Fiio btr15

[unpluggged]

Is the Qudelix-5K based on the ES9219 or the ES9218?

On both. Why does it matter to you?

 

[otseiTiesto]

On both. Why does it matter to you?

Because although they are very similar, they are not the identical.
In my previous post I refer to some of these differences.

 

[unpluggged]

In my previous post I refer to some of these differences.

You refer to differences between different products from different manufacturers, not between ES9218P and ES9219C. This is significant, since we have seen that different products based on the same ES9218P can have significantly different measurements.

These chips by themselves differ only by their power consumption figures, so as long as Qudelix 5K is within its published specs I don't care which specific converter it uses. And we have yet to see comparison of measurements of ES9218P-based and of ES9219C-based Qudelix 5K. Not that such comparison would be of much relevance today, as they switched to the ES9219C two years ago.

 

[otseiTiesto]

You refer to differences between different products from different manufacturers, not between ES9218P and ES9219C. This is significant, since we have seen that different products based on the same ES9218P can have significantly different measurements.

Very true, but there is always some trace of its "character" (DAC), as long as the path to the output is similar. Please take a look at the similarities in the following graph (in spite of Low vs High gain), between the "Shanling M0" and the "Qudelix-5K", both with ES9218, are quite close.

These chips by themselves differ only by their power consumption figures, so as long as Qudelix 5K is within its published specs I don't care which specific converter it uses. And we have yet to see comparison of measurements of ES9218P-based and of ES9219C-based Qudelix 5K. Not that such comparison would be of much relevance today, as they switched to the ES9219C two years ago.

Yes, they are almost identical, at least on paper, but not the same. And indeed, the Qudelix-5K is within its published specs, but what about the unpublished or partially published ones. I do care to know all these details, even if the change was two years ago, especially if I am in the process of comparing to decide which one to buy.

 

[unpluggged]

Very true, but there is always some trace of its "character" (DAC), as long as the path to the output is similar. Please take a look at the similarities in the following graph (in spite of Low vs High gain), between the "Shanling M0" and the "Qudelix-5K", both with ES9218, are quite close.

View attachment 329312



Yes, they are almost identical, at least on paper, but not the same. And indeed, the Qudelix-5K is within its published specs, but what about the unpublished or partially published ones. I do care to know all these details, even if the change was two years ago, especially if I am in the process of comparing to decide which one to buy.

IMO, you are overthinking it The 5K will not disappoint you. The only gripe I have is that I'm unable to find a replacement battery that has started showing its age after three years of constant use (it uses a 3.8V cell that is not that common, as it turns out). In fact, I ordered a second unit the other day. Perhaps I'll try to find some free time to measure them both with the RME ADI-2 Pro.

 

[otseiTiesto]

IMO, you are overthinking it The 5K will not disappoint you.

Maybe, but it's something natural for me.

The only gripe I have is that I'm unable to find a replacement battery that has started showing its age after three years of constant use (it uses a 3.8V cell that is not that common, as it turns out).

3.8V is the nominal voltage (average voltage during a full discharge). A cell of this type (Li-ion) typically has a minimum voltage of about 3.0V (or less), and a maximum voltage of about 4.2V, with a nominal voltage between 3.7V and 3.8V.

4.35V refers to the maximum charging voltage of the cells.

In fact, I ordered a second unit the other day. Perhaps I'll try to find some free time to measure them both with the RME ADI-2 Pro.

Maybe it's not a bad idea, it's not the first time the qudelix-5k has been "redesigned", the following image may be one of the first versions (not 100% sure).

I would also like to see how it performs (THD+N), even with 16 ohm loads.

 

[unpluggged]

3.8V is the nominal voltage

That's right. And if I replace it with a 3.7V battery, it can lead to some unpleasant effects — from wrong battery charge percentage display to overcharging the battery, depending on how the charging circuit is implemented on the 5K.

Maybe it's not a bad idea, it's not the first time the qudelix-5k has been "redesigned", the following image may be one of the first versions (not 100% sure).

This was the initial design (makes sense, since it shows its ES100 roots), they never got past the prototype stage.

 

[otseiTiesto]

That's right. And if I replace it with a 3.7V battery, it can lead to some unpleasant effects — from wrong battery charge percentage display to overcharging the battery, depending on how the charging circuit is implemented on the 5K.

Don't worry about, you don't lose anything by trying it either, btw take a look at the following diagram, it indicates Li-ion (3.7 V).

This was the initial design (makes sense, since it shows its ES100 roots), they never got past the prototype stage.

I didn't know that, funny thing.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------​

Edit: Regarding the maximum charging voltage, choose 4.35V, although the tolerance is usually around 1%, so I don't think you will have problems with 4.4V batteries, but 4.35V better.

 

[Tremolo]

The BTR15 arrived. Nice little thing. I can't comment on sound quality, it seems ok to me. The peq is working even if the settings are a bit confusing. From the android app you have to enter in advanced settings for every single geq slider and you are prompted to set peq parameter (freq, db, and q). 10 bands but just peaks, not shelves, and preamp gain. Storing the curves is even more confusing, I am not sure I understood the process. Once stored you can access the eq preset from the dongle and is working in bluetooth, wired phone and PC mode. You can store just three user preset.

