Well I know many, but if you don’t: Tears. People who put it on at home. People who play an instrument or dedicate their lives/retirement to studying it. People who have concert *subscription* series.
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A millennial's rant on classical music
- Thread starter Fluffy
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Well I know many, but if you don’t: Tears. People who put it on at home. People who play an instrument or dedicate their lives/retirement to studying it. People who have concert *subscription* series.
Yeah, I'm also a "millennial" and I find that I really enjoy classical, but it's more of a mood and timing thing; at certain times of the day or night, and when I want to slow things down mentally and focus on the music, then I put classical records on. A big part of it is finding composers, conductors, orchestra's, and record companies that you enjoy, and listen to those. For example I collect Deutsche Grammophon, with Herbert von Karajan and the Berlin Philharmonic orchestra playing Beethoven, Mozart, and Schubert. So that goes to say that the quality and provenance of the recording and personnel involved makes a difference.
I recently started listening to classical music again, and I found that I really appreciate the complexity of the music, and how good it sounds with a Hi-Fi system.
For what it’s worth, some pieces that were “gateway drugs” for me:
Mozart Clarinet Concerto (but I played clarinet as a kid)
Ravel Sonatine
Schumann Carnaval
Bach Partitas
I would suggest the Sonatine.
Mozart Clarinet Concerto (but I played clarinet as a kid)
Ravel Sonatine
Schumann Carnaval
Bach Partitas
I would suggest the Sonatine.
Again, there are people who dedicate their lives to being a clown in a circus, but all they do is scare children.
I don’t know where to take this conversation or what that means, specifically. We have to go pretty deep to understand fully when people are pretending to like things or “genuinely” like them, and how the lines blur over time and application. If you keep doing something, that is what economists call “revealed preference”. Apparently I have a revealed preference for posting on this thread, although it is sort of giving me agita. Time for some wine and Scarlatti.
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And again there are folks that can't wait to go to a Diana Krall concert, that scares me. Last week I came across her in what looked like semi-Dominatrix gear.
BTW If you want to check out the definitive evil clown meme for us boomers...
I thought it was more like
"I don't want anything to do with music Mommy and Daddy might like, but I need a reason that sounds intelligent, at least to someone who doesn't know anything about music."
Tks
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As a music theory illiterate.. I can tell you why I mainly like classical. It's like listening to a story being told. While most modern music is a portion of a story told three times, with a beat you can dance to while ignoring the text if needed. Also classical can invoke the 'feels' sometimes pretty heavily, while modern music usually needs to specifically have genre's for it like R&B, Blues, etc...
Though, that's not to say I listen to mostly classical, heck, I barely know any classical music by name (just fire up a section on Amazon Music's classical section and have a nice time personally). But like most genre's it's like food as you grow up. You simply get bored of eating a plain chocolate bar, and eventually start liking the change of piece with almonds in some chocolate, and then some days you feel like eating some cranberry dark chocolate (that I'd vomit from the smell of as a kid, let alone eat with any semblance of pleasure).
We're the same age so it's not like I'm some old dude that's speaking to you in some alien language of a time unrecognizable to you.
One thing I really like, and I feel you may also, is Neo-Classical. That stuff is awesome as it blends into Ambient sometimes (if you like that).
Though, that's not to say I listen to mostly classical, heck, I barely know any classical music by name (just fire up a section on Amazon Music's classical section and have a nice time personally). But like most genre's it's like food as you grow up. You simply get bored of eating a plain chocolate bar, and eventually start liking the change of piece with almonds in some chocolate, and then some days you feel like eating some cranberry dark chocolate (that I'd vomit from the smell of as a kid, let alone eat with any semblance of pleasure).
We're the same age so it's not like I'm some old dude that's speaking to you in some alien language of a time unrecognizable to you.
One thing I really like, and I feel you may also, is Neo-Classical. That stuff is awesome as it blends into Ambient sometimes (if you like that).
Zog
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Thank you for the compliment.
