Should I upgrade my DAC/AMP stack?

[Azeendeen]

I've been told that I need to upgrade my DAC and AMP, but more on upgrading my AMP. I have a THX 789 and an SMSL SU-8 DAC.

I guess my higher-impedance headphones like the ZMF Aeolus and Sennheiser HD 600 could use more power. I also recently bought the Sony MDR-Z1R and Fostex TH900 MK2 and feel that my current set-up does not do them justice. I think it can sound even better with a cleaner DAC and more power.

These are the current DAC/AMP combos offered at my local audiophile shops.

1. Ferrum ERCO - 3500SGD (This is really steep but if someone can convince me to buy it, I will buy it)
2. Questyle CMA15 - 3199SGD
3. Questyle CMA12 Master - 2551 SGD
4. Violectric HPA V226 - 2469 SGD
5. Matrix Audio Element M - 2400 SGD (This is a streamer and has a lot of other features I don't know what to use for)
6. Matrix Audio Element 12 - 2400 SGD (This one too is a streamer.
7. WOO Audio WA7 - 2089 SGD (This is a DAC and tube amp combo)
8. Lehman Linear - 1600 SGD
9. Fiio K9 PRO - 1260 SGD

 

[Jimbob54]

I've been told

By whom?

upgrading my AMP

Do you have the THX on high gain and using balanced output and full volume? If no, then you dont need a new amp for any of your headphones

I think it can sound even better with a cleaner DAC and more power.

The SU8 (v2 anyway) is perfectly fine- you really arent going to get an improvement in sound from changing the DAC. You might get a different sound by using some dac / amp combo that has massive distortion but not sure that means "better" https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...-su-8-version-2-balanced-dac.5433/post-120591

"feel that my current set-up does not do them justice" - what symptoms from your current system lead you to conclude this?

You will find plenty of people out in the headphone world to encourage you to open your wallet on the promise of "better sound" - hopefully not too many here will.

I assume you have experimented with using EQ in your chain?

 

[delta76]

I've been told that I need to upgrade my DAC and AMP, but more on upgrading my AMP. I have a THX 789 and an SMSL SU-8 DAC.

I guess my higher-impedance headphones like the ZMF Aeolus and Sennheiser HD 600 could use more power. I also recently bought the Sony MDR-Z1R and Fostex TH900 MK2 and feel that my current set-up does not do them justice. I think it can sound even better with a cleaner DAC and more power.

These are the current DAC/AMP combos offered at my local audiophile shops.

1. Ferrum ERCO - 3500SGD (This is really steep but if someone can convince me to buy it, I will buy it)
2. Questyle CMA15 - 3199SGD
3. Questyle CMA12 Master - 2551 SGD
4. Violectric HPA V226 - 2469 SGD
5. Matrix Audio Element M - 2400 SGD (This is a streamer and has a lot of other features I don't know what to use for)
6. Matrix Audio Element 12 - 2400 SGD (This one too is a streamer.
7. WOO Audio WA7 - 2089 SGD (This is a DAC and tube amp combo)
8. Lehman Linear - 1600 SGD
9. Fiio K9 PRO - 1260 SGD

you have mighty fine setup. don't listen to the sales man at your local audiophile shops - they simply want to sell you the most expensive sets (usually also the ones with highest margin).

 

[Azeendeen]

@Jimbob54
To be honest, I don't even have to use the balanced mode on my THX. Single ended works on all my headphones.

I have also tried using EQ on my gear.

 

[Dunring]

That's a great combo you have and the only reason to upgrade would be if your amplifier isn't giving enough single ended power to equalize. That amp has a limit of 2.1v before it clips internally in high gain mode. If you dial back -7db to use high, then on the single end I've run out of power on some headphones. I have the SU-8S DAC and can tell you there's not going to be an audible upgrade for that.
Just upgrade the amp if you need more single ended power. I use an SMSL SP200 with the SU-8S and it's great, especially for planars. Apos has them $140 with warranty. The SH-8 is even better for IEMs though, same power on all plugs, and can handle 4 volts from a DAC too.

 

[Azeendeen]

@delta76
Yeh true. I always thought my gear was fine. The SMSL SU8 has great reviews and so does the THX 789. The THX 789 also has so much power.

I guess I was just bored and decided to look around.

 

[Azeendeen]

That's a great combo you have and the only reason to upgrade would be if your amplifier isn't giving enough single ended power to equalize. That amp has a limit of 2.1v before it clips internally in high gain mode. If you dial back -7db to use high, then on the single end I've run out of power on some headphones. I have the SU-8S DAC and can tell you there's not going to be an audible upgrade for that.
Just upgrade the amp if you need more single ended power. I use an SMSL SP200 with the SU-8S and it's great, especially for planars. Apos has them $140 with warranty. The SH-8 is even better for IEMs though, same power on all plugs, and can handle 4 volts from a DAC too.

I'll check it out.

