Speakers recommendation request

[Balrog]

My system:
PC TOSLINK -> Yamaha CX-A5000 -> Anthem 50 -> NHT 2.5 towers & 10" Velodyne sub
I'm looking to replace the NHT's.
Focal Aria 906 K2 look interesting, but there's a dearth of professional reviews. (And just what does "buttery smooth" mean?)
I can stretch a bit for exceptional speakers. Mostly music & some video use.
Speakers even remotely associated with listener fatigue are to be avoided like the plague.
Budget is $2K, used is acceptable. Bookcase or towers.
Thanks!

 

[Newman]

Don't overdo the 'listener fatigue avoidance' thing. You will end up avoiding flat-response speakers because they accurately portray recordings that, deliberately or incompetently or as part of the Circle of Confusion, aren't the greatest and can be fatiguing. Result: on great recordings the ‘never-ever fatiguing’ speaker won't be doing them justice, because they aren't very accurate (due to their emphasis on avoiding listener fatigue on inherently fatiguing recordings or music).

Instead, get flat-response speakers, and use tone controls to deal with variance in recordings.

cheers

(PS I saw your comment on the measurements discussion thread before writing the above.)

 

[sweetchaos]

Budget is $2K, used is acceptable. Bookcase or towers.

From my recommendation threads...

Bookshelves < US$2,000/pair:

Name	PS	PSwSub	LFX
Ascend Acoustics Sierra-LX	6.8	8.6	38
Kef R3 (Amir) (Erin) [Discontinued on Feb 2023, replaced by R3 Meta]	6.6	8.3	37
Ascend Acoustics Sierra 1 V2 (Erin)	6.4	8.4	42
Philharmonic BMR v2 (Erin)	6.1	7.7	33
Ascend Acoustics Sierra-2EX V2	5.9	8.0	43
Philharmonic Ceramic Mini (Erin)	5.9	7.9	42
Revel M16 with sealed port [readme] (Amir)	5.9	??	??
Elac Debut Reference DBR-62 (Amir)	5.7	7.8	43
Revel M105 (Amir)	5.9	8.3	51
JBL HDI-1600 (Amir)	5.8	7.6	38
Kef LS50 Meta (Amir)	5.7	7.8	43
Revel M16 with open port (Amir)	5.6	7.7	45
Arendal Sound 1723 Monitor S THX (Erin)	5.1	7.1	42
Polk Audio Signature Elite ES20 (Amir)	4.8	6.7	39
Arendal Sound 1723 Bookshelf S THX (Erin)	4.8	7.6	62
Arendal Sound 1961 Bookshelf (Erin)	4.4	7.3	68

Towers < US$2,000/pair:

Name	PS	PSwSub	LFX
Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary (Erin)	6.0	7.8	36
Emotiva Airmotiv T2+ (Erin)	5.8	7.3	32
Revel F35 (Amir)	5.7	7.6	39
Arendal Sound 1961 Tower (Erin)	5.1	7.5	51
JBL 4309 (Amir)	3.7	5.7	41
Revel F36	**	**	**

Active Speakers Under US$2,000/pair:

Recommendation	PS	PSwSub	LFX
Neumann KH 120 II (Amir)	6.7	8.5	39
Genelec 8030C (Amir)	6.3	8.5	46
JBL 308P MKII (Amir)	5.8	7.5	36
Genelec 8330A (Amir)	5.7	7.9	46
Kali IN-5 (Erin) Kali IN-8v2 (Erin)	5.4 5.4	7.3 7.2	41 39
Adam T5V (Amir)	4.4	6.7	48
Focal Alpha 65 Evo (Amir)	4.3	6.1	38

-Genelec 8010A or 8020D is no longer mentioned since 8030C exists at this price point.
-Neumann KH 80 is no longer mentioned since KH 120 II exists at this price point.
-Genelec 8320A is not longer mentioned, since 8330A exists at this price point.

Spoiler

I love my threads, since it takes like 5 seconds to copy/paste answers.

