Most Cost Efficient Most Well Reviewed 2.1 Set Up w/ Separates

[fundles]

I have learned so much reading through the Forums, and I feel it is time to get rid of my Kef LS50 Wireless IIs and start building a 2.1 system with a wider sound stage.
I love a good price/performance product and here is what I am thinking about in terms of putting together a system made of separates that have been reviewed really well here. I mostly stream music these days.

Speakers - Revel M16 Concerta2 - $625 (Open-box already ordered)
Amp - Hypex NC252MP from Buckeyes - $580
Monolith by Monoprice M-10 V2 10in - $575
DAC - Topping D30 Pro - $400
FiiO BTA30 PRO Wireless Transmitter - $120

Are there better cost saving alternatives at will give me great results but wont force me into a DIY solution? I want to eventually proceed to tower speakers and chose the Buckeyes amp for future power handling. My wife is a minimalist so these separates will need to be sitting behind an enclosure.

Also do I connect the FiiO wireless transmitter to the DAC through the optical or coax?

Thanks all!

 

[dominikz]

DAC - Topping D30 Pro - $400
FiiO BTA30 PRO Wireless Transmitter - $120

Instead of these I'd go for the miniDSP Flex so I have room EQ capability and have more control on subwoofer integration (you'll also need a mic).

BTW I use my M16s with a single SVS SB-1000 sub and enjoy them very much!

 

[fundles]

Instead of these I'd go for the miniDSP Flex so I have room EQ capability and have more control on subwoofer integration (you'll also need a mic).

BTW I use my M16s with a single SVS SB-1000 sub and enjoy them very much!

Both great recommendations!!!

I did look at the miniDSP Flex, but I must have missed the BT capability of it. I will take your advice and replace my options with it.
I have seen the SB-1000 on sale for $400, so that can save me some money also.

 

[TurtlePaul]

I think that it is a little bit (maybe a lot) silly to buy a Hypex and D30 if you are going to be powering M16s and a Monoprice sub. $1000 on amps really isnt cost efficient in the m16, even understanding the upgrade story. Much more on electronics than mains is inefficient budgeting.

I also agree with the previous comment that room EQ capability pays well above its weight in cost efficiency. However in this price bracket, I think a UMIK-1 with REW is $100 well spent.

 

[TurtlePaul]

Also forgot to mention: using an AVR or MiniDSP is optimal because those m16 will need a high-pass filter.

 

[AudioAaron]

However in this price bracket, I think a UMIK-1 with REW is $100 well spent.

Great point; I'd budget $100 for the UMIK-1.

I have a D30 Pro, Buckey Amp and Monolith 10" sub - no complaints with any of them.

 

[TurtlePaul]

I have a D30 Pro, Buckey Amp and Monolith 10" sub - no complaints with any of them.

Those are all good products individually. However, the best returns come from better speakers and I feel that with the $2,300 total budget it would be possible to squeeze the electronics budget to a shoestring and get m105 or m106 class of speakers. Those performa 3 speakers out-measure the Concerta 2 line by quite a bit, both in regards to flat frequency response and much lower distortion. I think that M106 with a yard sale AVR would outperform the M16 with those electronics - the speaker drivers are that important.

I think those electronics would make more sense if the speakers they were driving were the F208. That way the electronics would be 10-20% of the total system cost.

 

[chych7]

I'd lay off the excess electronics on your budget and focus on things that matter. Go with a cheaper AMP (like the Aiyima A07), and skip the DAC. You're treading in the space of spending lots of money on very slight (if any) audible changes, instead of focusing on things that have large audible changes.

I suggest getting a miniDSP 2x4HD + UMIK1 ($300) for subwoofer integration, especially since you don't have a proper low/high pass crossover in this system (but you still won't have a high pass for the speakers... that's fine, good integration can still be done with the miniDSP on the subwoofer end). This way you can also account for room effects, which is going to have way more impact than say a Hypex over the A07, or a better DAC. Grab some room treatments while you're at it.

 

[fundles]

I'd lay off the excess electronics on your budget and focus on things that matter. Go with a cheaper AMP (like the Aiyima A07), and skip the DAC. You're treading in the space of spending lots of money on very slight (if any) audible changes, instead of focusing on things that have large audible changes.