I've been told here my DAC is absolutely fine. You are right about the AMP though, will look around for more alternatives. I'm feeling a bit lush with my budget

 

[delta76]

@delta76
Yeh true. I always thought my gear was fine. The SMSL SU8 has great reviews and so does the THX 789. The THX 789 also has so much power.

I guess I was just bored and decided to look around.

the upgraditis - get it. keep in mind that almost anything you buy will not sound "better". if you want a better looking, better made, or from your favorite brand, yes, but they can't objectively sound better. if it sounds better to your ear, because it has certain distortions that resonate with your personal preference, and in most cases those can be EQ'ed on your current set up

 

[xaviescacs]

Take a look at the RME ADI 2 if you want something "better". Otherwise you're fine IMHO.

 

[unpluggged]

I'll check it out.

I've been told here my DAC is absolutely fine. You are right about the AMP though, will look around for more alternatives. I'm feeling a bit lush with my budget

If you want to try out something just for the fun of it, I suggest you get the Qudelix 5K. It's affordable and very useful, just the PEQ feature alone makes it worth it IMO. Otherwise, unless you get something like the ADI-2 DAC/Pro, there is no point in spending more money.

 

[Azeendeen]

@unpluggged

If you want to try out something just for the fun of it, I suggest you get the Qudelix 5K. It's affordable and very useful, just the PEQ feature alone makes it worth it IMO. Otherwise, unless you get something like the ADI-2 DAC/Pro, there is no point in spending more money.

@unpluggged @xaviescacs

I think I will actually get the RME ADI-2.
I am need of finding an upgrade to my L30 Amp + Creative Soundblaster X g6 setup that I use in my University dorm.

The ADI 2 is DAC/AMP combo and would be so easy to put in my suitcase

 

[xaviescacs]

would be so easy to put in my suitcase

Because of its size and weight it's portable, but it hasn't a rubber case and has three buttons that protrude quite a bit. So please be careful! Otherwise, it's a wondferful device for doing a lot of things in a small space.

 

[Azeendeen]

Because of its size and weight it's portable, but it hasn't a rubber case and has three buttons that protrude quite a bit. So please be careful! Otherwise, it's a wondferful device for doing a lot of things in a small space.

Wait do you know if I should consider the Questyle CMA15?

It has less jam packed features but looks more future proof and a one time purchase as it has a really powerful amplifier and a ES9038PRO dac.

It costs 1000sgd+ more and is much bigger, but I feel like if I buy this I won't have to get anything else.

With the ADI 2, it is a really good DAC but I'm not too sure about it's headphone AMP capabilities as it lacks a 4pin balance XLR port

 

[xaviescacs]

Wait do you know if I should consider the Questyle CMA15?

It has less jam packed features but looks more future proof and a one time purchase as it has a really powerful amplifier and a ES9038PRO dac.

It costs 1000sgd+ more and is much bigger, but I feel like if I buy this I won't have to get anything else.

With the ADI 2, it is a really good DAC but I'm not too sure about it's headphone AMP capabilities as it lacks a 4pin balance XLR port

The RME is future proof, no problem with that. It's a professional piece of equipment that exudes quality. I was only flagging a warning on the "portable" aspect of it.

As far as HPA power, the ADI 2 DAC is not as powerful as the pro version, which amir uses recently I think. However, it's quite powerful and I believe it has enough for most cases. For instance, I believe amir reported he did the listening test of the Dan Clark Stealth with the ADI 2 DAC version. Of course you can ask in the dedicated thread about particularities of power capabilities if you like, for instance with a very difficult to drive headphone you may have.

 

[Multicore]

I've been told here my DAC is absolutely fine. You are right about the AMP though, will look around for more alternatives. I'm feeling a bit lush with my budget

Then buy some music. Or a musical instrument. Or music lessons. Amps and DACs are boring.

 

[unpluggged]

With the ADI 2, it is a really good DAC but I'm not too sure about it's headphone AMP capabilities as it lacks a 4pin balance XLR port

Which headphone do you use that requires more than 10 V?

As far as HPA power, the ADI 2 DAC is not as powerful as the pro version

ADI-2 DAC's and ADI-2 Pro's headphone amps are the same, save for the IEM-optimized additional output on the ADI-2 DAC.

 

[Trell]

ADI-2 DAC's and ADI-2 Pro's headphone amps are the same, save for the IEM-optimized additional output on the ADI-2

What he probably meant is that the Pro has two headphone outputs that can be used in a balanced mode for more output. In almost all use cases that is overkill, and then some.

 

[unpluggged]

In almost all use cases that is overkill, and then some.

Indeed. With my HD 6XX I rarely even switch to Hi-Power, and having had the RME for two years now, I have finally ordered a balanced adapter cable a couple of days ago, just to play around with it and to get some experience with the unit's operation in balanced phones mode. I would rather appreciate if the ultra-low noise IEM output stage had been included on the Pro as well (they have addressed this request with the ADI-2/4 Pro SE model), though this is too not such a big deal for me, as I can always get an attenuator if I will ever need to use some very sensitive IEMs.