infra red. Humans just don't have the sensory equipment and it's all nonsense.

The reason - the only reason - some MQA content, or hi-res flacs or DSD for that matter - *sometimes* sounds better is because whoever produced it was playing to an audiofile audience and therefore they took more care with the mastering process. Take that same mastered content and in double blind testing 99.9% (probably 100% actually) of people cannot tell the difference between regular 16/44 or 24/96 or DSD or 24/192 or 32/192. It's all in your mind.

 

[fendy323]

MQA is a lossy format which "hides" compressed high frequency components in the (hopefully) inaudible parts of a regular 16/44.1 signal. It is then processed to "unfold" this signal into either a 24/96 signal or a 24/192 signal. The Tidal app will only do the first unfold to 24/96. If you want the 24/192 signal, that final decoding has to be done by an MQA dac.

So bottom line is if you want "full" MQA, you need an MQA dac. Now does any of these make any difference? Of course it doesn't. No adult can hear 20 KHz, let alone 48 KHz or god forbid 96 KHz. And neither can they feel it, sense it, smell it any more than they can see ultraviolet or infra red. Humans just don't have the sensory equipment and it's all nonsense.

The reason - the only reason - some MQA content, or hi-res flacs or DSD for that matter - *sometimes* sounds better is because whoever produced it was playing to an audiofile audience and therefore they took more care with the mastering process. Take that same mastered content and in double blind testing 99.9% (probably 100% actually) of people cannot tell the difference between regular 16/44 or 24/96 or DSD or 24/192 or 32/192. It's all in your mind.

so if i'm not using mqa dac hardware, on tidal hi res, i only can reach 24/96
but if i have mqa dac the tidal can reach 24/192
am i right?

so basiclly D90 standard and MQA Version
if play spotify/apple = will got the same results? although 32bit or 24bit..

anyway is that true d90 standard have 32bit and mqa version limit to 24bit ?
are there any technical downsides to the MQA version of the D90 compared to the regular version ?

My experience with xlr (and other cables) is that the shielding of the cable and its connectors must be good. My thumbrule is to have shortest possible, but still practical, length. I use Supra Lo Rad cables which are not expensive and You can order them in any length You need. They are well shielded and have good connectors.

0,25 meter rca to rca topping with 26$
1meter xlr cables with 5$
0,5meter xlr cables with 54$
1meter xlr cables with 56$
which one should i buy?

1meter vs 0,5meter is it matters? or same quality result?
it's a little hard to find cheaper 0,5meter xlr, they usually sell 1meter minimum

 

[jason.voegele]

@JohnYang1997, are there any technical downsides to the MQA version of the D90 compared to the regular version? The reason I am asking is because I am able to pick up the MQA version locally in Canada and I would not have to wait for shipping from China. I sometimes listen to the MQA versions of songs on Tidal but don't really care about the format particularly.

I asked a similar question to Topping support. Here was my inquiry:

Hi, I am comparing the two Topping D90 DACs: regular edition and MQA edition.

Obviously, the MQA edition adds support for MQA that the regular edition does not have, but I am wondering if the MQA edition processing of non-MQA files is any different at all from the regular edition?

I have read the review and measurements of the D90 regular edition here: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ds/topping-d90-balanced-usb-dac-review.10519/

Would those measurements differ in any way for the MQA edition of the D90 DAC? I mean when playing non-MQA content, of course.

Here is their response:

As we know, the MQA file is a "folded" file. Therefore, the only difference between processing MQA data stream and non-MQA data stream is that MQA data stream need to be "unfolded". After "unfolded", the MQA data stream is no different from the non-MQA data stream. Therefore, when processing with non-MQA data stream, there is almost no differences between the D90 MQA version and the D90 standard version.

 

[fendy323]

I asked a similar question to Topping support. Here was my inquiry:

Here is their response:

so bottom line MQA version is NO technical downsides then regular version? especially playing non-MQA content
and the mqa version only plus mqa features? just it ?

 

[jason.voegele]

so bottom line MQA version is NO technical downsides then regular version? especially playing non-MQA content
and the mqa version only plus mqa features? just it ?

That's basically correct, but the MQA version does use a different USB chip than the standard version does, and some people have reported problems with the USB chip in the MQA version.

If I were you, I would get the standard version if you are not planning on using Tidal.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I purchased the D90 MQA version because I do use Tidal, and I have not experienced any problems whatsoever. I think the D90 paired with my Monoprice THX AAA 887 headphone amp sounds fantastic!

 

[Veri]

I'd rather get the D90 non-MQA and use Roon if you want (software) unfolding. Use the money saved on non-MQA and put it into Roon

 

[EchoChamber]

EDIT: Just to be clear, I purchased the D90 MQA version because I do use Tidal, and I have not experienced any problems whatsoever. I think the D90 paired with my Monoprice THX AAA 887 headphone amp sounds fantastic!

I second that, I have absolutely ZERO issues with my D90 MQA. USB works perfectly with my work MacBook Pro (2019), fanless Hackintosh (Roon server) and Pi 3B+ (native DSD). It sounds awesome and I find that in general Tidal Master files sound amazing.

And yeah, Roon is also awesome, it works really well in giving me one single source for everything I listen to anywhere in my home. It seamlessly gives me access to the CDs I've (losslessly) ripped eons ago together with Tidal streaming. And it oversamples and DSDs - with the D90, I've been DSDing a lot.

With that dose of enthusiastic praise, I'd recommend to just buy one, be happy and enjoy your music. If $100 is not an issue, get the MQA (that was my reasoning) :-D