 

[Waxx]

Focals mostly have a rather bright sound, that causes listening fatigue by some. Their hard dome tweeters have a lot of resonances. The Aria's i've seen tested all have this.

The Kef R3 or the Warfdale Linton have more a kind of response you may like i think. But they are not the only one. Check in that list above the others and see what fits your wishes among them that have that slightly sloped response on the top. They sound softer to the ear than those very bright Focals. Avoid surely also Kiplisch for that reason (they are even brighter than Focal) and there are good reasons why they are not in that list. Genelec is also a brand that many find fatiguing, even if it does not have that bright sound and resonances in the passband that matters. But it's far less than Focal or Kiplisch.

I myself would probally look at Neumann active speakers, they are very neutral and not fatiguing, and are among the best tested here. But they are active, and you seems to use seperate amps. Are you ready to change that?

 

[TheBatsEar]

PC TOSLINK -> Yamaha CX-A5000 -> Anthem 50 -> NHT 2.5 towers & 10" Velodyne sub
I'm looking to replace the NHT's.

I think you should consider the Wharfedale Linton 85.

Focal Aria 906 K2 look interesting, but there's a dearth of professional reviews. (And just what does "buttery smooth" mean?)

It means nothing, is what it means
I have the Aria 906 here, in direct comparison with the Linton. They aren't in the same ballpark. They don't even play the same sport. The Linton are vastly superior in my opinion (except for looks, they look really ... retro).
The Aria 906 are great speakers, but they are two way and their woofer is 6.5" in a small enclosure.The Lintons are bigger, have three ways and a 8" woofer. I know you have a sub, but i still think it matters, the Linton have authority.

Speakers even remotely associated with listener fatigue are to be avoided like the plague.

I think that is where the Lintons come in again, they slowly fall down above 10kHz. I personally use my treble control to compensate for it, particularly as i am almost 50 now, but you may like it.
The Aria 906 are more flat up there, but as others have said, nothing a bit of treble tuning can't solve.

Budget is $2K, used is acceptable. Bookcase or towers.

My only problem is that they are really large, they have a large footprint.
And you basically have to buy the stands, there aren't stands that fit them.

 

[ZolaIII]

@Balrog well replacem recommendation with similar SPL capabilities and in same price bucket as NHT 2.5 would be Wharfedale Linton's (around 1200 € with stands).
Focal Aria 906 are just OK and for up to mid field listening as they tend to brake apart on higher SPL levels (compression).

Focal Aria 906 Speaker Review

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Focal Aria 906 Bookshelf/stand-mount speaker. It was kindly purchased by a member and drop shipped to me. I think it costs US $2000 for a pair but I see it on Amazon including Prime shipping for half that at US $999. Better yet, they have a...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Even Linton's will exhibit similar behaviour (but lesser than most others) when they reach their limit (about 102 dB SPL at 1 m).
In that regard if you want to upgrade systems SPL capabilities and lower the THD advice is to switch to pair of more capable 12" sub's and mains crossed higher (so you got great dynamic bass from something like Linton's or even one's you already have).
Uper end Focal's with "twisted" berilium tweeters don't exhibit siblant or bright sounding behaviour but those are very expensive boutique models and still there is lot better for that price.
Make sure that you work the DSP room correction part properly with any.

 

[ZolaIII]

@TheBatsEar good (construction) cheap generic 10" plate stands which can hold them if the hight (and esthetics) fits you.

Adam Hall SKDB 040

Studio monitor stand 280 x 280 mm Steel tray with cushioning foam pads, Load capacity: 40 kg, Height: 860 mm, Base type: Triangle with 445 mm edge length, Material: Powder-coated steel, Weight: 4.87 kg, Colour: Black, Includes spikes and cable...

www.thomann.de

 

[TheBatsEar]

@TheBatsEar good (construction) cheap generic 10" plate stands which can hold them if the hight (and esthetics) fits you.

