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motu m4 knobs

insane

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Hi, I use a Magni 3 for headphones and im considering buying the m4 to plug it there with my monitors and use both at the same time for A/B mixes. My question is: Is there a way to control the monitor's volume with one knob and the headphones monitor with another knob? Even if the Magni 3 has its own knob, the final volume will be impacted by the Motu m4 if the big "MONITOR" knob controls both 1/2 balanced and unbalanced:
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Magni_3_-_Front_1024.jpg

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There's a small knob there that says "INPUT->PLAYBACK" and a small button that says "3/4" under it but after reading the manual im not sure if I could plug the Magni 3 on the 3/4 balanced Line Outs and just control the headphone volume with the Magni 3 knob separately, but what would that "INPUT->PLAYBACK" knob do?

On my old audio interface I had 2 separate knobs for outputs 1/2 and 3/4 which was cool but I cannot find any interfaces like this that aren't too big, or have knobs on top or are just cheaper ones.

Native-Instruments-Audio-Kontrol-1.jpg

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Let me know if anyone has the m4 and know how it works.
 

TulseLuper

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The knobs work independently. I turn the big monitor knob all the way down and headphone knob up when using headphones.
 
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insane

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The knobs work independently. I turn the big monitor knob all the way down and headphone knob up when using headphones.
Im not going to use the headphone knob, please read post again. I will be using Magni 3 to drive 600 ohm headphones. Unless something else I understand you are using the headphone jack.
 

studio7

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Unless there's a way to assign the big knob to send MIDI CC, like on the Audient iD series, I don't think that you can get separate 1-2 and 3-4 level controls.
 
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insane

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Unless there's a way to assign the big knob to send MIDI CC, like on the Audient iD series, I don't think that you can get separate 1-2 and 3-4 level controls.
Oh well. Are there alternatives? I was looking even at the RME UCX II so I don't have to ever buy another one ever again, but the thing is, im not even sure if I will be able to do that. Im assuming there's a way to switch between 1-2 and 3-4 with a button and the same knob controls everything and volume levels are saved in internal memory guaranteeing you will not blow up your ears if you switch between them because they are saved properly which I would assume its good enough vs having two separate knobs.
 

studio7

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Another option would be getting 2 stereo interfaces. This way you can have completely independent control of the levels and all other parameters.

Or you could get a USB/MIDI controller to adjust the levels separately in the playback software (DAW). Something like the Korg Nanokontrol 2.
 
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insane

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Another option would be getting 2 stereo interfaces. This way you can have completely independent control of the levels and all other parameters.

Or you could get a USB/MIDI controller to adjust the levels separately in the playback software (DAW). Something like the Korg Nanokontrol 2.
Well that takes too much space, its one of those things.
 

AnalogSteph

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NOTE: Outputs 3-4 on M4 interfaces are not controlled by the master volume knob. If you have speakers connected to those outputs, be sure to turn the volume down.

Besides, AFAICT monitor volume and headphone volume are independent as well, so using an adapter cable to connect the Magni to the headphone output (and not touching the M4's headphone volume again after initial setup - about 6 dB below maximum should give standard line level) would be another option.
There's a small knob there that says "INPUT->PLAYBACK" and a small button that says "3/4" under it but after reading the manual im not sure if I could plug the Magni 3 on the 3/4 balanced Line Outs and just control the headphone volume with the Magni 3 knob separately, but what would that "INPUT->PLAYBACK" knob do?
It controls the ratio of input signal vs. playback signal in the monitor mix. This is intended for recording while something like a metronome or a prerecorded backing track plays (generally over the headphones in order to minimize bleedthrough). The 3/4 button would choose the 3/4 input channel pair instead of 1/2 inputs.
 
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insane

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Besides, AFAICT monitor volume and headphone volume are independent as well, so using an adapter cable to connect the Magni to the headphone output (and not touching the M4's headphone volume again after initial setup - about 6 dB below maximum should give standard line level) would be another option.

It controls the ratio of input signal vs. playback signal in the monitor mix. This is intended for recording while something like a metronome or a prerecorded backing track plays (generally over the headphones in order to minimize bleedthrough). The 3/4 button would choose the 3/4 input channel pair instead of 1/2 inputs.
So I could connect 3/4 balanceds into the Magni 3 and control the volume with the Magni 3 volume knob and use the 1/2 balanceds for monitors and use the MONITOR knob? this seems like the most reasonable setting. I would assume using the headphone jack for anything other than directly plugin a headphone would compromise sound.
 

AnalogSteph

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So I could connect 3/4 balanceds into the Magni 3 and control the volume with the Magni 3 volume knob and use the 1/2 balanceds for monitors and use the MONITOR knob?
You'd be using the 3/4 unbalanced (RCA) outputs, given that the Magni 3 only has the corresponding kind of inputs.

The remaining problem to be solved is output routing, so you actually get signal out of 3/4.
I would assume using the headphone jack for anything other than directly plugin a headphone would compromise sound.
You know what they say about "ass-u-me"? ;)

Generally speaking, the vast majority of headphone outputs is perfectly suitable for use as an unbalanced line-out. They are basically just twiddling thumbs in this task, as a line input and some cable might just as well be no load to them, or much less severe than what they normally get to see at least. You may be encountering lower dynamic range and higher levels of distortion when compared to the regular line-outs, but in case of the M2/M4 performance remains at a very high level nonetheless: A dynamic range of 115 dB(A) and THD+N at -110 dB still aren't anything to sneeze at. (Oh, and regular consumer level would actually be reached 4.5 dB below maximum rather than the 6 dB I claimed earlier. That still leaves you with over 110 dB(A) worth of dynamic range, which is plenty.)

This type of setup actually is quite suitable for sprucing up mediocre integrated headphone outputs via an external amp as it allows addressing their typical shortcomings:
Noise level is too high in absolute terms, e.g. with sensitive IEMs? Turn down the amp. Available dynamic range generally is actually adequate and just needs translating down. (My rule of thumb for a line output is 103-105ish dB(A), and 95 will do fine for general use at normal levels. Which means that yes, you can get along fine with lowly onboard audio.)
Maximum output level is too low for insensitive, generally high impedance headphones? The amp will provide extra gain. See above.
The output struggles to provide enough current for insensitive low-impedance headphones (e.g. planars) at high levels, causing excessive distortion? No problem, it'll just need to drive the amp's input.
High output impedance bothering impedance-critical IEMs and headphones? See the item just above.
Poor crosstalk into low-impedance loads due to ground routing issues? Ditto.

It still won't be turning a Focusrite Scarlett gen 3 headphone output into a shining star of measured performance by modern standards, but human hearing should be quite happy with the results.
 

Andysu

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no not buying anymore , i see a use with this or other connected to thee outputs xlr left right to the box as the lousy , stormaudio elite 32 mkIII doesn't even have a simple headphone output , sigh only headphone is denon 8500 or sony SDDS which has cinema monitor headphone output not found on any avr
otherwise i could use one of two audio mixers connected but rarely use headphones only for quick checking monitoring and then its back to the JBL professional cinema speakers , but thanks no thanks stormaudio for no headphone on the processor that is bare on the front with more than enough space for headphone output
 
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