Not trying to be arrogant here, but who listens to this?

[Multicore]

I think I've mentioned to you before Australian luthier Trevor Gore and his excellent books on guitar construction. He has some very nice techniques for compensating both nut and saddle to get essentially perfect (equal temperament) tuning on a standard neck. I've built a couple of instruments using these techniques and it's quite astonishing how different a guitar sounds when it actually plays in tune! The techniques can be optimised for alternate tunings too if that's your bag. No need for wiggly frets ...

Yes, I remember but I didn't buy the book (USD350 here).

I have been interested in compensated nuts and there are some devices for sale. But I gathered that True-Temperament is not equal temperament, e.g. you can play a major 3rd with harmonic distortion and it rings consonant. It's some kind of a proprietary guitar-oriented diatonic sweetened tuning.

 

[bluefuzz]

Yes, I remember but I didn't buy the book (USD350 here).

The book is a bit spendy if you're not considering actually building a guitar. But the compensation techniques are mostly publicly available. There is discussion of them (and some simpler alternate techniques) on the ANZLF forum.

I have been interested in compensated nuts and there are some devices for sale. But I gathered that True-Temperament is not equal temperament, e.g. you can play a major 3rd with harmonic distortion and it rings consonant. It's some kind of a proprietary guitar-oriented diatonic sweetened tuning.

My understanding, from various luthier forums, of the True-Temperament method is that it's basically expensive snake-oil. A well compensated nut and saddle will get you essentially the same result. Doesn't look as impressive though. The cheap 'n' cheerful Earvana nuts can work quite well on an electric with an adjustable bridge.

 

[computer-audiophile]

Mostly I listen to classical music, I should probably mention that.... The next one is on Monday. Here, in a music school in our small town, the pianist Álvaro Baltanás Meliveo will play pieces by Claude Debussy and Modest Mussorgsky.

Álvaro Baltanás Meliveo

alvarobaltanasmeliveo-pianist.com

... It was a very beautiful concert tonight. Masterfully played, I have to wonder how it happened that this great pianist performed in this modest setting. However I didn't really like the hard sound of the Förster concert grand, although it was well tuned. Here in Görlitz, in another small chamber music hall, we have a Fazioli grand with wonderful timbres, one of the most beautiful pianos I know.

 

[Axo1989]

I was excited by that release when it came out. It was during a time when a lot of people were rediscovering and sometimes, as here, recycling older stuff, which is a good thing of course. Sonic Youth had been a top favorite of mine since ~87 and I will defend their honor... even if Goodbye 20th Century (SYR 4) was a disappointment to listen to. It seems, looking back, that their song writing was integral to their musical creative genius. As interpreters, not so convincing.

I envy you somewhat there, I wasn't of an age to anticipate (much less differentiate on the basis of performance) that one when first released. It was nonetheless interesting to do a little digging and read their (brief) commentary on how certain tracks came about.

 

[BinkieHuckerback]

 

[Multicore]

Dawson was a good pianist and a popular comedian from the era before TV took over light entertainment in the UK. Music comedy like this isn't well respected in the business, it's maybe one step up from prop comedy, but when I made the following guitar improvisation, one listener compared it to Dawson and, while comedy wasn't my intent, I was pleased with the comparison.

 

[computer-audiophile]

Dawson was a good pianist and a popular comedian from the era before TV took over light entertainment in the UK. Music comedy like this isn't well respected in the business, it's maybe one step up from prop comedy, but when I made the following guitar improvisation, one listener compared it to Dawson and, while comedy wasn't my intent, I was pleased with the comparison.

These two clownesque videos leave me a little perplexed.
The video of Dawson does not make me smile. Does that make me humourless if I don't like it?

"E-Musik", as we in Germany say, refers to 'Ernsthafte Musik' (serious music) or classical music and is characterized by its musical complexity and artistic value. It often has a long musical tradition and is written by composers who are highly educated and respected in their field.

Another difference is that "E-Musik" has a score. It is mostly played from sheet music.

 

[computer-audiophile]

Today I continue with Stockhausen. I didn't make it all the way through the 7 hours that the piece "Seven Days" takes, but I had some nice moments along the way. For example, I heard the little mechanical music boxes that I recently saw life play in concert.

Context link: http://www.stockhausen-verlag.com/new_music_boxes2.html

 

[ahofer]

I think this thread has pretty well answered the OP’s question, and moved on to a 20th century appreciation thread. Which is great!

