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Seas KingRo4y MK3 Kit

Jason K

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http://www.seas.no/index.php?option...=583:seas-kingro4y-mk-iii&catid=66&Itemid=250

8DB25AE7-099F-4454-850E-55489E3B35D2.jpeg


Coaxial Driver C18EN002/A
Bass Driver L26RO4Y


Coaxial Driver Review
https://audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-seas-e0060-08-06-6-5-king-coax

Bass Driver Review(Not Ro4y, Roy)
https://audioxpress.com/article/test-bench-the-l26roy-10-subwoofer-from-seas



How do you think about this kit?
I think what if it doesn’t use Ro4y but Dual Roy as DOS type until 300Hz.
 

Rick Sykora

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These are well-regarded drivers in their respective segments, but have had no direct experience with them. They are both on the pricey side. If the cabinet fits in your decor plans, would expect they sound pretty nice. Since you would need to get it well off the ground for decent sound, it will need to be well-supported. The combo of amp, woofer and the cabinet are going to be quite heavy and you would not want them to fall on something or someone.

The amp is $800 in US. Not sure if it was that much before Hypex ran into chip shortage, so might be able to do some others less expensively, but the design is doing some bass boost and needs some serious power. Unless you have a big room, not sure why you would spend more for more woofers. The L26ROY is 4 ohm too, so using 2 would mean a 2 ohm load or another channel of amplification. If you can do some crossover design, suspect you could use a passive crossover on the top half without much compromise. This would depend on whether the active crossover make use of delays to align the drivers. Hope this help a bit!
 
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sfdoddsy

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headshake

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I put the kit's XO in vcad for the tweeter and mid... I wanted to see how SEAS makes an XO. I was shocked to see so many shelf filters. I never use them and now think I have been trying to do things with one arm behind my back. This is what I get for not exploring all the filter types. I am thankful SEAS shared their work. Kuddos!


seas3_r1SEAS_kingl26roy XO-schema-1.png


One last thing that caught my eye is how they limit the drivers with sharp filters. The mid has a -14db filter at 5628Hz. The tweeter has a -6db filter at 21835Hz.
 

Seb75

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Hello,
I have a few questions about the seas kingryo4

1 _ The dimensions of the front panel are 310 x 500 mm
But they indicate that if we increase the height by 50 cm ,so font panel 31 X 1000, we must redo the DSP filtering of the Woofer?
OK

AND the filtering of the Medium/Tweeter?
I thought that when you changed the dimensions of the front cabinet, you had to redo the filtering?

2_ On my side I have a 450 x 1000 front panel.
It will be necessary to redo the filtering of the medium I think, because as the bafle effect will modify the response of the medium, I think!!

3- I would like to add to the C18EN002/A, a 15" or a 12", for example the 15N630 or the 12N630, either in 100 liters or 70 liters, preferably in sealed Box, because they will be predominated from the Wall!

What do you think ?

Not very wise?

4-Finally, as it is difficult to hear the Seas, it's expensive project, is a design like seas kingryo4n inferior to speakers like Yamaha NS 1000, Technics SB 10 or this kind of speakers?
I know that last question is listener dependent

Thanks
Sorry for my english
 

test1223

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Hello,

1. If you extend the baffle below the woofer the DSP can stay at it is. The frequency response below about 250Hz should be equalized according to measurements at the listening position.

2. If you use a wider front baffle the filtering of the midwoofer has to change.

3. You can exchange the 25cm woofer and use a bigger one but the suggested BMS woofer aren't a good match. What is the goal of the exchange deeper bass or more max spl?

The exchange is the same afford like matching a subwoofer. If you are not willing to measure or use an auto equalisation tool like dirac live it is hard to get good bass.

4. The KingRYO4 construction is similar to a KEF Q750 with much better bass and better enclosure and maybe more linear direct sound.

Best
Thomas
 

Seb75

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Hello,

Thank you for these tips and clarifications.

"What's the but of trading deeper bass or more max spl?" : It's especially that I already have a large cabinet, that I want an adapter to create active speakers and I have a hole for a 15 "woofer and 110 liters


If the KingRYO4 construction is similar to a KEF Q750, it is expensive, the interest of the KingRYO4 is that the Hypex presets are accessible...
I wanted to start from the Coax with a slightly wider front panel

Do you think KingRYO4 is inferior to Faital 3WC-15 ?

When I look at the EQs made on Hypex Filter, it's hard to understand, it uses 2 high pass on the mediums for example with different Q
 

test1223

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Hello,

Thank you for these tips and clarifications.

"What's the but of trading deeper bass or more max spl?" : It's especially that I already have a large cabinet, that I want an adapter to create active speakers and I have a hole for a 15 "woofer and 110 liters


If the KingRYO4 construction is similar to a KEF Q750, it is expensive, the interest of the KingRYO4 is that the Hypex presets are accessible...
I wanted to start from the Coax with a slightly wider front panel

Do you think KingRYO4 is inferior to Faital 3WC-15 ?

When I look at the EQs made on Hypex Filter, it's hard to understand, it uses 2 high pass on the mediums for example with different Q
The KEF Q750 has very good chassis despite the cheap price. The enclosure and crossover are not as good as the chassis. The main characteristics of both speaker should be similar.
The Faital 3WC-15 is a totally different speaker. It provides a higher beam in the bass-midrange, much more max spl and a DI "mismatch" at 3 to 5kHz. It depends which speaker is better.

