Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

[Newman]

Regarding the "wife in the kitchen hearing something that is better", the only thing I hear from her is "turn down the volume".

If you can hear her, it isn't warranted.

 

[antcollinet]

But then again, my wife who is an engineer (just to add some authority here! ) looked at me and my vinyl AND FROM THE KITCHEN SHE SAID... "YOU ARE AN IDIOT!"

LOL

 

[MattHooper]

Well, I don’t know about you guys, but my wife is always right. At least that’s the impression she gives me.

 

[Ste_S]

Regarding the "wife in the kitchen hearing something that is better", the only thing I hear from her is "turn down the volume".

Playing a Mono copy of Dylan’s John Wesley Harding right now. My wife doesn’t like Dylan. She has just made her feelings known.

 

[MattHooper]

Playing a Mono copy of Dylan’s John Wesley Harding right now. My wife doesn’t like Dylan. She has just made her feelings known.

I might make my feelings known too in that case

(not a Dylan fan myself)

 

[mglobe]

Well, I don’t know about you guys, but my wife is always right. At least that’s the impression she gives me.

I marked the date on my calendar. Every year I will get a reminder that it happened once.

 

[krabapple]

Hold on....is the vinyl renaissance actually OVER? Are we now in the Age of Enlightenment?

This article from January 2023 does not seem to have been cited here at the time (if it was, sorry I missed it):

Did The Music Business Just Kill Vinyl?

Did the Music Business Just Kill the Vinyl Revival?

New data tells an ominous story

www.honest-broker.com

 

[Ste_S]

I kinda hope the vinyl bubble has burst again; purely in the very unlikely hope that pre-Liberty Blue Note pressings come down in price.

 

[levimax]

I recently picked up some new speakers and set them up in my listening room and was impressed with how they sounded. I asked my partner to "check them out" and after several weeks of politely turning me down she finally said "OK one song". Much to my surprise she listened attentively for an hour and a half (streaming is great as I don't have much of her favorite music in my collection) complete with some tears and several glasses of wine. Wonders never cease.

 

[Robin L]

Hold on....is the vinyl renaissance actually OVER? Are we now in the Age of Enlightenment?

This article from January 2023 does not seem to have been cited here at the time (if it was, sorry I missed it):

Did The Music Business Just Kill Vinyl?

Did the Music Business Just Kill the Vinyl Revival?

New data tells an ominous story

www.honest-broker.com

Ted Gioia is very music and business savvy.

 

[KEM]

View attachment 404563

After I received my MS in Physics, I have worked for over 30 years, designing and implementing sophisticated electronic and optical systems for communications, military, and medical R&D, including the creation of one of the first laser driven optical readers for video and audio . I have created, developed, and used extremely sensitive optical devices. I have become intimitely familiar in the methods used to characterize a system, signal, noise, distortion, gain, saturation, bandwidth, quantum efficiency, optical interference and diffraction and so on. I use quantum mechanics daily.
I have used these skills on my sound system. Although my equipment is not as complete as Amir's I can measure quite a few parameters. I regularly use my Benchmark A/D, TrueRTA and REW, computer, oscilloscope, and DVM to chacterize the performance of every one of my components, every one. I do play digital. And I characterize digital components also. And yes they do test better.

I am the most technically minded person I know. I enjoy this site because it provides an alternative to the more qualitative reviews.

And I can't help but be aware of what my ears say to me. Yes, this is a conundrum. I will say flatly that great specs do not necessarily create the best sound. Great specs are a guide to good audio. I do not think that the human race has designed a test for audio equipment that captures the ear, mind and emotion that occurs when listening to music. Not yet.

I do think that there were a few extremely talented mastering enginers at Decca during the 60s and 70s. After that, the LP mastering skill seemed to drop significantly, probably because CDs became the medium to work on. The first CDs created were done very poorly, no bass and screechy highs. I know, I lived through it. This skill has improved.

Mastering is a skill that requires intimate knowledge of the music itself, the placement of recording microphones, the medium, the mastering equipment and the audience. Those Decca techs were very good at extracting as much performance from vinyl as possible. That is not the case today for either CD or vinyl. Also, the sound techs knew where to place microphones.
Many of those Decca LPs were never digitized into CDs. You need to play a record to hear them.

As I have stated in previous posts, the CD and digital formats are very transparent mediums, far better than vinyl. There is no doubt about this fact. The act of recording and transferring recorded music to the CD and digital format is a skill that is acquired, just as for LPs. I have many LPs that are more pleasing than the CD counterpart. The opposite is also true.