 

[computer-audiophile]

I think this thread has pretty well answered the OP’s question, and moved on to a 20th century appreciation thread. Which is great!

I consider it a grace that I was allowed to grow up in this time and under these conditions.

To say it with the words of the philosopher Peter Sloterdijk:

"I am a survivor of a generation that saw the horizon wide open in its younger years. Never in my life would I have thought it possible that in my older days I could witness the kind of illiberal regression we are experiencing today, from both the right and the left. Thank God I still have friends from the other time, I also know younger people who carry on the impulse. For the rest, I would say freely after Talleyrand: Who has not lived before the regression, knows nothing of the sweetness of life."

(This Statement was before the war in the Ukraine, which make things worse)

 

[bluefuzz]

Music comedy like this isn't well respected in the business

More's the pity. The ultra-serious and self-important presentation of much of the more spiky New Music is a big barrier to its wider appreciation. The relative popularity of artists like Philip Glass, Steve Reich, Gavin Bryars and even John Cage is that it is obvious they have a sense of humour even though the musical intent is quite serious. One doesn't get the impression Stockhausen or Xenakis had even the remotest sense of humour or humility for that matter...

Within the free improv crowd the godlike genius Derek Bailey was a wonderfully warm and funny raconteur even when playing the most difficult music, which of course is why everyone and his dog wanted to, and did, play with him.

 

[computer-audiophile]

More's the pity. The ultra-serious and self-important presentation of much of the more spiky New Music is a big barrier to its wider appreciation. The relative popularity of artists like Philip Glass, Steve Reich, Gavin Bryars and even John Cage is that it is obvious they have a sense of humour even though the musical intent is quite serious. One doesn't get the impression Stockhausen or Xenakis had even the remotest sense of humour or humility for that matter...

Maybe I know what you mean, but I can't confirm it in such a general way. You only have to look at the photo of my last meeting with Wolfgang Rihm, which I posted earlier, to see his friendly character. He also has a fine sense of humor. A very great and inspired man. Lachenman too, and so are many others.

Stockhausen was not without humor either, as you can see in the video interviews with him. From Xenakis, I don't know how he was, as a mensch.

 

[Multicore]

More's the pity.

I really meant within the comedy profession in which the most scorned form is prop comedy, e.g. Gallagher, and one step up from that is music comedy, e.g. "Weird Al" Yankovic, who explained this ranking.

The ultra-serious and self-important presentation of much of the more spiky New Music is a big barrier to its wider appreciation.

The other day Shorty remarked...

Seriousness is an asset in classical music and the musicians who play it, and an obstacle in other genres.

I don't think the problem is to do with the spiky New Music being too serious, instead it's the institutions of European art music. They have been taking themselves too seriously and putting up barriers for a long time.

And of the examples you give I think only Cage was really taking himself much less seriously than the Europeans (and I'm not sure I got that right either).

I think Glass, Reich, and Bryars are just easier to listen to. Yes, Derek Bailey was an open and fun person and a miraculous musician so yes people wanted to and did play with him (he wanted to play with them too) but few people really listen to truly free improv like that. It's just too demanding. It insists on your full concentration, like an intense rapid conversation where you need to hear every word to follow along. Otoh something like gamelan can absorb your attention and be fascinating but it doesn't need to, you can drift out, think about something else, maybe go get a drink and chat with someone, and come back. It doesn't insist upon itself like free improv. So it is also with process/repetition composers like Glass, Reich etc, and indeed house/techno dance parties of the 80s/90s.

So agree there seriousness does present problems. I don't really agree that Philip Glass was much less serious than, say, Ligeti. Or that Arvo Pärt's popularity has much to do with humor.

Couple of historical foot notes. First, the Americans fetishize the European high art scene. A hundred years ago every American city had a symphony hall with functioning orchestra playing all the European classical and romantic golden oldies. I just gotta wonder: Why? Good question. Second, I learned from this wonderful Australian radio program that piano recitals were a much less serious affair before Glenn Gould's time. Theatricality, improvisation, and audience interaction were stamped out some time in 2nd half of 20th c.

 

[computer-audiophile]

One doesn't get the impression Stockhausen or Xenakis had even the remotest sense of humour or humility for that matter...

The question about Xenakis' personality has interested me now, because I didn't know it. He actually seems to have been a rather introverted person. I checked Chat GPT for information:

"Iannis Xenakis, the Greek composer and architect, was known for his innovative and avant-garde approach to music. He was considered a serious and introverted person, but also passionate about his work. Xenakis had a strong sense of individuality and was often described as a solitary figure, who was dedicated to his artistic pursuits.