I suggest getting a miniDSP 2x4HD + UMIK1 ($300) for subwoofer integration, especially since you don't have a proper low/high pass crossover in this system (but you still won't have a high pass for the speakers... that's fine, good integration can still be done with the miniDSP on the subwoofer end). This way you can also account for room effects, which is going to have way more impact than say a Hypex over the A07, or a better DAC. Grab some room treatments while you're at it.

Is there an in-between for the Hypex and the Aiyima A07 in terms of price/performance? I found the Topping PA5 that costs $350. Seems better built for the voltage. Let me if I am not going to notice a difference when hooking up a Revel M105/M106 or a Kef Q950.

So what is left is a DAC and Mic. The Topping DX3 Pro+ seems like a good match for the PA5. It is actually cheaper than the miniDSP 2X4HD and it comes with BT for $200

Focal Aria 906 - $1600
Revel M106 - $1840
Revel M105 - $1380 - Seems like a really great price.

Subwoofer - SVS SB-1000 - $400

Amp - Topping PA5 - $350
DAC - Topping DX3 Pro+ - $200
Mic - UMIK1 - $135

Am I missing anything??? Thanks for the help!

 

[dominikz]

To give a bit of counterpoint to some other posters, I'd personally select the electronics based on features you need and ease of use / ergonomics, rather than the relation in price vs loudspeakers. Features and ergonomics are IMO important selection criteria, and not all come cheap

If you need a box with preamp capabilities, display, EQ/crossover and bluetooth, I'm not sure you can get it for cheaper than the miniDSP Flex. If you don't need the display nor BT, the miniDSP 2x4 HD is a cheaper alternative. Either of these devices have built-in DACs and preamps so you wouldn't need to buy those separately.
Lastly if you plan to use PC as a source you might also be able to get away just with a PC with EAPO, without additional devices.

The power amp you could of course get cheaper than the Buckeye Hypex NC252MP, but if you need 2x 250W to sustain your planned SPLs then it could still be a good option.
If you don't need a lot of power/SPL, then you might even be happy with something like a Topping PA3s (2x65W @ 1% THD at 4 Ohm).
Note that I'm powering my M16s with a relatively low power amp (2x70W @ 1% THD at 4 Ohm) and have no issue when listening at medium/comfortable SPL (listening distance 2,3m; room volume 46m3; in a residential apartment building).

On loudspeaker measurements, IMHO M105/M106 mainly beat the M16 on distortion and I suspect consequently on max SPL handling. The spins are actually quite similar, and with EQ become even more so (source, you can select 'asr_eq' under 'version'):

Notice that, surprisingly, the M16 seems to have slightly smoother directivity vs M106.

Hope this helps!

 

[dominikz]

Both great recommendations!!!

I did look at the miniDSP Flex, but I must have missed the BT capability of it. I will take your advice and replace my options with it.
I have seen the SB-1000 on sale for $400, so that can save me some money also.

Regarding subwoofer choice: may I suggest to look at the amazing subwoofer sheet by @sweetchaos.
The Monoprice Monolith M-10 v2 seems to be a better (more powerful sub) vs SVS SB-1000. I'd suggest to choose based on your price constraint, room size and desired SPLs. The sheet provides also some guidelines through the "Bassaholic" rank.

 

[Actungz]

Is there an in-between for the Hypex and the Aiyima A07 in terms of price/performance? I found the Topping PA5 that costs $350. Seems better built for the voltage. Let me if I am not going to notice a difference when hooking up a Revel M105/M106 or a Kef Q950.

So what is left is a DAC and Mic. The Topping E50 seems like a good match for the PA5.

Focal Aria 906 - $1600
Revel M106 - $1840
Revel M105 - $1380 - Seems like a really great price.

Subwoofer - SVS SB-1000 - $400

Amp - Topping PA5 - $350
DAC - Topping E50 - $250
FiiO BTA30 PRO Wireless Transmitter - $120
Mic - UMIK1 - $135

Am I missing anything??? Thanks for the help!

If you get the miniDSP Flex you don’t need the FiiO anymore right? So you could combine that with the dac budget for a room correction device that can do bass management and EQ. You do need to pay $75 more for the balanced TRS outputs but they would pair with the pa5 nicely.

Where are you seeing $135 for the umik1? I thought it was $90 on miniDSPs website.

Sometimes I feel like a miniDSP shill but that’s only because if I had a higher budget I would 100% get one for myself.

 

[dominikz]

If you get the miniDSP Flex you don’t need the FiiO anymore right? So you could combine that with the dac budget for a room correction device that can do bass management and EQ. You do need to pay $75 more for the balanced TRS outputs but they would pair with the pa5 nicely.

