Archimago: Inside an APx555

[chris719]

Great thread. Thanks for sharing.

The blue boards are pretty, even if the fans are obnoxious.

Some places have rules like blue for production and green or red for prototypes. I used to love the different colors but now I prefer green - it just is easier on the eyes in inspection. Blue is not bad, though. White was neat for about 5 minutes until I realized that it's terrible for anything other than showing you flux residue.

 

[AudioSceptic]

Great thread. Thanks for sharing.

The blue boards are pretty, even if the fans are obnoxious.

Can one of the experts here tell me how AP compares with Rhode & Schwartz, which seems to be the other big name in SoTA measurement?

 

[Tks]

Some places have rules like blue for production and green or red for prototypes. I used to love the different colors but now I prefer green - it just is easier on the eyes in inspection. Blue is not bad, though. White was neat for about 5 minutes until I realized that it's terrible for anything other than showing you flux residue.

I hear white is the most expensive as well. Is that true for single solid colors?

 

[dougi]

Can one of the experts here tell me how AP compares with Rhode & Schwartz, which seems to be the other big name in SoTA measurement?

The datasheets for the R&S UPV and the Keysight U8903B analyser are readily available. I assume, at first glance, not as resolving as the AP since inherent THD seems to be 110-115dB. Both R& and Keysight do tend to have very good local support and info/whitepapers available though.

 

[chris719]

I hear white is the most expensive as well. Is that true for single solid colors?

I don’t know if there are any price differences in bulk. It used to be that anything other than green was an extra cost if you didn’t have the volume for multiple panels of your own. It seems that the cost for alternate colors has gone down in general. Some batch services might have different pricing due to diffferent demand for each color.

Generally it’s assumed that all LPI solder mask is the same, but I’ve heard people claim that there are slight differences in minimum tolerances between colors. I’ve never seen evidence or gone looking at datasheets, honestly.

 

[restorer-john]

The datasheets for the R&S UPV and the Keysight U8903B analyser are readily available.

Is the R&S UPV still running embedded Windows XP? I'd buy it over an APX for my purposes.

 

[dougi]

Is the R&S UPV still running embedded Windows XP? I'd buy it over an APX for my purposes.

As far as I know it is.

 

[KSTR]

Next time I'll open my AP SYS2322 built in 1995 I'll take photos for a comparison how things have evolved since then.
While it is not quiet, it's OK level for me for some hours of work. Other high-tech equipment of the day made much more noise and produced much more heat (Tektronix DSA600, anyone?)

 

[nagster]

https://www.rohde-schwarz.com/de/produkte/messtechnik/audioanalysatoren_63675.html
R&S UPV has finally been discontinued.
Withdraw from audio measurement?
Or are they going to exceed APx555B?
In that case, I may pay up to USD5000.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Those who haven't heard the fan in the old (and large) Tektronix vacuum tube oscilloscopes don't know what loud is. They called them 'the wind tunnel' for a reason. Kids these days are wimps with their foo-foo sissy fans.

 

[restorer-john]

Those who haven't heard the fan in the old (and large) Tektronix vacuum tube oscilloscopes don't know what loud is. They called them 'the wind tunnel' for a reason. Kids these days are wimps with their foo-foo sissy fans.

Honestly, my DSO gets less use, compared to my old skool CROs due to the fuggin' fan noise. For audio, a CRO is best, the DSO is hopeless for XY (lissajous) and too slow, not intuitive and the dials are not fixed (just encoders with no pointer).

I think the sweet spot were the Tek DSO scopes from the early days.

 

[tomchr]

I hear white is the most expensive as well. Is that true for single solid colors?

Depends on the manufacturer. Some have just upped the price of green solder mask to match the other colours. My assembly house hates the white and yellow solder masks. Yellow doesn't offer enough contrast with the white silk screen legend and tends to mess up the automated optical inspection that's done at several steps in the assembly process. White tends to discolour (it'll sometimes turn almost pink) when it goes through the solder reflow oven.

I find the APx525 and APx555 to be pretty quiet in operation. Yes. There is some whirring of fans. Big whoop! Mine is no more than 50 cm from my head when I'm measuring stuff.
If you want to know what a loud fan sounds like, try working next to one of the older pieces of HP test gear, such as the HP3562/63, HP3577, HP4194A, etc. Or a Dell PC for that matter...

Tom

 

[Tks]

Depends on the manufacturer. Some have just upped the price of green solder mask to match the other colours. My assembly house hates the white and yellow solder masks. Yellow doesn't offer enough contrast with the white silk screen legend and tends to mess up the automated optical inspection that's done at several steps in the assembly process. White tends to discolour (it'll sometimes turn almost pink) when it goes through the solder reflow oven.