The typo "Rites" - I think it is usually translated as "Rite", but I do not speak French - reminds me of my yoof. I was attempting to ingratiate myself with my potential mother-in-law. I felt at the time that if I could display my musical erudition that would put me in a good light. I told her that I enjoyed Stravinsky and in particular The Rite of Spring. Well ... I got put in my place! I was corrected and it was explained to me that it was not the Rite of Spring but it was The Riot of Spring. Yes it is true - I promise! At this point I should have cut my losses and retreated with my tail between my legs. Unfortunately I made an attempt to defend myself. More unfortunately I did not have the skill to debate the issue with anything more than repetition. That often works, but not in this case. The Matron / Dragon likewise did not have the necessary skill set. The debate continued along the lines of Yes No Yes No Yes No ... I had to give up. The only consolation is that I did detect a flicker of doubt on her face. I suppose it is mildly ironic that The Riot of Spring would actually not be such a bad title.
Another TY for the Copland reference.
Robin L
Master Contributor
There's a famous sequence in Gravity's Rainbow where a drug dealer argues with a composer, said dealer thinking Rossini is superior to Beethoven because Rossini is more fun. The composer claims Beethoven is superior due to musical evolution, which leads to the Second Viennese School. I guess you have to read it, too long to quote. But Saure Bummer makes a valid point, if you're not enjoying yourself, what's the point?
Just so you know, I really enjoy Beethoven. But I don't think it's for everybody. Yoko Ono, now that's for everybody.
Robin L
Master Contributor
Beethoven churned out arrangements of Scotch and Irish folk songs by the bucket load 'cause that's how he got paid at the time. You can have the lot of them. And I vote for Ian Dury and the Blockheads.
digicidal
Major Contributor
And then there are those that merely choose it for a "second act" in their lives:
https://www.youtube.com/user/PuddlesPityParty
It's definitely not your average movie... I believe it was entirely self produced and is low film quality - but there's a ton of surreal imagery while still being somewhat believable. The chemistry between Glover and Hesseman is great, and it shines a light on the irrationality of so many broadly accepted aspects of society (like how we handle death, social situations, MLM "entrepreneurs", etc.).
Re: the later posts. I find it unsurprising, but discomforting, how often discussions of musical preference mirror those involving politics and religion.
I guess that's the human condition, no matter how subjective and irrational our connection to things is, it's so very personal. So it's far too easy to take criticism of the subject of that preference personally as well.
I guess being a metal head in a world full of country and R&B fans makes me somewhat less easily offended by such - although maybe that's a large part of the appeal as well. 
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Now I'm going to have to go listen to some country metal and soul metal music!
I am not a big jazz fan either and love Schubert (the first piece of non-rock music I learned was his 9th symphony in 1970) and Bruckner (and many composers contemporary with him) but I have bought quite a few jazz records over the decades.
I bought Miles Davis "Bitches Brew" when it came out - probably because of the album artwork - and listened to it a lot at one time but probably haven't played it in 30 years.
I have others but almost never play them.
It is a bit like country and western for me, I like a very small number of the pieces I have heard but the vast majority turn me off.
Iv seen gogo penguin they were brilliant. There's a part of me that just loves hearing instruments played well together almost despite the music . I love jazz clubs , if the performers are enjoying it I most likely will also.
My taste in music is free of the constrains of genres .
We still have people saying that they like "classical". Presumably they also like "non-classical". So they pretty much like all music.
Except that no one says they like non-classical. Instead they tell you directly which genres of non-classical they like - or maybe they're even more specific than that. So why are people so easily prepared to say they like "classical"?
It looks as though they regard "classical" as a monolith; something they like as a whole, or reject. And it is an aspiration for many to learn how to like this 'blob' of high culture.
Except that no one says they like non-classical. Instead they tell you directly which genres of non-classical they like - or maybe they're even more specific than that. So why are people so easily prepared to say they like "classical"?
It looks as though they regard "classical" as a monolith; something they like as a whole, or reject. And it is an aspiration for many to learn how to like this 'blob' of high culture.
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Unfortunately many classical music aficionados I have known deserve the satirical snobby put-down as depicted by Niles and Frasier Crane in the Frasier TV series. Narrow minded musical taste, snobbish superiority and condescension in spades.
Those interested in other genres may not like classical music much but are typically indifferent to it rather than condemning.
Those interested in other genres may not like classical music much but are typically indifferent to it rather than condemning.
digicidal
Major Contributor
Well, I like all music - but I think "classical" as a genre is not as monolithic as you propose... it certainly isn't for me. I love the sound of a string ensemble, but not brass (sorry @DonH56 ). I have the same problem with jazz... if you have one or two horns it's fine... but if there's a whole section I get pretty squirmy. I like most concertos but not many waltzes... and, as would be expected I suppose from the prior statements... symphonies are a bit of a mixed bag to me.