Some wonderful, richly rewarding music exists only on LPs. I will never stop listening to LPs just because the specs are not as good, or is too inconvenient, or is too difficult to maintain, or has too many extraneous noises.

 

[Palmer]

I kinda hope the vinyl bubble has burst again; purely in the very unlikely hope that pre-Liberty Blue Note pressings come down in price.

I went out of my way to a vinyl "exchange" to drop off some 150 albums or so, more than 80 percent of it clean stuff that I will never listen to, Linda Ronstead, Bad Company etc. - thinking I might pick up some good records, as I had there several years ago. Used to be 5-6 bucks, maybe 10 for something special. As I am browsing every price was 25, 35, 40 and I left with 3 albums that the fellow gave me a discount on, paid 65.- for the three. No good deed goes unpunished. Goodwill it is from now on...

 

[MattHooper]

Hold on....is the vinyl renaissance actually OVER? Are we now in the Age of Enlightenment?

This article from January 2023 does not seem to have been cited here at the time (if it was, sorry I missed it):

Did The Music Business Just Kill Vinyl?

Did the Music Business Just Kill the Vinyl Revival?

New data tells an ominous story

www.honest-broker.com

I am pretty sure I did decide that article in this thread. (or in any case i’ve read it before and perhaps it was discussed in another forum).

It’s still the case that vinyl sales have continued to rise, including this year.

 

[krabapple]

Now subtract The Tortured Poets Department.

Only 50% of vinyl buyers own turntables was grumpy old me's second best laugh today, after Hugh Grant's answers to the Proust Questionnaire

 

[krabapple]

After I received my MS in Physics, I have worked for over 30 years, designing and implementing sophisticated electronic and optical systems for communications, military, and medical R&D, including the creation of one of the first laser driven optical readers for video and audio . I have created, developed, and used extremely sensitive optical devices. I have become intimitely familiar in the methods used to characterize a system, signal, noise, distortion, gain, saturation, bandwidth, quantum efficiency, optical interference and diffraction and so on. I use quantum mechanics daily.
I have used these skills on my sound system. Although my equipment is not as complete as Amir's I can measure quite a few parameters. I regularly use my Benchmark A/D, TrueRTA and REW, computer, oscilloscope, and DVM to chacterize the performance of every one of my components, every one. I do play digital. And I characterize digital components also. And yes they do test better.

I am the most technically minded person I know. I enjoy this site because it provides an alternative to the more qualitative reviews.

And I can't help but be aware of what my ears say to me. Yes, this is a conundrum. I will say flatly that great specs do not necessarily create the best sound. Great specs are a guide to good audio. I do not think that the human race has designed a test for audio equipment that captures the ear, mind and emotion that occurs when listening to music. Not yet.

Since I assume you respect 'audio science', can you agree flatly that sighted listening is not the way to nail down the best reason why you think this?

 

[Robin L]

Since I assume you respect 'audio science', can you agree flatly that sighted listening is not the way to nail down the best reason why you think this?

Come come now - seeing the shiny rainbow reflection of a spinning black disc as it sings is inducement enough to embrace the LP listening experience.

 

[KEM]

Since I assume you respect 'audio science', can you agree flatly that sighted listening is not the way to nail down the best reason why you think this?

I don't understand what you mean by "sighted listening". Could you explain?

 

[Blumlein 88]

After I received my MS in Physics, I have worked for over 30 years, designing and implementing sophisticated electronic and optical systems for communications, military, and medical R&D, including the creation of one of the first laser driven optical readers for video and audio . I have created, developed, and used extremely sensitive optical devices. I have become intimitely familiar in the methods used to characterize a system, signal, noise, distortion, gain, saturation, bandwidth, quantum efficiency, optical interference and diffraction and so on. I use quantum mechanics daily.
I have used these skills on my sound system. Although my equipment is not as complete as Amir's I can measure quite a few parameters. I regularly use my Benchmark A/D, TrueRTA and REW, computer, oscilloscope, and DVM to chacterize the performance of every one of my components, every one. I do play digital. And I characterize digital components also. And yes they do test better.

I am the most technically minded person I know. I enjoy this site because it provides an alternative to the more qualitative reviews.

And I can't help but be aware of what my ears say to me. Yes, this is a conundrum. I will say flatly that great specs do not necessarily create the best sound. Great specs are a guide to good audio. I do not think that the human race has designed a test for audio equipment that captures the ear, mind and emotion that occurs when listening to music. Not yet.