I find the APx525 and APx555 to be pretty quiet in operation. Yes. There is some whirring of fans. Big whoop! Mine is no more than 50 cm from my head when I'm measuring stuff.
If you want to know what a loud fan sounds like, try working next to one of the older pieces of HP test gear, such as the HP3562/63, HP3577, HP4194A, etc. Or a Dell PC for that matter...

Tom

Haven’t touched Dell since the early 00’s

Though I doubt any modern consumer devices are loud all that much anymore.

 

[Dion_Sinewave]

It is loud all the time. No temperature sensitivity. I don't know why they think this level of noise is acceptable in a lab.

I put mine in a vented but enclosed rack and that helped cut the noise in half. Still, I cannot work beside it without closed back headphones.

Wow that is too loud. I did the Noctoura mod to my Lake DLP as soon as I received it.

 

[SIY]

I find the APx525 and APx555 to be pretty quiet in operation. Yes. There is some whirring of fans. Big whoop! Mine is no more than 50 cm from my head when I'm measuring stuff.

For speaker testing, I had to isolate the APx525 and APx1701 in a different room and run cables. Still worked perfectly, though.

I've requested a Lissajous feature in the software; I've been generating those manually from data files. On va voir...

 

[kelesh]

Noctua is a newcomer to industrial fans. It's not only the quality of fan, it's that they have chosen a small fan for the amount of air and static pressure they want. Any high output fan is loud. The solution is a larger fan or additional slower fans and fewer obstructions. San Ace, Nidec, etc. are great fans, but anything is going to be annoyingly loud if specified that way.

Years ago, I used to religiously "quiet" and "militarize" power supplies and various other pieces of electronics (my way of describing lowering noise and increasing reliability ). I went through literally hundreds of fans and ended up favoring Nidec, Sanyo-Denki, Panaflo and Papst fans. Sadly, all these manufacturers have closed down their original factories (the first three in Japan, Papst in Germany), their current output is made elsewhere and is not as good. Honestly, if I paid 30K for a piece of gear and found a Sunon fan inside, I'd not be too happy (though they have improved over the years). I'd immediately replace it with a comparable fan from my stash of NOS from the aforementioned 4 brands I don't know who makes Noctua's product, but it just doesn't feel solid enough and I wouldn't trust its longevity.

 

[amirm]

I don't know about APx555 but the previous generator AP I had, had very poor air flow inside. There were hot components everywhere on every board and every corner. And no air flow management. So I would not have dared putting a temperature controlled fan in it. I would have similar concern with the APx555 unless shown otherwise.

 

[restorer-john]

Unless AP comes out with a retro-fit quieter fan kit specifically designated for the 555, I would not mess with it.

It's a pity they didn't take fan noise and thermal managment more seriously, but it is what it is.

 

[nagster]

Is the R&S UPV still running embedded Windows XP? I'd buy it over an APX for my purposes.

I think it's resolved, but this is the startup screen. There may also be a windows7 kit.

edit:
I uploaded them in order of progress, but the order has changed. Please view them in order of file number.

 

[weme]

Is the R&S UPV still running embedded Windows XP? I'd buy it over an APX for my purposes.

I think it's resolved, but this is the startup screen. There may also be a windows7 kit.

The R&S UPV audio analyzer is equipped with an internal computer. Up to February 2007, the instruments were supplied with a computer bearing the internal Rohde & Schwarz designation FMR6, from March 2007 with FMR7, from March 2012 with FMR9 and from February 2015 with FMR11 ...
Instruments with FMR11 support Windows 7 only ...
Instruments with FMR6 do not support Windows 7.

https://scdn.rohde-schwarz.com/ur/pws/dl_downloads/dl_common_library/dl_manuals/gb_1/u/upv_1/UPV_UserManual_en_14.pdf

R&S®UPP/UPV Firmware Release Note Version 4.0.5
Component / FW version
UPxCheckPreconditions / 1.4.2
UPVCompass_-Release / 3.1.18.21
Setup_4.0.20107Release / 4.0.2"
Now fully supporting the Windows 7 operating system [UPV - UPP]

https://scdn.rohde-schwarz.com/ur/pws/dl_downloads/pdm/firmware/1146_2103_00/UPX_4.0.5_FW_Release_Note.doc

R&S UPV audio analyzer - Compact instrument for all audio measurements

R&S®UPV audio analyzer

This audio analyzer is an instrument for all audio measurements at analog and digital interfaces

www.rohde-schwarz.com