D&D8C versus KEF LS60 shootout!

[Absolute]

I’d rather see some REW measurements.

I want subjective impressions of the speakers placed optimally, a REW mdat file for download and pictures to document the placement of both speakers. Then I can look at measurements to see if there's clear explanations to the subjective impressions given.

In Keith-style the impressions will likely say something like "they're both good, better than any passive dinosaur, but your taste might prefer one over the other. The cardioide positively impacts clarity in the bass while the coaxial has a small advantage in soundstage."

 

[Purité Audio]

Comparing loudspeakers just encapsulates how difficult it is, ’placed optimally’ that in itself is difficult, in my domestic room there are only so many locations where I can position two pairs of loudspeakers, 8Cs and LS60s both offer adjustment for position, usually I place 8cs really close to the front wall as that offers headroom and cancellation advantages.
Matching level, tonally and in terms of timbre they are virtually identical, much less difference than between kiis and 8Cs but then you can adjust both kii and 8C to taste, in terms of pure sound quality.
I don’t have any ‘dinosaur’ passives to compare with but I have in the past and led me to the conclusion that they are just not bothering with compared to contemporary designs.
Imaging on the Kefs is pinpoint as was the 8351Bs but the 8Cs again almost indistinguishable and they are placed further apart, it really does come down to personal taste and how ou intend to use the speakers and with what.
Really exactly as @Absolute states, I do think cardioid adds clarity in the (midrange) and perhaps coax for image.
For a larger room, greater listening distance and bass extension/weight I would recommend the 8Cs but if you want to connect your Tv or your kids want to bluetooth/airplay then the KEFs are so easy to use.
Harman shuffler and unsighted level matched …
Keith

 

[Purité Audio]

The one conclusion I can draw is that one would never have to apologise for the LS60 as some kind of ‘lifestyle’ speaker they are not, they are super speakers, I would like to see KEF make an active version of the Blade with cardioid too that would be interesting or have Sigberg already made that wit their ‘Manta’?
Keith

 

[Purité Audio]

Purité Audio London, have all the finest measuring and thus most transparent loudspeakers available for evaluation.
Dutch&Dutch 8V
Kii Three
Mesanovic RTM10 and soon their new CM65
GGNTKT M1 and soon their M3
Sigberg Audio’s dual cardioid Manta
The entire KEF wireless range including the superb LS60 with dual KC62 subs.


Keith

 

[thewas]

Purité Audio London, have all the finest measuring and thus most transparent loudspeakers available for evaluation.
Dutch&Dutch 8V
Kii Three
Mesanovic RTM10 and soon their new CM65
GGNTKT M1 and soon their M3
Sigberg Audio’s dual cardioid Manta
The entire KEF wireless range including the superb LS60 with dual KC62 subs.


Keith

That is loudspeaker heaven for me, next time I will visit UK I would love to include a visit if possible.

 

[Purité Audio]

You would be most welcome, but I fear you would be disappointed, pre-covid we really had a lot of stock, two dedicated rooms speakers everywhere, but after nearly twenty years my wife wanted the house ‘back’.
The best place to audition speakers is of course in your own room.
Best,
Keith

 

[tifune]

Purité Audio London, have all the finest measuring and thus most transparent loudspeakers available for evaluation.
Dutch&Dutch 8V
Kii Three
Mesanovic RTM10 and soon their new CM65
GGNTKT M1 and soon their M3
Sigberg Audio’s dual cardioid Manta
The entire KEF wireless range including the superb LS60 with dual KC62 subs.


Keith

You have the Sigberg Manta setup for audition?

 

[sigbergaudio]

You have the Sigberg Manta setup for audition?

No he doesn't, but he will be among the first to do - in June if all goes as planned.

 

[al2002]

Purité Audio London, have all the finest measuring and thus most transparent loudspeakers available for evaluation.
Dutch&Dutch 8V
Kii Three
Mesanovic RTM10 and soon their new CM65
GGNTKT M1 and soon their M3
Sigberg Audio’s dual cardioid Manta
The entire KEF wireless range including the superb LS60 with dual KC62 subs.


Keith

Wot?!!
No Genelec or Neumann?

 

[Jasperous]

Purité Audio London, have all the finest measuring and thus most transparent loudspeakers available for evaluation.
Dutch&Dutch 8V
Kii Three
Mesanovic RTM10 and soon their new CM65
GGNTKT M1 and soon their M3
Sigberg Audio’s dual cardioid Manta
The entire KEF wireless range including the superb LS60 with dual KC62 subs.


Keith

Where in London is this? I went to Richer Sounds to listen to the LS60 and it was a 2x3 m concrete walled room! It was terrible!

 

[Zensō]

…bizarre the focus appears to be very much based on selling product whether it is needed or not.

That sounds perfectly congruous with this “hobby”, which in the majority seems to be about buying stuff.

 

[Purité Audio]

Where in London is this? I went to Richer Sounds to listen to the LS60 and it was a 2x3 m concrete walled room! It was terrible!

Norf London, Muswell Hill to be precise.
Keith

 

[DSJR]

Wot?!!
No Genelec or Neumann?

Sad to say I don't think any domestic dealer has any as it's not of specific interest I suspect.

I do wonder if Genelec have any UK demming agents for the fancy ones with stands moulded in?

Honestly, I suspect that outside of these portals, Neumann, Genelec and most of what Keith describes and sells, is pretty much unknown in UK audiophile salons and their clients, where ever more expensive Linn and Naim/Kudos based active systems still rule, making even ATC's three way actives look cheap in comparison

 

[Purité Audio]

We used to represent Genelec we had the then top of the line 8360’s?
Couple of washing machine subs, they were just a bit too industrial, I enquired about the 8361s and W371s but in the U.K. Genelecs importer is also their retailer which makes things a little difficult as you can imagine.
Keith

 

[Ra1zel]

I would like to see KEF make an active version of the Blade

That could be really something its already superb speaker

Also if I remember the LS60 has options for linear phase on and off, could you please share if you find any difference between the two modes?

 

[al2002]

We used to represent Genelec we had the then top of the line 8360’s?
Couple of washing machine subs, they were just a bit too industrial, I enquired about the 8361s and W371s but in the U.K. Genelecs importer is also their retailer which makes things a little difficult as you can imagine.
Keith

Just kidding Keith.

Yes, I know you used to stock Genelec. I recall exchanging emails when you were selling your ex-dem 8260s.

 

[Purité Audio]

Those Genelecs and the matching 7360s and GLM really opened my eyes ( and ears) to what was really possible.
Keith

 

[chelgrian]

There's an element of the other way round to this as well, their reviews often reflect the prejudices of their readers (stuff they think won't be liked gets four stars, the worst insult they can give after agreeing to review). That may be the case with the DCS streaming component: DCS were and I presume are using DTS Play-Fi which is generally disliked in the UK for some reason.

I've never seen the point in Play-Fi the fact all the audio is streamed from the mobile device is just a deal breaker.

Spotify connect is the basic reason why Spotify is still the market leader, while Tidal connect and Chromecast built in can do similar things neither of them are as polished as spotify.