Spyware In Cars - It's Worse Than You Think

[KSTR]

depends on where you live

This.
I'm in the lucky situation that I enjoy to live in a country in a big city (4,000,000) which is generally safe, has excellent and pretty affordable public transport, excellent general living infrastructure and lot's of cultural institutions and, most important to me, general respect and facilities for bicycles (not as good as some Dutch or Danish cities, but still). Driving a car, let alone owning a personal one, does make zero sense here, it just piles up costs and frustration. And it's been only recently that I bought my first e-bike.
Further when I'm on vacation with my wife we select destinations/countries which have sufficient public transport.

In many other countries and cities around the world the above properties do not exist so driving in your own private car is the only way.

 

[AdrianusG]

Don't worry, when they finally get self driving to be markedly safer than human driving, they won't allow you to drive anyway.

But, the autonomous pod that you get into will know exactly who you are and where you're going.

I'll see you out there on your untracked, human controlled, and possibly, powered, bicycles.

Well,

I'm 59 now, but I personally don't see safe, self driving cars happening before i'm gone, .....unless i'm going to make it to 90ish, which is even less likely to happen

 

[somebodyelse]

Well,

I'm 59 now, but I personally don't see safe, self driving cars happening before i'm gone, .....unless i'm going to make it to 90ish, which is even less likely to happen

Define 'safe' - it's not as if cars are without danger with humans behind the wheel, and even that varies significantly depending on where you are etc. Do they need to be as safe as a taxi, a bus, a train or an aircraft? Do they have to be as good as, or better than, an average human all the time, or just in most situations? How about a human driver we consider bad, but haven't banned? Are we considering the safety only of those in cars, or pedestrians, cyclists, bikers, horses, emergency services and others where self driving cars have a history of problems so far?

 

[EJ3]

Fair enough, they're too crowded anyway, the last thing cities need is people who would prefer not to be there.

Sometimes I would rather be way out in the middle of nowhere myself, but city life suits me okay.

I'm on 3/4 of an acre with a small area that was left natural woods (in 1964 we did not have to remove any trees to build our home). There is a deep water creek which we have at the edge of the back yard (with a dock & a 15ft boat with a 15 HP outboard (obtaining fresh fish, crabs, shrimp is simple, right off of the dock, oysters: take the boat out to an oyster bed and get them).
I have a view of the City of Charleston, SC (across the marshes and a couple of other creeks & a bridge about 5 miles away as the crow flies).
Unfortunately the City has managed to annex up to across the street from me, put in some 14" pipe in ditches that where 4 ft wide & 3 ft deep, covered the pipe put a grate at one end and created a road & yard flooding problem.
And a city is also a great place to be if there is a war and you want to get bombed. (my mother received a bit of WWII bombing in Salzburg, Austria when she was a child)
Bombing suburban & rural arears is not cost effective. Cities generally have industrial areas clumped together that are very cost effective to bomb.

 

[Count Arthur]

I'm on 3/4 of an acre with a small area that was left natural woods (in 1964 we did not have to remove any trees to build our home). There is a deep water creek which we have at the edge of the back yard and I have a view of the City of Charleston, SC (across the marshes and a couple of other creeks & a bridge about 5 miles away as the crow flies).
Unfortunately the City has managed to annex up to across the street from me, put in some 14" pipe in ditches that where 4 ft wide & 3 ft deep, covered the pipe put a grate at one end and created a road & yard flooding problem.
A city is also a great place to be if there is a war and you want to get bombed.
Bombing suburban & rural arears is not cost effective. Cities generally have industrial areas clumped together that are very cost effective to bomb.

That's an odd worry for a US citizen, given that, outside Hawaii, the US has never been bombed.

Whereas pretty much everywhere else has; often by the US.

 

[Doodski]

That's an odd worry for a US citizen, given that, outside Hawaii, the US has never been bombed.

Whereas pretty much everywhere else has; often by the US.

If you include canon fire then the USA has been invaded and bombed per say.
Burning of Washington>

Burning of Washington - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Count Arthur]

If you include canon fire then the USA has been invaded and bombed per say.
Burning of Washington>

Burning of Washington - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I was referring to bombing by the aircraft of a foreign military power, or perhaps even missile attacks; not explosive devices.

 

[jkasch]

A 15 minute city with no mental institutions, cashless bail, DA’s that rarely prosecute, and a feckless police force… sounds like utopia to me.

 

[Doodski]

A 15 minute city with no mental institutions, cashless bail, DA’s that rarely prosecute, and a feckless police force… sounds like utopia to me.

You sir @jkasch have nail'd it big time and it is fact where I live.

 

[jkasch]

You sir @jkasch have nail'd it big time and it is fact where I live.

Thanks. Sorry about your place of residence.

 

[Doodski]

Thanks. Sorry about your place of residence.

Yeah, me too.

 

[thegeton]

If a persons main driving safety issue is other people are driving too slow that might be a sign? To avoid aggressive driving, below are strategies offered by internet sources.

