Suggestions for solving my seemingly impossible setup problem?

[DoublesAdvocate]

Okay so here's the situation, I have about 5 different devices that I regularly switch between, actively using usually 2 or 3 at the same time.
I'm trying to find some sort of solution to combine the audio from all of these devices all at once and feed them out into 1 output while allowing me to adjust both the individual track volume, and the master volume.
So far the best solution I've come up with is optical as its a common connector between all of them, and avoids the poor quality wiring in my house.
The problem with that is I can't seem to find any consumer device that can mix multiple optical signals.
I'm not too worried about audio input to any of the devices as I know there really isn't a good solution for that since they all have wildly different audio input protocols/options.

Ideally I'd like to find one device that can take 5 inputs, while fitting in a reasonable size since I don't have much space on my desk, if it can only do 2 or 3 then I can live with that. Even more ideally I'd like to keep it under $100 (but I have to live in reality along with everyone else so I'm willing to spend much more).
Others with this issue were recommended the FiiO D03k and a regular unpowered mixer... but I really don't know how good the D03k is and I've heard a passive mixer is a good way to increase your daily dose of humming/buzzing.
I've asked around several other forums and read through as many reddit posts as google could suggest to me but I still don't have a clear answer for the best path forward, suggestions?

 

[Keith_W]

It is not clear what you are trying to do. What are those devices? Output devices? Speakers? Sources? What are their outputs, besides optical? What are you trying to output to?

 

[JayGilb]

Do you need to mix the optical signals or just switch them ?
You can get an toslink matrix switcher with a remote control for less than $50 USD
4 input example: Toslink Switcher

 

[wwenze]

5 optical input mixer will never work at your price point, stick to analog input. Then you will be able to find $100 on Amazon or $30 on aliexpress.

 

[Hatto]

A rough sketch of what devices are already available (with input and output options) would be helpful.

to combine the audio from all of these devices all at once and feed them out into 1 output

Do you mean merging them into one combined signal or switching among them when you need one or the other? If you mean merging them, your best bet would be an analog mixer like the ones used in recording.

So far the best solution I've come up with is optical as its a common connector between all of them, and avoids the poor quality wiring in my house

What type of wiring issues you imagine toslink might remedy?

 

[DoublesAdvocate]

It is not clear what you are trying to do. What are those devices? Output devices? Speakers? Sources? What are their outputs, besides optical? What are you trying to output to?

Mix multiple optical signals into 1 analog output.
Yes, multiple output devices.
Majority of them have just HDMI and optical but some have 3.5mm outputs as well.
A final output of 3.5mm or 1/4" is what I'm looking to end up with.

Do you need to mix the optical signals or just switch them ?
You can get an toslink matrix switcher with a remote control for less than $50 USD
4 input example: Toslink Switcher

Mix the signals, AFAIK switching wont work because you only get the audio from one at a time (please correct me if I'm wrong).

5 optical input mixer will never work at your price point, stick to analog input. Then you will be able to find $100 on Amazon or $30 on aliexpress.

Several of these devices have no option for analog output so I don't have much choice in the matter.

A rough sketch of what devices are already available (with input and output options) would be helpful.



Do you mean merging them into one combined signal or switching among them when you need one or the other? If you mean merging them, your best bet would be an analog mixer like the ones used in recording.



What type of wiring issues you imagine toslink might remedy?

As in the existing audio equipment I have? Very little, I have more testing equipment (a basic oscilloscope, multimeter, etc) than I do mixers or anything like that.
Merging them, I know its a strange situation but I've got a strange setup.
Primarily the issues I have with ground loops.

 

[JayGilb]

Multiple D/A units into an analog mixer is probably the only way to go.

 

[DoublesAdvocate]

Multiple D/A units into an analog mixer is probably the only way to go.

Any suggestions for both components? Is there something as small as that Fiio that performs better?

 

[JayGilb]

Any suggestions for both components? Is there something as small as that Fiio that performs better?

I have not personally used the Fiio devices, but price/size is about as small as possible.
Purchase a single Fiio and give it a test run.
Your need to mix multiple sources is the biggest constraint, if you just needed to switch sources, it would be a much simper solution.