Where are you seeing $135 for the umik1? I thought it was $90 on miniDSPs website.

Sometimes I feel like a miniDSP shill but that’s only because if I had a higher budget I would 100% get one for myself.

Looks like UMIK-1 is 75$ if you buy it bundled together with the Flex from minidsp.com:

 

[fundles]

Regarding subwoofer choice: may I suggest to look at the amazing subwoofer sheet by @sweetchaos.
The Monoprice Monolith M-10 v2 seems to be a better (more powerful sub) vs SVS SB-1000. I'd suggest to choose based on your price constraint, room size and desired SPLs. The sheet provides also some guidelines through the "Bassaholic" rank.

I was once told to never wake a sleeping baby. I think I will be safer with the SVS's 300W vs the Monolith's 500W.

If you get the miniDSP Flex you don’t need the FiiO anymore right? So you could combine that with the dac budget for a room correction device that can do bass management and EQ. You do need to pay $75 more for the balanced TRS outputs but they would pair with the pa5 nicely.

Where are you seeing $135 for the umik1? I thought it was $90 on miniDSPs website.

Sometimes I feel like a miniDSP shill but that’s only because if I had a higher budget I would 100% get one for myself.

Sorry, I edited my response minutes afterwards when I found out about the Topping DX3 Pro+. It seems to be the most cost effective option since it will pair nicely with the Topping PA5 and gives me BT all for $200.

 

[Actungz]

Looks like UMIK-1 is 75$ if you buy it bundled together with the Flex from minidsp.com:
View attachment 194854

Oh yes $75 not $90 my bad

 

[Actungz]

Sorry, I edited my response minutes afterwards when I found out about the Topping DX3 Pro+. It seems to be the most cost effective option since it will pair nicely with the Topping PA5 and gives me BT all for $200.

That’s a good plan! If you use android I believe you can have system wide parametric eq too, so both of your sources (pc, bluetooth) can benefit from the umik 1.

 

[dominikz]

That’s a good plan! If you use android I believe you can have system wide parametric eq too, so both of your sources (pc, bluetooth) can benefit from the umik 1.

Just note that the Android native one-octave band graphic EQ would not have enough resolution for room EQ.

Parametric EQs for Android exist, but some may be a bit more difficult to get system-wide. I played earlier a bit with Android EQ options with a rooted FireTV stick running LineageOS and Viper4Android (thread here) but in the end decided to go for miniDSP OpenDRC-DI instead for better ergonomics and reliability.
FireTV conversion was a nice little hobby project (and it worked!), but I found it was not very user-friendly nor a set-and-forget solution. It also couldn't handle all of my sources.
With miniDSP it is much better, but still it means several boxes and a lot of connections (and still not covering all of my sources). So at the moment for me miniDSP Flex + stereo amp seems like a relatively simple solution in comparison.

Really I feel there are too few integrated stereo solutions on the market (e.g. all-in-one remote controlled preamp+DSP+DAC+amp) that incorporate some automated or manual parametric EQ capabilities - and those that do are typically not cheap.

BTW, you might also wish to think what sources you want to connect (e.g. TV, PC, BT, turntable, streams...) before selecting your DAC/preamp/receiver, and also how you will switch between the various sources.

 

[Actungz]

Just note that the Android native one-octave band graphic EQ would not have enough resolution for room EQ.

Parametric EQs for Android exist, but some may be a bit more difficult to get system-wide. I played earlier a bit with Android EQ options with a rooted FireTV stick running LineageOS and Viper4Android (thread here) but in the end decided to go for miniDSP OpenDRC-DI instead for better ergonomics and reliability.
FireTV conversion was a nice little hobby project (and it worked!), but I found it was not very user-friendly nor a set-and-forget solution. It also couldn't handle all of my sources.
With miniDSP it is much better, but still it means several boxes and a lot of connections (and still not covering all of my sources). So at the moment for me miniDSP Flex + stereo amp seems like a relatively simple solution in comparison.

Really I feel there are too few integrated stereo solutions on the market (e.g. all-in-one remote controlled preamp+DSP+DAC+amp) that incorporate some automated or manual parametric EQ capabilities - and those that do are typically not cheap.

BTW, you might also wish to think what sources you want to connect (e.g. TV, PC, BT, turntable, streams...) before selecting your DAC/preamp/receiver, and also how you will switch between the various sources.

