Vandersteen VLR Speaker Review

[krabapple]

and audiophiles still cream over this brand

 

[MarkS]

Yes, it's interesting how many people like the sound of speakers that measure terribly.

 

[Toni Mas]

Yes, it's interesting how many people like the sound of speakers that measure terribly.

Well soundwise, there are quite different ways of measuring "terrible"... Also many ways of measuring uninspiringly "fine"...

Some would easily jump to the conclusion that loudspeaker measurements are a hopeless waste of time...

 

[amirm]

Yes, it's interesting how many people like the sound of speakers that measure terribly.

With so little measurement and knowledge of the same for speakers, it is no wonder people buy whatever is out there based on brand reputation, empty reviews and such.

 

[MarkS]

But I would think the average Vendersteen customer is an audio enthusiast who listens before buying ... these are mostly people who claim to hear tons of stuff that isn't there (eg cable effects), but also apparently can't hear stuff that is ...

 

[DMill]

But I would think the average Vendersteen customer is an audio enthusiast who listens before buying ... these are mostly people who claim to hear tons of stuff that isn't there (eg cable effects), but also apparently can't hear stuff that is ...

I wonder. I live in decent size city in Rochester NY. I would have to drive to Buffalo (60 miles). Maybe Toronto (150 miles) or NYC (300ish miles) to hear them. Not even sure anyone in Buffalo has them, but maybe. And even then, I’ve never had a decent showroom experience when buying a speaker. It’s so hard to get anything more than initial impressions before the sales guy is comparing the speakers to his sound system in his VW scirocco in the 80s. I think most buy Vandersteen based on reputation now.

 

[Penelinfi]

The simple fact of the woofer being “on” the baffle instead of flush is an almost immediate sign that the response will be jagged. Even moreso with the frame being cut to fit on the sides

Perhaps it measures better with the grill on? Erin recently measured the Wharfedale Linton which was good with the grill on.

 

[Katji]

But I would think the average Vendersteen customer is an audio enthusiast who listens before buying ... these are mostly people who claim to hear tons of stuff that isn't there (eg cable effects), but also apparently can't hear stuff that is ...

That says something about humans. That's probably why we invent things, and other animals don't.

Hey, someone should set up a cat as a hi-fi reviewer on youtube. Probably get a huge following.

 

[Katji]

Perhaps it measures better with the grill on? Erin recently measured the Wharfedale Linton which was good with the grill on.

Something to do with directivity and dispersion. ...Sure it's been researched.

 

[MZKM]

Perhaps it measures better with the grill on? Erin recently measured the Wharfedale Linton which was good with the grill on.

Maybe on those left/right sides, but then the top/bottom would still have issues.

 

[Ilkless]

Interestingly, they have the same kind of directivity issues:
View attachment 216332
The issues are pushed up quite a bit higher in frequency though, so that is a major plus.

Almost all coaxials except the current Genelec and KEF ones have some upper dispersion issues, although the above KS one at around 10 kHz (similar to the Kali Audio one) cannot be compared and is by far not as problematic and audible like the directvity missmatch of this Vandersteen between 1 and 4 kHz which could be corrected to a big part with a better crossover design.

I will also add that that's a polar map normalised to on-axis FR (i e. It shows the deviation from on-axis at a certain angle, rather than the actual magnitude response at the angle). Which means the on-axis null at 10kHz, which is common to any coax short of the SOTA proprietary ones, looks worse than it is. Even TAD coaxs have a little bit of it. Actual off-axis curves will show a null at 10kHz rapidly filling in, leading to a much flatter listening window and ER than the normalised polar map implies.

BTW, part of me really wants that KS Digital speaker even though a Neumann or Genelec might be a smarter buy - just because I really respect and wish to support small manufacturers that make interesting, competent speakers with an interesting set of features at a good price. They can't be earning much with a custom SEAS Prestige coax (Kevlar cone instead of polypropylene like the retail version), manufacturing in Germany, 2 class D amplifiers per speaker, FIR DSP (which supports PEQ internally so you can actually use a Kii Control-style wired remote control to input 6 PEQ bands) and thoughtful industrial design with the adjustable base.

A KH120/8330 would have lower IMD, higher max SPL but it won't be coax. And better coax drivers in that price segment (essentially only KEF) are either passive or are overly packed with lifestyle features. (KEF LS50WII, LSXII...)

 

[TimoJ]

Maybe on those left/right sides, but then the top/bottom would still have issues.

The grill seems to be made of thick material and covers the whole front panel around the speaker element. So was this measured with grill on? @amirm
I found this picture:

 

[Katji]

Old model Vandersteen has a sock over it instead of a grille.

 

[MarkS]

The grill seems to be made of thick material and covers the whole front panel around the speaker element. So was this measured with grill on? @amirm
I found this picture:

View attachment 218083

Amir's graphs say "no grill".

OK, this is upsetting.

Clearly this speaker is designed to be used with the grille on. It should be measured that way!

 

[Head_Unit]

The simple fact of the woofer being “on” the baffle instead of flush is an almost immediate sign that the response will be jagged. Even moreso with the frame being cut to fit on the sides

Does the grille fit tight around the woofer, making the whole thing flush? (I've never seen such a thing but one can always hope, and that's what I kind of understand from @TimoJ's post. Any pictures of the grille?)
Anyway this looks like it's one of those SEAS coaxial drivers-the high frequency response is spiky as an 80s punk band's hair, and the tweeter level way high compared to the woofer. I never understood how a company capable of making such fine woofers and tweeters could produce such [vomit emoji][back end of a cow emoji]

 

[MarkS]

It sure looks that way from the picture. And I have seen such things before.

 

[raindance]

Does the grille fit tight around the woofer, making the whole thing flush? (I've never seen such a thing but one can always hope, and that's what I kind of understand from @TimoJ's post. Any pictures of the grille?)
Anyway this looks like it's one of those SEAS coaxial drivers-the high frequency response is spiky as an 80s punk band's hair, and the tweeter level way high compared to the woofer. I never understood how a company capable of making such fine woofers and tweeters could produce such [vomit emoji][back end of a cow emoji]

Yes, it fits very snugly around the drive unit and makes the front face flat.

 

[tvih]

You could say it's a baffling design...

 

[MarkS]

Or you could say (correctly!) that it's good design.

What's "baffling" is how few speakers have grille designs that do not damage the sound.

 

[DMill]

Or you could say (correctly!) that it's good design.

What's "baffling" is how few speakers have grille designs that do not damage the sound.

It certainly seems they might measure better with the grill.