 

[DoublesAdvocate]

I have not personally used the Fiio devices, but price/size is about as small as possible.
Purchase a single Fiio and give it a test run.
Your need to mix multiple sources is the biggest constraint, if you just needed to switch sources, it would be a much simper solution.

Okay I'll give that a shot. Any suggestions for the mixer? I know some of the things to check for like Mono/stereo channels but I'm still in the dark when it comes to what else I should look for/avoid.
Yeah I know, a problem of my own creation.

 

[kemmler3D]

So yeah you need a mixer and you need 5 digital inputs (which in mixer-world equates to 10 channels). This is not going to happen for $100, probably not even for $1000. SOME pro interfaces probably have that many optical inputs (or digital in general) but my guess is you'll be way into $$ 4 figures before you find one.

I can suggest a hack-y budget option: Use 5x Creative Soundblaster G3s (the cheapest unit I've found with an optical input, I have one, it works) and use a digital mixer like Voicemeeter Potato to set levels and route channels. If you need another PC to run this on, you can get a refurb lenovo mini-PC for like $100.

There is similar software for Mac and Linux if those are your flavors of choice.

This is a lot like the setup I use for EQing my TV / main stereo, and it works fine and quite reliably.

The big caveats with this idea:

1. I don't know if you can actually run more than one G3 at a time. The drivers might conflict. I don't know.
2. The clocks will not be in sync. I am not sure how much that matters for an input, but if you have any need for phase coherence, this approach is a bad one.

I can't seem to find any consumer device that can mix multiple optical signals.

There basically aren't any, unfortunately. I looked really hard for a cheap way to get digital input to my PC for a while and the G3 was one of the only reasonable options.

Several DACs into an analog mixer should also work, but as you note the cheap ones tend to have bad noise floors and whatnot, plus potential ground loop issues.

 

[Blumlein 88]

You need to give us more specifics about sources and what signals they are handling. If you don't know, then it is hard for us tor to read your mind for you. Do you have what otherwise could be analog signals, but wish to go all optical due to ground loops you mentioned? In any case, spell out what it is you have for sources.

 

[DoublesAdvocate]

There basically aren't any, unfortunately. I looked really hard for a cheap way to get digital input to my PC for a while and the G3 was one of the only reasonable options.

Several DACs into an analog mixer should also work, but as you note the cheap ones tend to have bad noise floors and whatnot, plus potential ground loop issues.

Okay I'll give those a look as well, I'd looked at them earlier but wasn't really sure about their performance.
Do you happen to know if there's any way to use creative devices WITHOUT having to install their software?

So yeah you need a mixer and you need 5 digital inputs (which in mixer-world equates to 10 channels). This is not going to happen for $100, probably not even for $1000. SOME pro interfaces probably have that many optical inputs (or digital in general) but my guess is you'll be way into $$ 4 figures before you find one.

Honestly the biggest issue with them is that all of those professional ones are also massive and would need their own rack mount unless I just wanted to leave them laying around.

You need to give us more specifics about sources and what signals they are handling. If you don't know, then it is hard for us tor to read your mind for you. Do you have what otherwise could be analog signals, but wish to go all optical due to ground loops you mentioned? In any case, spell out what it is you have for sources.

A number of game consoles, PS2, PS4, Xbox 360, a Blu-ray player (different region), 2 PCs, a phone, and sometimes some other random devices
The PS2 has an AV output as well as an optical port.
The Blu-ray player has optical and HDMI out
The PS4 has HDMI and an optical port.
The 360 has HDMI, an optical port, and an AV out (which I think may conflict with the HDMI)
The PCs have an optical out as well as the normal 3.5mm outs and digital video outs.
The phone has USB-C and a 3.5mm out.
So a few can do analog, others are digital only and I find myself doing a LOT of cable swapping which I would like to cut down on.

 

[kemmler3D]

Do you happen to know if there's any way to use creative devices WITHOUT having to install their software?

You can, but the G3 had some weird sample rate issues when I first set it up but didn't install the software. You MIGHT be able to do the FW update with the software and then uninstall it... but don't quote me on that. I haven't found the Creative app to cause any trouble though.

Other than that I haven't had any reason to complain about performance. I leave the G3 and PC on and active 24/7 and in months of use had no issues.

 

[Keith_W]

You want to mix the output of all those separate sources? Not switch between them? I think part of the confusion here might be your choice of terminology. Mix means "blend those sources together".