Those are some really good points, and I especially agree on the point regarding user friendliness. Sometimes after tinkering with my diy solutions all I want is just a single box that does what it does, even if it means I have to pay a slight premium.

On the point about too few all-in-one integrated amps, I don’t understand why Denon/Marantz don’t release a 2 channel only version of their AVR’s with Audessey. For example, Denon’s cheapest receiver with MultEQ XT is the X1700h @ $699. Why can’t they chop off 5 of those amps along the video components and sell it for maybe $499, $599? Or heck just charge the same $699 but put it in a smaller box that actually fits on a desk and doesn’t look ridiculous.

I understand the economy of scale argument that AVR manufactures actually won’t save much on production costs stripping away the features, and they probably determined that the demand for such a product just isn’t strong enough, but it seems to me that they’re not making this product because they think less people will buy their receivers instead.

(??? Idk I’m just speculating, I honestly don’t believe the buyers of these 2 groups overlap that much. Those who want a home theatre will buy the AVR regardless, and those who want a smaller box still aren’t going to have space for a huge receiver).

Anyways that was just my pent up frustration over how expensive the miniDSP SHD Power is lol. I’m probably going to get the Flex some time in the future, and have it handle all my inputs. Luckily I only have three sources (Airplay 2 from airport express, Sonos S2 controller from a Sonos Connect, my MacBook) all via optical, and I found an automatic Toslink switch that will be able to feed the input on the Flex without me having to ever touch the remote.

How many sources do you have? If you have a lot of devices outputting optical, an automatic Toslink switch could be the solution.

 

[dominikz]

On the point about too few all-in-one integrated amps, I don’t understand why Denon/Marantz don’t release a 2 channel only version of their AVR’s with Audessey. For example, Denon’s cheapest receiver with MultEQ XT is the X1700h @ $699. Why can’t they chop off 5 of those amps along the video components and sell it for maybe $499, $599? Or heck just charge the same $699 but put it in a smaller box that actually fits on a desk and doesn’t look ridiculous.

I understand the economy of scale argument that AVR manufactures actually won’t save much on production costs stripping away the features, and they probably determined that the demand for such a product just isn’t strong enough, but it seems to me that they’re not making this product because they think less people will buy their receivers instead.

Yeah.. I feel your pain I guess that just not too many people are after DSP in stereo. Which is perhaps a bit strange - given that audiophiles are into stereo, and IMHO room EQ and proper subwoofer management is one of the biggest contributors to sound quality

Due to these reasons + benefits of multi-channel, my long-term goal is to go for one of the better AVRs. But that will only make sense when I have the space to put more loudspeakers.

How many sources do you have? If you have a lot of devices outputting optical, an automatic Toslink switch could be the solution.

I thought about that as well for a while. But at the moment I have:

1. TV (digital, optical into OpenDRC-DI)
2. Chromecast Audio (digital, via optical to coax adapter into OpenDRC-DI)
3. Turntable (RIAA compensated analog line out to ADC coax output, into impedance converter to AES input of OpenDRC-DI)

This allows me to switch all the external sources with the OpenDRC-DI remote and works quite well.
This is all then going into the optical input of the Denon CEOL N9 integrated stereo system, which is feeding the M16 and the sub. Unfortunately that means I have no DSP for sources internal to the Denon unit (like internet radio, CD, streaming or FM). There's always some compromise
Luckily I mostly use the 3 sources above so it is not a big problem for me!

@fundles Sorry for the offtopic! Hope you still found some of the information interesting.

 

[MoStyles]

I was in the same boat trying to piece meal a system together with Chinese topping preamp, DAC, bluetooth, power amp, bass management, eq… I wanted various ways to stream from phone, computer and play CDs. After I ended up totaling it all out I figured my budget allowed for a really nice intergrated amp (plus a CD player) for the same price. I bought a Rotel A12 (+CD11) with everything I needed. Amazing wolfson DAC with 4 digital inputs. Direct usb for iPhone/iPad and a usb B for pc connection if I want even higher rez audio. Not to mention remote control for everything and a supper clean 60w amp at 8 ohms. They are highly underrated amps and push close to 100 at 4 ohm.. peak bursts are even higher. That is something class D amps don’t do. (Fyi, I own some class d amps) Ended up with a clean looking system that will also hold its resale value a lot better in the future. Not to forget about a 5 year warranty. I love to tinker with a lot of components, but sometimes less is more. IMHO. Good luck with your hifi journey!