There are some fundamental Questions you have to ask yourself
1. How big is the room and what is the listening distance from the speaker to the main listening position.
2. What is most important for you? Exact focus of the image, being surrounded by the sound, deep bass, max spl, hearing small details, neutral sound. You can not get all unless you are willing to spend a lot of money and to optimize the room according to the right chosen speaker.
3. Are you willing to optimize the room
4. Are you willing to measure and do some optimization to get better sound

The two high passes are used to get a good acoustic slope of the crossover region.
 

Seb75

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Hello,

thank you for your information

_The room is 25 m2, but above all I have a large cabinet to use with the cutout for a 15"
I already had big 3-way, 60s, Wharfedale Airedal, very good sound, now I'm running on Technics SB10 with 12 "woofer in 50 liter enclosure (my favorites)

-the most important thing for me are dynamic speakers, which transcribe all styles of music, quite analytical, but above all very natural, not tiring, which also works at low sound levels

-no I have not optimized my room
Here at my place:


- I have already taken measurements under Rew + rephase adjustment with an open DRC 88


- For the response curve of the C18EN002, I still don't understand why, for example, it makes a high pass at 1880 HZ Q=0.710 and then a second High Pass also at 1880 HZ Q=0.710???
 

test1223

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Hello,

thank you for your information

_The room is 25 m2, but above all I have a large cabinet to use with the cutout for a 15"
I already had big 3-way, 60s, Wharfedale Airedal, very good sound, now I'm running on Technics SB10 with 12 "woofer in 50 liter enclosure (my favorites)

-the most important thing for me are dynamic speakers, which transcribe all styles of music, quite analytical, but above all very natural, not tiring, which also works at low sound levels

-no I have not optimized my room
Here at my place:


- I have already taken measurements under Rew + rephase adjustment with an open DRC 88


- For the response curve of the C18EN002, I still don't understand why, for example, it makes a high pass at 1880 HZ Q=0.710 and then a second High Pass also at 1880 HZ Q=0.710???

The listening distance is about 2,5m?
A large box should be a good fit. There aren't many speaker kits with a 15". Therefore you either have to engineer a speaker by yourself or find a kit which fits best to your 15" cabinet. If the front baffle is different to the kit you have to adjust everything which is not so easy.

If you want to engineer a new speaker you should not expect a perfect result in your first try.

The two high pass filter result in a 24dB Linkwitz-Riley filter.
 

Seb75

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Thanks.

last question, what do you think of this kit


it is now open source now
you think that sounds good?

I download the hypex dsp presets,
on the medium, there is just the high pass in active, no other EQ to smooth the response
yet in my opinion the analogic crossover does not change this response curve too, but just allows you to get the low pass
something must escape me
 

test1223

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Thanks.

last question, what do you think of this kit


it is now open source now
you think that sounds good?

I download the hypex dsp presets,
on the medium, there is just the high pass in active, no other EQ to smooth the response
yet in my opinion the analogic crossover does not change this response curve too, but just allows you to get the low pass
something must escape me
The Fusion 3 will also have a DI mismatch around 3-5kHz.
There aren't much very good bigger speaker DIY designs. I would choose the KingRYO4 over the Fusion 3. Since you like details over image a speaker with a narrow beam should be the best fit at 2.5 meter listening distance for you.

Maybe the H.A.V.O.F.A.S.T. Studio would be the best DIY Kit I kwon of for you. I think they can offer you DSP settings if you use a hypex plate amp instead of the passive crossover. A plate amp is the better choice.

The Hypex amp is a very good choice. You can easily adjust everything which is very important in the bass region. And you can also change the tonality of the speaker if it isn't perfect for you.
 

Seb75

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Thank you for all your advice. indeed the image is important.
I have Technics Sb 10 which are already linear... I wanted a more live sound, "bigger" image, with deeper bass
maybe go on a C18 on a cabinet of 40 x 90 ... by modifying the Seas presets to measure


what is the problem to "have a DI mismatch around 3-5kHz"
 
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test1223

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From my experience most coax speaker provides a precise image or soundstage but no big one. It is more a pinpoint image where you can point exactly at a singer.
Most of the speakers which provide a bigger image also habe a more blurry image. It is not as precise. Topically speaker with many drivers, which are placed with greater distance to another provide such an image. Some linearray or big horn speaker provide very big soundstages.

Do you prefer being surrounded or enveloped by the sound like a good binaural recording on headphones, or do you like an exact transient sound like an instant stop when a tone ends, like to listen to very good headphones like staxs? You need different approaches to get one or the other. It is very hard to get both.

The H.A.V.O.F.A.S.T. should provide a big and relatively precise image. Very good and deep bass, very good tonality and good exactness due to the higher beam. They may lack a bit in high frequency sparkle due to the higher beam in the high frequencies and in the ability to provide a surrounding sound.

The Fusion 3 will provide a big but not as precise image and more high frequency sparkle and a better sense of being surrounded by the sound. But the transients are not as good and the tonality is not as consistent since the beam from the midwoofer to the tweeter makes a jump (the directivity index mismatch).

The KingRYO4 will provide the best pinpoint image but not a big one. Good, very correct tonality. The high frequency sparkle should be between the other two speaker. The transients are better suited for a listening distance of about 1,8m with greater distance it will get more washy. The bass should also be good but not as good as the H.A.V.O.F.A.S.T. The sense of being surrounded will also be not very good but better.

You can fix a lot of things with an eq but these are the things you can't fix with it.
 

mulderX

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I was wondering if we can copy the KingRO4Y with cheaper drivers. With seas or maybe for better vfm Faital pro.
Or instead of coaxial, a full range.
 
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