Adam Hall SKDB 040

Studio monitor stand 280 x 280 mm Steel tray with cushioning foam pads, Load capacity: 40 kg, Height: 860 mm, Base type: Triangle with 445 mm edge length, Material: Powder-coated steel, Weight: 4.87 kg, Colour: Black, Includes spikes and cable...

www.thomann.de

280mm x 280mm contact area at 860mm height sounds precarious with these speakers.
The white thing under the Focal is 340mm x 340mm with 800mm height.
The Linton stand without the spikes is 400mm height.

For OPs edification, i made pics to compare them with the Aria 906 (that lost their beauty rings, don't mind that):

Note how the Wharfedale are on a plant roller for speedy deployment and easy vacuuming, and are also far deeper than the Aria 906.

Ignore the dust, i have given up.

 

[Chesapeake HT]

Polk R700s, $899 each (currently)

Polk Reserve R700 Floorstanding Loudspeaker Review

In our in-depth review of Polk Audio's Reserve R700 tower speakers, we look at just how much of the performance of the stellar Legend series has trickled down to the more affordable Reserve series.

www.audioholics.com

 

[ZolaIII]

280mm x 280mm contact area at 860mm height sounds precarious with these speakers.
The white thing under the Focal is 340mm x 340mm with 800mm height.
The Linton stand without the spikes is 400mm height.

For OPs edification, i made pics to compare them with the Aria 906 (that lost their beauty rings, don't mind that):
View attachment 330859 View attachment 330860
Note how the Wharfedale are on a plant roller for speedy deployment and easy vacuuming, and are also far deeper than the Aria 906.

Ignore the dust, i have given up.

I value stands on how good they do their job of channeling the vibrations from speakers and into the spikes and the floor or packs. The original ones don't do that part good.

 

[Deleted member 21219]

Speakers even remotely associated with listener fatigue are to be avoided like the plague.

1) Someone else can express "listener fatigue" and you may not have the same experience.
2) Someone else's idea of "listener fatigue" may involve a bias for their previous equipment. This includes previous equipment that was "euphonic".
3) In some people, listener fatigue involves distortion more than treble lift. You need to understand the reaction of your own brain compared to someone else's, as well as the output characteristics of the speaker.
4) Some listener fatigue involves the signal, not the equipment. If that is the case, a more accurate speaker may transmit information at a level the listener finds distressing.
5) If the speaker is a design that involves a great deal of equalization and adjustment to achieve accuracy, it is very possible that the result will be curtailed output. That type of monitor will be easier to overdrive, which may result in listener fatigue.

In all cases, the listener needs to understand the reason for (and source of) "listener fatigue" before passing judgement. The problem may not be the speaker.

Good luck on your choice!

Jim

p.s. - These are just a few examples of reasons for subjective impressions of other people being unreliable for the individual in question.

 

[TheBatsEar]

I value stands on how good they do their job of channeling the vibrations from speakers and into the spikes and the floor or packs. The original ones don't do that part good.

How can you tell if they do it or not?

The Linton stands come with giant spikes to poke holes into wood floor and are kind of heavy. Money shot:

The cones can be changed in height, so that all 4 spikes make contact. They also give you some disks with foam, should you not want to poke holes. I personally don't think any of this matters. Maybe someone took measurements what effect the spikes actually have?

 

[SteveC]

Personally I love my KEF R3's (not Meta) but use them in a smallish room and fairly near-field (6' 5"). Not sure how they would do in a large room. I also use them with a pair of SVS subwoofers, but for most music I could turn them off with little loss.

 

[ZolaIII]

How can you tell if they do it or not?

The Linton stands come with giant spikes to poke holes into wood floor and are kind of heavy. Money shot:

They cones can be changed in height, so that all 4 spikes make contact. They also give you some disks with foam, should you not want to poke holes. I personally don't think any of this matters. Maybe someone took measurements what effect the spikes actually have?

O they do and we did discuss it hire before.

Pay attention to the end how much diference did acoustic pack's do to improving; time domain mainly and with it ISO 3382-1, RT60 decay times, waterfal plots and clarity. It's not a hocus pocus but physical property of silicone in packs (or something other) to have a very low fundamental oscillation frequency (9~10 Hz and below what we hire). As energy doesn't disappear hire it's focused below of what maters.