One anecdote about Xenakis is that he once said: "Composers are like the gods of sound, who can shape and mold the material of sound into any form they wish." He had a deep understanding of mathematical principles and incorporated them into his compositions, which were often seen as challenging and abstract.

In terms of his personal life, Xenakis was known for his stoic and reserved demeanor, but also for his unwavering commitment to his artistic vision. He was not known for being particularly humorous or outgoing, but those who knew him describe him as a brilliant and dedicated individual, who left a lasting impact on the world of music.

BTW: Iannis Xenakis was married and had children. He lived most of his life in France, where he settled after fleeing Greece during the country's Civil War. Xenakis lived in Paris with his wife and family, and he remained there until his death in 2001."

 

[computer-audiophile]

I don't understand the negative attitude towards the publicly funded institutions here in Germany, for example. What did they do wrong? The foreign musicians I know or am friends with, not so much from the USA, but mainly from Japan, for example, who work here in Germany, are very grateful for the opportunities they have.

And of course I, as an art lover, am too.

The ZKM in Karlsruhe, for example, which I know very well, is a unique interdisciplinary institution that focuses on the intersection of art, technology, and society, and it is a valuable resource for artists and musicians working in the field of contemporary music. It offers a variety of low-threshold services for the city's population, but it is also a stronghold of high culture and art. Imo it fulfills well the requirements for social inclusion.

In comparison, the American cultural landscape is more commercial, that, in turn, I do not like so much.

 

[Multicore]

I don't understand the negative attitude towards the publicly funded institutions here in Germany, for example. What did they do wrong? The foreign musicians I know or am friends with, not so much from the USA, but mainly from Japan, for example, who work here in Germany, are very grateful for the opportunities they have.

And of course I, as an art lover, am too.

The ZKM in Karlsruhe, for example, which I know very well, is a unique interdisciplinary institution that focuses on the intersection of art, technology, and society, and it is a valuable resource for artists and musicians working in the field of contemporary music. It offers a variety of low-threshold services for the city's population, but it is also a stronghold of high culture and art. Imo it fulfills well the requirements for social inclusion.

In comparison, the American cultural landscape is more commercial, that, in turn, I do not like so much.

If you're responding to me then there's nothing to be defensive about since no offense was made. Let me try to put it in other words. All I discussed was the seriousness of the European high-art music institutions, which the Americans copied. I agree with Shorty's remark "Seriousness is an asset in classical music and the musicians who play it". At the same time it can be (isn't always) off-putting to audiences that aren't already part of the scene.

 

[Multicore]

The question about Xenakis' personality has interested me now, because I didn't know it. He actually seems to have been a rather introverted person.

Nouritza Matosian wrote a good biography which I read years ago. She was involved in this very nice English language documentary film. Another more recent French documentary film looks interesting but I haven't watched it all yet.

I wouldn't describe his as introverted. He had a peculiar way of expressing himself. And for a long time he pursued his art away from a painful personal past.

 

[computer-audiophile]

If you're responding to me then there's nothing to be defensive about since no offense was made. Let me try to put it in other words. All I discussed was the seriousness of the European high-art music institutions, which the Americans copied. I agree with Shorty's remark "Seriousness is an asset in classical music and the musicians who play it". At the same time it can be (isn't always) off-putting to audiences that aren't already part of the scene.

Tom, no problem, I don't have to defend that. I just don't have much criticism of the institutions in question, that's all. Although, of course, there are always legitimate criticisms.

For example, with artist friends who live in New York, I find that they are usually under a lot of pressure to sell themselves somehow. I sometimes find that stressful. But that's true of most professions anyway. I've had my stressful times, too.

 

[computer-audiophile]

Another more recent French documentary film looks interesting but I haven't watched it all yet.

Thanks, I have bookmarked the link. I will watch it later.

 

[McGillroy]

Today I continue with Stockhausen. I didn't make it all the way through the 7 hours that the piece "Seven Days" takes, but I had some nice moments along the way. For example, I heard the little mechanical music boxes that I recently saw life play in concert.

Context link: http://www.stockhausen-verlag.com/new_music_boxes2.html

View attachment 263026

Hi Johannes - could you point me to those stands for your JBLs? Got the 305s too and they are sitting on some crappy Thoman things.

Stockhausen trying to outwagner Wagner is a failure imho. Four days of musical immersion is the sweet spot, trust me on that