To me the real distinction with orchestral music (which I would always call "classical" even if they're playing Metallica) - there is just something very unique about dozens of musicians playing as one. I think that's part of where the larger cultural/class aspects start coming into play. Although any great band will have a natural synergy - it's much easier with 4-8 people than with 40+. Everyone must cooperate, must be accomplished at playing, but at the same time - must be willing to become subservient (in a manner of speaking) to the composer first and the conductor second.
That's a significant departure from most modern musicians and groups - where ego, creativity, and individuality are more distinctly valued and rewarded. I think there is also a sense of the "aspirational" as you put it centered around classical music from the participants as well. Although there are exceptions in anything - in general, I would say your "average musician" in an orchestra has a higher level of education, a greater understanding of music history and theory, and can read music. I would not say the same about your average member of a 4-5 piece rock band or jazz ensemble. Subsequently I would virtually guarantee the opposite holds true for all but a rare exception in trance, rap, or pop music (current top40 style stuff).
Probably also shows my bias and perhaps ignorance in those generalizations... but I can't think of many exceptions.
). I have the same problem with jazz... if you have one or two horns it's fine... but if there's a whole section I get pretty squirmy. I like most concertos but not many waltzes... and, as would be expected I suppose from the prior statements... symphonies are a bit of a mixed bag to me.To me the real distinction with orchestral music (which I would always call "classical" even if they're playing Metallica) - there is just something very unique about dozens of musicians playing as one. I think that's part of where the larger cultural/class aspects start coming into play. Although any great band will have a natural synergy - it's much easier with 4-8 people than with 40+. Everyone must cooperate, must be accomplished at playing, but at the same time - must be willing to become subservient (in a manner of speaking) to the composer first and the conductor second.
That's a significant departure from most modern musicians and groups - where ego, creativity, and individuality are more distinctly valued and rewarded. I think there is also a sense of the "aspirational" as you put it centered around classical music from the participants as well. Although there are exceptions in anything - in general, I would say your "average musician" in an orchestra has a higher level of education, a greater understanding of music history and theory, and can read music. I would not say the same about your average member of a 4-5 piece rock band or jazz ensemble. Subsequently I would virtually guarantee the opposite holds true for all but a rare exception in trance, rap, or pop music (current top40 style stuff).
Probably also shows my bias and perhaps ignorance in those generalizations... but I can't think of many exceptions.
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Robin L
Master Contributor
Well, that's like, just your opinion, man.
Specifically, I like a whole lot of Beethoven's instrumental music, have multiple complete sets of the piano sonatas, string quartets, symphonies, concerti. Probably play those more than anything else save Bob Dylan. Got a box with all of Beethoven's compositions, not yet ripped to computer/DAP. Lots of Schubert's instrumental music. Lots of Haydn, Mozart. Plenty of French Baroque, plenty of Marais and Couperin [Le Grand, don't care as much for his uncle], lots of lute recordings by Hopkinson Smith. Plenty of Bach, with multiple sets of the Well Tempered Clavier, played very frequently, cello suites, sonatas and partitas for violin, lute suites, cantatas, Mass in B minor, St Matthew Passion, Brandenburgs, Goldbergs, Art of Fugue [did you know Robert Fripp made a recording?]. Love the old RCA Living Stereo series, mostly Romantic era Warhorses, have the bulk of them on SACD. Some 20th century stuff, like Stravinsky, Prokofiev, Bartok, Glass/Reich/Reilly/Adams. Though I don't have much representation on my little player right now, my favorite 20th century composer is Iannis Xenakis with his extraordinary harsh soundscapes, musique concrete and suchlike. There's vocal recitals I don't listen to much anymore, plenty of obscure 20th century music, lots of John Dowland [16/17th century British shoegazer], some medieval. Bulgarian folk tunes in choral arrangements a particular interest.
It's not an amorphous blob of high culture, it's music I like and play repeatedly. Then again, I did "DJ" classical music on radio, and functioned as recording "engineer" for about a decade, almost exclusively classical. I think I used to be a snob, but my love of American Roots music is the opposite of snobbish, that's the kind of music I actually play. Kinda difficult being snobbish around Charlie Poole, Hank Williams or Sturgill Simpson.
Do I contradict myself? Very well, then I contradict myself, I am large, I contain multitudes.
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