This is the eq for my senn hd580. Not enough power even in high gain for this can and eq if you like listening loud but I guess if you try the bal out you get more juice and headroom for eq (I don't have balanced cables).

 

[Jeromeof]

The BTR15 arrived. Nice little thing. I can't comment on sound quality, it seems ok to me. The peq is working even if the settings are a bit confusing. From the android app you have to enter in advanced settings for every single geq slider and you are prompted to set peq parameter (freq, db, and q). 10 bands but just peaks, not shelves, and preamp gain. Storing the curves is even more confusing, I am not sure I understood the process. Once stored you can access the eq preset from the dongle and is working in bluetooth, wired phone and PC mode. You can store just three user preset.
View attachment 333135

This is the eq for my senn hd580. Not enough power even in high gain for this can and eq if you like listening loud but I guess if you try the bal out you get more juice and headroom for eq (I don't have balanced cables).

I got one of these BTR15 now also - very nice little device - going to test the PEQ capabilities with a few headphones over the next few days but while the FiiO Control App is better than the Moondrop App for the FreeDSP it still have usability issues when saving the PEQ values (at least the IOS version has)

 

[campermate]

Once stored you can access the eq preset from the dongle and is working in bluetooth, wired phone and PC mode.

Hi! This is unfortunately only valid if "U-Audio" is set to 1.0 (UAC1.0), at least for my unit. Had to learn in the hard way with no music playing, some very weird distortion sounds. Factory reset after V2.2 Update also did not help. Overall, the firmware of the BTR15 is still rather immature, alpha state at best.

 

[Jeromeof]

Hi! This is unfortunately only valid if "U-Audio" is set to 1.0 (UAC1.0), at least for my unit. Had to learn in the hard way with no music playing, some very weird distortion sounds. Factory reset after V2.2 Update also did not help. Overall, the firmware of the BTR15 is still rather immature, alpha state at best.

Yes definitely some bugs - I am currently looking at documenting some of the issues - it has lots of potential with the screen and the PEQ and I even like the size / shapre of it compared to even the Qudelix 5K but switching between 'modes' and even switching between EQ settings sometimes doesn't work unless its disconnected and reconnected.

 

[campermate]

Yes definitely some bugs - I am currently looking at documenting some of the issues - it has lots of potential with the screen and the PEQ and I even like the size / shapre of it compared to even the Qudelix 5K but switching between 'modes' and even switching between EQ settings sometimes doesn't work unless its disconnected and reconnected.

True that! Also PEQ for the time being only supports Peak filter types. Shelves would be very handy, that way same presets (Oratory for HD650 here..) could be used.

 

[campermate]

I can hardly put into words how awful the firmware of the BTR15 and the Android app is. Manufacturers should be punished for putting such immature products on the market. Qudelix is light years ahead of them. Latest discovery: Personalized EQ set on USER1 is created -> now every other custom preset is no longer saved permanently. As soon as I create another preset and then switch back to the first one, the newly created one is gone except for the pre-gain.

 

[NielsMayer]

FYI there is a new update to the firmware and additionally XMOS USB update:

https://forum.fiio.com/note/showNoteContent.do?id=202312201447233677679&tid=77

"BTR15 Bluetooth V3.5 firmware and XMOS V125 download link and update instruction"

Note that the XMOS V125 update requires connection to a windows PC and has prerequisite of installing the Fiio windows USB driver ( https://forum.fiio.com/note/showNoteContent.do?id=202105191527366657910&tid=17 ). The XMOS update cannot be done from the Fiio app.

Update to the V3.5 firmware alone can be done via Fiio app.

 

[audioenthousiast1988]

can anyone tell me if the bugs are gone, i wanna buy this product but i see a lot of issues.

 

[sofastreamer]

mine is rebooting at least once every 20 minutes with a loud buzzing sound thru the headphones. the app does loose settings randomly. similar or same problems can be found on many different forums. this thing is in alpha state at best. cannot recommend atm. doesnt sound better than my qudelix, which is the far better and more mature product at this point. if i were to buy another one i would go with the shanling m0 pro which has many advanteges as for example it can be used as an ldac transmitter, which would kick my bta30pro out of the window, as this is another not finalized product from fiio. plus you get a full blown dap with the shanling for the same price and with the same technologies as the ****** btr15.

 

[audioenthousiast1988]

ive heard from many people that most of the issues were resolved after the firmware updates. i also asked a few sellers on ali and they confirmed this.

 

[Tremolo]

I don't use it so often but mine is working fine. Even the problems in storing personal eq are solved, I guess. I use it with Aria and Senn hd580. I managed to load the last update to the firmware and even to the usb drivers without issues (after realizing that I was using the wrong usb c cable )

 

[audioenthousiast1988]

i just ordered one, lets see. for 115 euro including leather pouch its a decent price for what you get.