Not one bit of your experience or knowledge will protect you from the perils of sighted listening bias. It is hardwired in humans. Perhaps learning a bit about psychoacoustics and how easily sighted listening changes what your brain hears beyond what sound reaches your ears will expand your knowledge usefully. Everyone including myself experience the conundrum. You are correct we are not designed to test audio equipment simply by listening without controls because our minds and emotions effect what and how we hear. I heard an old Oliver Sachs interview on the radio today. He said near 30 areas of the brain light up when music is played. More than happens listening to speech.

I do think that there were a few extremely talented mastering enginers at Decca during the 60s and 70s. After that, the LP mastering skill seemed to drop significantly, probably because CDs became the medium to work on. The first CDs created were done very poorly, no bass and screechy highs. I know, I lived through it. This skill has improved.

Funny my early CDs sound just fine today. I think the switchover had more to do with people knowing the sound of vinyl and having systems optimized for it. Drop in a truly flat device like a CD player and it sounded wrong. I once participated in comparing LPs, commercial RTR, and CDs with a group. The basic balance of the early CDs and RTR was pretty much the same. LPs were always obviously the odd man out. The whole vinyl chain is a colored chain lacking in transparency vs reel tape or CD. Sure it can sound good and everyone who wants to can and should enjoy vinyl anyway. There was nothing wrong with CD even in the beginning.

Mastering is a skill that requires intimate knowledge of the music itself, the placement of recording microphones, the medium, the mastering equipment and the audience. Those Decca techs were very good at extracting as much performance from vinyl as possible. That is not the case today for either CD or vinyl. Also, the sound techs knew where to place microphones.
Many of those Decca LPs were never digitized into CDs. You need to play a record to hear them.

As I have stated in previous posts, the CD and digital formats are very transparent mediums, far better than vinyl. There is no doubt about this fact. The act of recording and transferring recorded music to the CD and digital format is a skill that is acquired, just as for LPs. I have many LPs that are more pleasing than the CD counterpart. The opposite is also true.

Some wonderful, richly rewarding music exists only on LPs. I will never stop listening to LPs just because the specs are not as good, or is too inconvenient, or is too difficult to maintain, or has too many extraneous noises.

I don't think anyone is suggesting one stop listening to LPs because of lower specs, lesser convenience etc. Some have this idea analog (they usually mean vinyl) is more natural and digital has some problem. Something you did not do in your post. It is those claims that many around here don't like.

 

[Blumlein 88]

I don't understand what you mean by "sighted listening". Could you explain?

You had posted:
I will say flatly that great specs do not necessarily create the best sound.

That with your other comments leads us to think you've listened to various formats etc by just listening. Listening and going by how you feel about them. It would indicate some other factor beyond measurements accounts for what creates the best sound. For that statement to be so you must have in mind some piece of gear or chain of gear that measures worse, but sounds better.

Yet testing done indicates that is not the case. Testing done with controls. Testing done blind as in the listeners can choose, but doesn't know what is different in what he or she is choosing between. Levels are matched. Sighted listening is when you listen to an LP and then a CD. You know what was changed. You know when you are listening to one or the other. Or you compare a tube amp and a class D amp. You know when you are listening to one or the other. That unblinded or sighted knowledge leaves you open to a variety of biases to create an experience of different sound for each situation whether the sound is different or not. And you feel one is better than the other and may perceive something that isn't born out in the sound waves you are hearing.

 

[KEM]

You had posted:
I will say flatly that great specs do not necessarily create the best sound.

That with your other comments leads us to think you've listened to various formats etc by just listening. Listening and going by how you feel about them. It would indicate some other factor beyond measurements accounts for what creates the best sound. For that statement to be so you must have in mind some piece of gear or chain of gear that measures worse, but sounds better.

Yet testing done indicates that is not the case. Testing done with controls. Testing done blind as in the listeners can choose, but doesn't know what is different in what he or she is choosing between. Levels are matched. Sighted listening is when you listen to an LP and then a CD. You know what was changed. You know when you are listening to one or the other. Or you compare a tube amp and a class D amp. You know when you are listening to one or the other. That unblinded or sighted knowledge leaves you open to a variety of biases to create an experience of different sound for each situation whether the sound is different or not. And you feel one is better than the other and may perceive something that isn't born out in the sound waves you are hearing.

After I've done my measurements, I sit back and listen. I'm not interested in doing contolled experiments on human behavoir. I'm no expert. And I don't really care. As biased as I probably am, I enjoy listening to music, I know what makes me feel good and I know what doesn't. Sure, there are numerous factors that I am completely unaware of. This fact does not invalidate my experience. I will leave the controlled experiments to the experts.