When did you decide to study STEM major in university? Tips for my daughter?

[Pdxwayne]

My experience may be worth sharing with your daughter.
In high school I knew I was good at math and physics - I found the latter to be intuitive but I had no idea what I wanted for a career. I also knew I wanted to be well rounded education wise. I also figured that there was a good chance that I would need to go to graduate school for whatever career I eventually chose.
So I chose a liberal arts college that had a well regarded physics department so I’d be able to get into an engineering graduate school if and when I got to that point. I went to William and Mary (an out of state, state school for me)
I studied a little psychology, music history and majored in philosophy and physics (and math).
I discovered I really loved building computational models and real experiments in the lab. Philosophy was fun, but not a career. Math was a useful tool, but not something tangible enough for me to pursue.
I went to grad school, got a job I love.
Second thoughts? My college freshman roommate’s goal were to become an operative for the CIA, an ambassador to a small island nation, or a water sports instructor at club med. Why weren’t any of those on my list in high school?

Thanks for sharing! I see that it took a bit of time for you to figure out your passion, but still turned out great at the end!

 

[Pdxwayne]

The few engineering oriented companies I have first or second hand experience with... if you work your way up through the technical ranks and want to go to management or the business side of things, and it is determined you need an MBA, will pay for you to get your MBA. Something to think about.

Yes. I will tell my daughter of such possibly. Thanks!

 

[Cahudson42]

There is nothing like 'hands on'..Is there any kind of summer internship she might do - related to STEM possibilities?

 

[Pdxwayne]

There is nothing like 'hands on'..Is there any kind of summer internship she might do - related to STEM possibilities?

Hmm, maybe a bit late now to apply if there is any..... I will check with her. Thanks!

 

[Wes]

Yes, we are going to continue to work on the list of schools to apply over the summer. Thanks!

apply to lots of schools

I'd tell you to visit but invariable people select based on bricks and mortar (nice campus) not the things that count

Best wishes!

 

[Cahudson42]

Hmm, maybe a bit late now to apply if there is any..... I will check with her. Thanks!

If late, maybe not a formal internship. Depending where you live, there may be local organizations that would welcome volunteer assistance. For example, here in the Adirondacks there are organizations measuring environmental impacts of climate change and human activity, PFA pollution, etc. - Lake George Water Keeper. Lake George Association. RPI. Samples are taken and analyzed, trends are developed, plans are formulated, etc. 'Science put to work' improving the environment we live in. Would something like that appeal?

 

[MZKM]

Ahhh…

In the words of Dr. Ian Malcolm "well, there it is". I was thinking she was in 8th or 9th grade and was confounded by her needing to choose her college path. 11th grade makes more sense.

Yeah, I think you misread, he said “junior in high school” and you said “junior high”.

_______
I had friends who were undeclared for a while and a distant family member who switched her major like 4 times.

College is a good place to actually find out what career paths you want to pursue. I’d suggest just picking the current standout as her initial major.

 

[hardisj]

Yeah, I think you misread, he said “junior in high school” and you said “junior high”.

Nice of you to chime in with that information that wasn't already resolved.

 

[MZKM]

In general, she should attend the very best, most difficult university she can get into.

I don't think I fully back that suggestion.

I’ve read a decent bit about how many students who go to renowned schools have poor mental health as they were #1 at their small high school and it’s unlikely they will continue to be excellent at a renowned school.

 

[Pdxwayne]

If late, maybe not a formal internship. Depending where you live, there may be local organizations that would welcome volunteer assistance. For example, here in the Adirondacks there are organizations measuring environmental impacts of climate change and human activity, PFA pollution, etc. - Lake George Water Keeper. Lake George Association. RPI. Samples are taken and analyzed, trends are developed, plans are formulated, etc. 'Science put to work' improving the environment we live in. Would something like that appeal?

Thanks! Will look for such opportunities locally.

 

[Pdxwayne]

Yeah, I think you misread, he said “junior in high school” and you said “junior high”.

_______
I had friends who were undeclared for a while and a distant family member who switched her major like 4 times.

College is a good place to actually find out what career paths you want to pursue. I’d suggest just picking the current standout as her initial major.

Thanks! In a way it is great that there are so many choices available now. : )

 

[Pdxwayne]

I don't think I fully back that suggestion.

I’ve read a decent bit about how many students who go to renowned schools have poor mental health as they were #1 at their small high school and it’s unlikely they will continue to be excellent at a renowned school.

Yeah, this is one of her main concerns....Becoming an average student in a top school can be pretty discouraging....

 

[tgray]

Ehh... I knew some students who struggled, but most did not. I can't speak specifically about Harvard, but can to the general level of school. You can still be pretty dang excellent at a school like that, just maybe not at the top of your class. The level of your classmates really pushes you too and opens up new opportunities.

Going to the college I went to led DIRECTLY to grad school for me (field of study and specific university) and I know my grad school experience has helped me professionally immensely - from name recognition, to subject studied, to general rigor and personal growth. I have no doubt I would be doing something completely different had I gone to a different college.

 

[SKBubba]

There are so many great experiences and observations that I'm hesitant to reply. But I will anyway.

In my case, I got a music scholarship, but eventually dropped out. I accidentally fell into computer stuff, and with a lot of self study, mentorship, and on the job training, eventually became moderately successful. This was in the late 70s early 80s before there was STEM.

