• WANTED: Happy members who like to discuss audio and other topics related to our interest. Desire to learn and share knowledge of science required. There are many reviews of audio hardware and expert members to help answer your questions. Click here to have your audio equipment measured for free!

McIntosh Transformer causing noise in speakers while disconnected.

mhardy6647

Grand Contributor
Joined
Dec 12, 2019
Messages
11,471
Likes
24,920
No, that wasn’t me I believe.
sorry! :( I had way too many windows open, trying to sip from the firehose of this thread. :facepalm:
it was @radix:
I'll fix my prior post, too. I try to clean up the messes I make!

FWIW: Your comment that caught my eye was about moving the amp and speaker. :)
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
@Sokel.

The 360 degrees time period of the 60 Hz distorted and randomly changing waveform is T=1/60 Hz.
That's = ~16.66 mili seconds for 360 degrees of the 60 Hz waveform.
So you need to set the time scale of your software to something that can resolve that 360 degrees of the waveform time interval properly before you can expect to make the software operate effectively and show you the fundamental and harmonics.
 

Golf

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2022
Messages
416
Likes
291
I restricted it to the clean channel so I have enough samples (doesn't work with too few) :



View attachment 357823

Funny ... Analyzing »your« portion of the right channel using Adobe Audition, I get a nice peak at 120 Hz:

1710936318392.png
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
Funny ... Analyzing »your« portion of the right channel using Adobe Audition, I get a nice peak at 120 Hz:

View attachment 357832
It is because the portion of the very distorted irregular repeating waveform that the software triggered on/from has a slope that is of the fundamental frequency of ~120 Hz instead of a slope of a 60 Hz fundamental. There is a error in measurement occurring. It is the only explanation that fits this issue. I have seen this before when metering frequency versus leading or trailing waveform edge slopes.
 

Golf

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2022
Messages
416
Likes
291
There is a error in measurement occurring.

I don’t get it :( Do you mean to say, that Sokel’s Audacity as well as my Audition are detecting a 120 Hz peak although there actually is none?
 

Sokel

Master Contributor
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Messages
6,258
Likes
6,386
@Sokel.

The 360 degrees time period of the 60 Hz distorted and randomly changing waveform is T=1/60 Hz.
That's = ~16.66 mili seconds for 360 degrees of the 60 Hz waveform.
So you need to set the time scale of your software to something that can resolve that 360 degrees of the waveform time interval properly before you can expect to make the software operate effectively and show you the fundamental and harmonics.
I could do that but Audacity will not plot spectrum for such a low sample count,it needs more.
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
I don’t get it :( Do you mean to say, that Sokel’s Audicity as well as my Audition are detecting a 120 Hz peak although there actually is none?
I believe so yes.
There is the slope present somewhere in that hash of a distorted waveform of a 120 Hz fundamental although it is the distortion being detected and not the actual slope of the repeating waveform which @mhardy6647's software triggered on and detected as a 60 Hz fundamental frequency plus the odd and even order harmonics. So... I belive it is a measurement software error.
 

Golf

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2022
Messages
416
Likes
291
the repeating waveform which @mhardy6647's software triggered on

You mean this one?

That would only add to my confusion, as it shows peaks at 40 Hz and 87 Hz, doesn’t it?

1710939692295.png
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
You mean this one?

That would only add to my confusion, as it shows peaks at 40 Hz and 87 Hz, doesn’t it?

View attachment 357845
The 30 Hz indicator @ the horizontal scale is not properly located on the graph. It appears to be a error in the graphics layout. Use the 100 Hz as a point of reference and then count down/backwards and the fundamental will then be 60 Hz.
 

Sokel

Master Contributor
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Messages
6,258
Likes
6,386
I believe so yes.
There is the slope present somewhere in that hash of a distorted waveform of a 120 Hz fundamental although it is the distortion being detected and not the actual slope of the repeating waveform which @mhardy6647's software triggered on and detected as a 60 Hz fundamental frequency plus the odd and even order harmonics. So... I belive it is a measurement software error.
Look at the FFT size of @mhardy6647 and compare it with mine,it's the resolution that makes it seem like this.
If he measure it with higher and expand the window is probably the same for the same spot.
 

Sokel

Master Contributor
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Messages
6,258
Likes
6,386
The 30 Hz indicator @ the horizontal scale is not properly located on the graph. It appears to be a error in the graphics layout. Use the 100 Hz as a point of reference and then count down/backwards and the fundamental will then be 60 Hz.
100Hz is the dark grey line,as is the 1000Hz and 10Khz one.
Counting down there's a null at about 60Hz,just as mine.
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
Look at the FFT size of @mhardy6647 and compare it with mine,it's the resolution that makes it seem like this.
If he measure it with higher and expand the window is probably the same for the same spot.
Which graph of @mhardy6647 do you want to discuss?

 

OldHvyMec

Senior Member
Forum Donor
Joined
Oct 5, 2022
Messages
386
Likes
314
Have you verified your outlet has a proper ground? You can get an inexpensive socket tester.
And make sure it's 120vac on the button. I think it's either broken or if there is a fuse pull it clean the fuse holder and install a new fuse.
No matter what plug it into a maintainer/cleaner. I use 4 Triplites 2400 in my systems with a tube of clear silicone pumped around the
transformer to get rid of 90% of the noise and ALL the AC trash that comes trough from time to time. I did have a router that was
plugged in another room that caused a problem and Laptops are know to add noise. They are put on a dirty plug anyway.

I would turn every breaker off except that room and a known room that runs on the opposite leg. Swap L1 for L2 with an extension cord
if you have to. He doesn't need a 20 amp receptacle to JUST test the the Leg he's using.

LED, the thing you plug in to dispense a room deodorizer can drive you nuts, unplug every thing in the rooms you use for power
and unplug everything in those rooms except, a maintainer, a NEW AC cable and hook up one speaker with a different speaker cable
and a different RCA or XLR. I've had at least 5 XLRs make a LOT of noise, RCAs countless time cheap RCAs made noise.

Plug one speaker in at a time and make sure all the cable are disconnected from the amp not the preamp, then add one speaker cable
then add one input cable. If either cable makes noise, swap with a different brand, zip cable will work fine or it could be the problem
A bad cable is a bad cable. No aluminum/copper clad in the system or cheap RCAs? Right.

I had a Mcintosh SS MC 501 make noise it had to be repaired. I bought it that way and it was 550.00 to repair, at a local dealer/repair
facility in Daily City.

Are you holding your tongue right? :)

Happy hunting.
 

Golf

Senior Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2022
Messages
416
Likes
291
The 30 Hz indicator @ the horizontal scale is not properly located on the graph. It appears to be a error in the graphics layout. Use the 100 Hz as a point of reference and then count down/backwards and the fundamental will then be 60 Hz.

I fear, you are misinterpreting it, sorry...

Its like this:

1710940889985.png
 

Sokel

Master Contributor
Joined
Sep 8, 2021
Messages
6,258
Likes
6,386
Which graph of @mhardy6647 do you want to discuss?

The one just above #209 post.
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
@Golf
Ohh... the 100 Hz GRAY line you see is actually a moveable line.
The actual 100 Hz line is 2 lines to the left.
 

Doodski

Grand Contributor
Forum Donor
Joined
Dec 9, 2019
Messages
21,689
Likes
21,978
Location
Canada
@Golf can you see the error you made when reading the 100 Hz scale now and the error of the software maker of the 30 Hz line too?
 
Top Bottom