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Not so sure. My HD600 were bought around 2013 and came with a 6.35mm termination. I like the cable (much more so than the one on the HD800s I recently got), except for the sheer length.
Depends on the Q value (width of influence) and where in the frequency range, it's not really a can of worms. In my EQ experimentation I've found it quite obvious the differences even with 1 dB when it's over a large part of the frequency range. According to the differences between HD600 & HD650 you're talking a dB or two over large widths, so I would experience those as audible differences if switching quickly between different EQ's on the same portion of a track I know well.Sometime soon we are going to open the can of worms that is "how audible is a dB or 2 of eq difference when playing music? "
Depends on the Q value (width of influence) and where in the frequency range, it's not really a can of worms. In my EQ experimentation I've found it quite obvious the differences even with 1 dB when it's over a large part of the frequency range. According to the differences between HD600 & HD650 you're talking a dB or two over large widths, so I would experience those as audible differences if switching quickly between different EQ's.
No doubt. I believe I can tell the difference too when I toggle a 1db/2db /3db bass shelf too. But when there are other small differences in play in other areas of the spectrum, or when you have to unplug and swap cans, maybe not as obvious perhaps.
Yeah, very hard to tell the difference when unplugging & swapping cans, due to the longer time difference, but easier when toggling an EQ. Even if that is the case, I'd still rather choose the headphone that is closer to my preference.No doubt. I believe I can tell the difference too when I toggle a 1db/2db /3db bass shelf too. But when there are other small differences in play in other areas of the spectrum, or when you have to unplug and swap cans, maybe not as obvious perhaps.
That's quite a good idea, especially point #1, but it may be a bit too much to ask for subjective listening differences when swapping cans given the relatively long length of time between swapping....certainly measurements would show the difference though. It could be argued that there are enough other measurements out there that we know that there are subtle differences between HD600 & HD650 (Crinacle / Oratory / Solderdude)....do we need another data point to confirm that.....I wouldn't say no, but personally I'm convinced of the subtle & measurable difference between HD600 & HD650 as all those 3 sources I mentioned show consistent differences between the two headphones.@amirm: Would you please repeat your measurements and listening impressions with the following changes:
1) Add new earpads to the HD 600 and HD 650 to remove the effects of aging and compare "like" with "like"
2) Swap currently used earpads between HD 600 and HD 650
Reasoning:
It has been documented by so many measurements from so many people that when HD600 pads wear/compress, they start sounding more like HD650s because the upper mids get relatively suppressed.I think this is a fair request. If all of the above leads to the same result, your initial statement "both perform the same" is universally valid...and not only for these two specimens (with all their wear and tear) tested.
These measurements are how I heard these phones when I had them. Amir's show them more similar. At least with the iterations I had the 600 was better, in terms of accuracy, and the 650 a little soupy.RE: HD600 vs HD650, I got a slightly different result. Do note that in this comparison I've managed to measure brand new 2020 versions of both the HD600 and HD650 ("2020 versions" being that the granite countertop aethestic of the older HD600s are done away) as well as fresh pads.
View attachment 128789
(3 samples per channel for a total of 6 samples per headphone, averaged out.)
Not a huge difference of course, but enough for me to prefer one over the other (HD600 over HD650 in my case). I don't think the two are functionally identical though I will concede that pad wear actually does minimise the differences between the two, to the point where well-worn HD600s and HD650s are virtually indistinguishable to my ears.
(Before anyone comments that my 43AG-7 setup makes my data unreliable, do note that I have a custom-built mounting solution that spaces out the cups to the width of an average human head, much like the 45CA.)
it is quite possible that they are imagining hearing the difference and would not be able to tell them apart in a blind test.the joke site where people think that the 600 and 650 are the same, while every random people in the street could tell the clear difference.
it is quite possible that they are imagining hearing the difference and would not be able to tell them apart in a blind test.
We all know comparing DACS and comparing headphones/speakers are a whole different ball game! Definitely not a DAC thread here.If you said that in a DAC thread your hand would be sore from all the hi-5s.
Deluded folks.
Likewise for the HD660S vs the 58X. When I saw Sennheiser was using the same 150 ohm spec. It didnt take much to conclude their lazy asses werent doing anything special.
Also, whats up with the prices on their site? $500 for an HD650 (and now both their 600 and 650 are out of stock for some reason). When did they reach these prices? They have lost their minds.
We all know comparing DACS and comparing headphones/speakers are a whole different ball game! Definitely not a DAC thread here.
By the way, would Karman happen to be a portmanteau Harman Kardon?
First thing I saw too!
Poor child, imagine being named after Harman Kardon. Probably @amirm originally was going to call him Sonny (Sony), but thought better of it.
Could be worse, he could be Karman Hardon