1. Practice Polite Driving Habits: Avoid tailgating, cutting off other vehicles, speeding, weaving, leaving high beam headlights on, and erratic braking. Merge politely and always err on the side of being courteous. Avoid using phone or texting while driving. Pay attention to the road.
2. Slow Down: Let aggressive drivers go around you and they will quickly be on their way.
3. Get Away from Aggressive Drivers: If you notice a driver with aggressive behavior, create distance between you by slowing down or changing lanes.
4. Don't Make Rude Gestures or Yell: Avoid engaging with aggressive drivers by making rude gestures or yelling. Avoid eye contact with an aggressive driver trying to provoke a reaction.
5. Use Your Horn Sparingly: Horns should primarily be used in emergency situations. Tap your horn lightly if needed to get a driver's attention.
6. Avoid Making Driving Competitive: Remember that driving is not a competition; focus on getting home safely rather than teaching other drivers a lesson.
7. Apologize if You've Made a Mistake: If you accidentally cut off another driver or make a mistake, smile and wave as an apology to disarm and calm most drivers. If you hit a parked car, leave your insurance and contact information.
8. Don't Drive Under Distress: Avoid driving if you're angry, upset, or drowsy to prevent reacting aggressively to other drivers' mistakes.
9. Adjust Your Driving Attitude: Give other drivers the benefit of the doubt and consider whether responding aggressively is worth the risk of injury or harm.
10. Have Reasonable Expectations About Travel Time: Plan your travel time wisely, give yourself plenty of time to reach your destination, and avoid setting unreasonable expectations for arrival time.
11. Call 911 if Under Attack: If confronted by an aggressive driver behaving violently, call 911 immediately and drive to a safe public location with witnesses.
12. If you took the time to read these suggestions and think they are proper etiquette, you're probably not an aggressive driver.

Thanks Dad.

 

[Ron Texas]

The 15 minute city is a pipe dream of climate alarmists. The implication is everyone lives in giant multifamily buildings over offices and commercial areas. It's all connected underground or through elevated walkways. Forget about spacious homes or having a garden. Privacy is minimal and lots of people are around all the time. It's kind of like Manhattan or Hong Kong.

 

[Count Arthur]

It seems that most of the people that object to the idea, are people that don't live in cities. But people that live outside in the countryside, or the suburbs, that want high speed roads into cities, with a disregard or how unsafe and unpleasant it is for people that do live in the city to have the noise, pollution and danger of high speed traffic thundering right through their neighbourhoods.

Anyone that wants to go down the rabbit hole should check out Not Just Bikes:

https://www.youtube.com/@NotJustBikes/videos

 

[AdrianusG]

Define 'safe' - it's not as if cars are without danger with humans behind the wheel, and even that varies significantly depending on where you are etc. Do they need to be as safe as a taxi, a bus, a train or an aircraft? Do they have to be as good as, or better than, an average human all the time, or just in most situations? How about a human driver we consider bad, but haven't banned? Are we considering the safety only of those in cars, or pedestrians, cyclists, bikers, horses, emergency services and others where self driving cars have a history of problems so far?

By safe i mean, just as safe or better than current situation (human errors and all!) but as far as fully autonomous vehicles where you get in and IT does the rest, we are simply not there yet, not even close!

 

[DLS79]

It seems that most of the people that object to the idea, are people that don't live in cities. But people that live outside in the countryside, or the suburbs, that want high speed roads into cities, with a disregard or how unsafe and unpleasant it is for people that do live in the city to have the noise, pollution and danger of high speed traffic thundering right through their neighbourhoods.

I don't agree!

I've been through a lot of big cities, and they all have highways going into and through them. When you get off the highway, you usually exit onto a main thoroughfare where the speed limit decreases. By the time you are in an actual neighborhood you are usually on at least a secondary if not a tertiary street where the speed limit is 20 to 35 mph, and traffic is very low.

Also the cities all have open spaces where you can walk, bike, run etc.

 

[kemmler3D]

Well,

I'm 59 now, but I personally don't see safe, self driving cars happening before i'm gone, .....unless i'm going to make it to 90ish, which is even less likely to happen

Your timeline might be a little out of date. I've taken 3 rides in safe (based on my subjective experience, and the data released by Waymo, if you believe it) self-driving cars already and actually plan to do another today. A friend of mine has been on 200 rides, apparently! (He got a free pass in the first year it was offered.)

Despite all the headlines, these robot cars are already pretty good. It doesn't' make the news when it gets you from point A to point B successfully, but maybe it should? My subjective review: "surprisingly lifelike". The only inhuman thing about it, is it follows the speed limit very precisely.

"Safe" is relative. People behind the wheel are objectively not safe at all, so the bar is pretty low.

 

[Ron Texas]

@Count Arthur you appear to be saying the only choice is to live downtown and everyone else is wrong.

 

[kemmler3D]

@Count Arthur you appear to be saying the only choice is to live downtown and everyone else is wrong.

I think he's saying that building everything with one mode of transportation in mind (cars) isn't necessarily a good idea... anyone that's visited LA would probably have to agree.

Setting aside the environmental argument for a minute, driving long distances in traffic is just a huge annoyance and waste of time. Recently I came up 101 and hit San Jose around rush hour. There was a line of cars nearly a half mile long just waiting to get on a bridge. If things had gone a different way in terms of planning some 50 years ago, that traffic jam would not need to exist because maybe the trains there would be adequate instead of sort of a shadow of adequacy.

I also think big cities don't capture what I imagine when someone says "15-minute city". I think "built up suburban 'downtown'" is more like it. I was in West Hartford, CT over the holidays and they've probably got close to the idea. It's certainly nothing like Hong Kong, which is still probably the most urbanized place I've been.

 

[Ron Texas]

@kemmler3D I visit the Bay Area frequently and am familiar with its awful traffic. I live in Houston which is 85% on private cars and 15% on an inefficient spoke and hub bus and trolley system. Surprisingly, the trolley (light rail) has very strong ridership. At least in the US we are going to a hybrid work model with 3 days in the office. That cuts down in commuting a lot. I used to waste a lot of time in traffic and eventually moved closer to downtown. Many of the big companies in Houston are moving out of downtown which gives their employees an easier commute and more affordable options for living closer to work. Exxon recently moved to the Woodlands. Things are evolving due to market forces. The old model of commute to the suburbs from downtown 5 or 6 days a week is evolving to something more humane.

Let's not even mention the environmental argument since it's a quick trip to getting the thread shut down.