If you mean switch between optical sources, then what you need is an optical switcher or a TOSLink switcher. You can google for results closer to home, but here is one that I found for less than $100.

 

[DoublesAdvocate]

You want to mix the output of all those separate sources? Not switch between them? I think part of the confusion here might be your choice of terminology. Mix means "blend those sources together".

If you mean switch between optical sources, then what you need is an optical switcher or a TOSLink switcher. You can google for results closer to home, but here is one that I found for less than $100.

Yes correct mix, as in hear the audio from a game while also talking to someone on the PC. It's also quite common for me to sit in a call with friends that aren't speaking much while also listening to music so they can get my attention if they need me.
As a side note at the moment I don't have much music above CD quality so looking for something high end wouldn't really do much for me.
I know it makes little sense from a discerning listener perspective trying to avoid as much unwanted noise as possible, but needing something to solve that problem has become very common with my hobbies and work.

You can, but the G3 had some weird sample rate issues when I first set it up but didn't install the software. You MIGHT be able to do the FW update with the software and then uninstall it... but don't quote me on that. I haven't found the Creative app to cause any trouble though.

Other than that I haven't had any reason to complain about performance. I leave the G3 and PC on and active 24/7 and in months of use had no issues.

Got it, I'll keep that in mind.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Okay, so what you want to do is uncommon. I think a Mutec unit will do what you want. I think. They aren't cheap ($600 to $1200 I think). And I'm not certain they mix input signals. They may only do sample rate conversion allowing any input to output any other format, and have multiple outputs.

MUTEC – Digital Audio Equipment – High End | Professional Audio - MC4

MUTEC Germany - Manufacturer of Digital Audio and Video Studio Equipment

www.mutec-net.com

The other approach is to get analog out of every device and then do analog mixing on any of the inexpensive 8 or 10 or 14 channel mixers. Still not super cheap with that many inputs. For anything lacking an analog out there are $30 Toslink audio extractors. Not the finest quality, but suitable for most of your needs. Not an elegant solution, but you could do it without cable swapping. Even that will cost a few hundred dollars and be kind of a messy nest of cable routing.

 

[voodooless]

Okay, so what you want to do is uncommon. I think a Mutec unit will do what you want. I think. They aren't cheap ($600 to $1200 I think). And I'm not certain they mix input signals. They may only do sample rate conversion allowing any input to output any other format, and have multiple outputs.

MUTEC – Digital Audio Equipment – High End | Professional Audio - MC4

MUTEC Germany - Manufacturer of Digital Audio and Video Studio Equipment

www.mutec-net.com

What product do they have that would be useful here? I don’t see any?

Even a second hand digital mixer isn’t going to be easy, since even those usually have no more than 1 or 2 SPDIF inputs.

What you can do however is staggered your setup. All HDMI sources you won’t use I parallel. A simple HDMI switch with SPDIF or analog out will help. The you only need a few channel mixer, which may even be analog. That should be feasible within the budget if you go 2nd hand.

 

[DoublesAdvocate]

The other approach is to get analog out of every device and then do analog mixing on any of the inexpensive 8 or 10 or 14 channel mixers. Still not super cheap with that many inputs. For anything lacking an analog out there are $30 Toslink audio extractors. Not the finest quality, but suitable for most of your needs. Not an elegant solution, but you could do it without cable swapping. Even that will cost a few hundred dollars and be kind of a messy nest of cable routing.

Well, "a few hundred" is still better than one of the solutions I came up with early on (a teenage engineering TX-6) but decided against due to the internal battery and the price.

What you can do however is staggered your setup. All HDMI sources you won’t use I parallel. A simple HDMI switch with SPDIF or analog out will help. The you only need a few channel mixer, which may even be analog. That should be feasible within the budget if you go 2nd hand.

Sort of yes and sort of no, I do have several screens in front of me so the outputs of the devices are split between the 2 screens because I'm often glancing back and forth between several active tasks on different devices (sometimes more than 3 devices since I use PIP).

 

[voodooless]

That's one hell of an operation you have going on there

But you don't really need all of those devices playing audio at the same time, right? How many of them do you want to combine? If you have 3 HDMI devices on one screen, you don't want all their audio, do you?