On the other hand, I have in-laws who studied history. They went on to become successful lawyers and also made a lot of money. Another in-law studied social work, and is now dean of the social work college at her university.

So, you just never know.

My sense, though, is that IT work is is really competitive these days. The likelihood of landing a job in silicon valley is like getting an NBA or NFL contract. Except working for FANG is even more like slavery.

Don't know about engineering jobs. Civil engineering jobs at state departments of transportation appear to be lucrative, if you can tap in to the massive corruption and kickbacks. (Sorry, pet peeve.)

 

[Pdxwayne]

Ehh... I knew some students who struggled, but most did not. I can't speak specifically about Harvard, but can to the general level of school. You can still be pretty dang excellent at a school like that, just maybe not at the top of your class. The level of your classmates really pushes you too and opens up new opportunities.

Going to the college I went to led DIRECTLY to grad school for me (field of study and specific university) and I know my grad school experience has helped me professionally immensely - from name recognition, to subject studied, to general rigor and personal growth. I have no doubt I would be doing something completely different had I gone to a different college.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Pdxwayne]

There are so many great experiences and observations that I'm hesitant to reply. But I will anyway.

In my case, I got a music scholarship, but eventually dropped out. I accidentally fell into computer stuff, and with a lot of self study, mentorship, and on the job training, eventually became moderately successful. This was in the late 70s early 80s before there was STEM.

On the other hand, I have in-laws who studied history. They went on to become successful lawyers and also made a lot of money. Another in-law studied social work, and is now dean of the social work college at her university.

So, you just never know.

My sense, though, is that IT work is is really competitive these days. The likelihood of landing a job in silicon valley is like getting an NBA or NFL contract. Except working for FANG is even more like slavery.

Don't know about engineering jobs. Civil engineering jobs at state departments of transportation appear to be lucrative, if you can tap in to the massive corruption and kickbacks. (Sorry, pet peeve.)

Thanks for sharing!

 

[SIY]

A good state university will provide the same education as the high priced spread.* She can be almost random in her major choices- it's a near guarantee that whatever she ends up doing will be only loosely related to what she started out doing.** However... whichever she chooses, go heavy on physics courses. No matter what one's scientific discipline, physics undergirds it, and understanding physics (and the consequent math) will give her a BIG advantage.

*I went to a tiny but good state school for undergrad, then a top 10 department for grad school followed by an Ivy League postdoc research and teaching position, so I saw both side of this.
**I went from a career goal of theoretical quantum chemistry (heavy physics) to an actual career in industrial chemistry, biology, electronics, wine, business operations... and about to make yet another career change.

 

[Wes]

Yeah, this is one of her main concerns....Becoming an average student in a top school can be pretty discouraging....

but when she gets out she will be at the top of her field

some comments above remind me to tell you to tell her to find a faculty who is a woman for at least some informal advising

and BTW, you can add to or change advisors - she should spend time with multiple faculty; post-docs and grad. students can be helpful as well

all will be glued to their research, but a tenured faculty member will have more time (Associate or full Professor, not Assistant Professor)

 

[Helicopter]

Defining the 'all' in 'all variables' gets subjective.



The few engineering oriented companies I have first or second hand experience with... if you work your way up through the technical ranks and want to go to management or the business side of things, and it is determined you need an MBA, will pay for you to get your MBA. Something to think about.

This is what I did. I never had much loan debt, paid it all off while I was still working my way through school.

My recommendation is to look at bls.gov to see what people earn, and consider that as you go. You want to have good jobs waiting for you and you can figure out many paths to good jobs if you research labor markets a bit.

I knew I wanted to be a state wildlife biologist at age 14, got into a good program, and 3 years later I was earning more running a renovation crew in the summer than a person with a master degree earns as a state biologist.

I dropped out, got a full time job, and went back to study business a year after dropping out with my employer paying 100% to finish my BS and MBA.

 

[BlackTalon]

I encourage her to consider civil engineering with environment focus, but one post indicates that there might be saturation in this area.

A lot of places have spun off Environmental Engineering so it is now it's own discipline, and no longer under Civil. it has it's place, but what I see in everyday practice now is that many subdisciplines of Civil incorporate environmental into their work. You have to here in the US, as the building codes have a lot of requirements.

If you get into site development, a typical building site plan for DC now has many drawing sheets related to runoff, retention, etc. Pages and pages of calcs that used to be covered with a single sheet a few decades ago. It is much more technical than it used to be.

Just about anything you design has to earn LEED points, comply with energy and environmental codes, Energy-star, etc. In fact if you want to be a Civil and not need any environmental you are probably SOL. I think the 'real' Environmental Engineers are doing the big impact statements for heavy construction, new roads/ bridges, etc.

Construction is booming in the mid-Atlantic area. Hard to say when it will eventually correct. But when I go into construction trailer complexes on large jobs half of the construction engineers are women. It is no longer the realm of 6'-3" 285 lb men who direct the subcontractors mainly by physical intimidation. No more fist fights, throwing subs out the door, shouting matches, etc. And the construction engineering jobs are great for people who want office + outside time, and they pay very, very well in times when construction is really rolling. Construction Engineering, like Environmental, used to be a sub-discipline of Civil at many universities but has largely moved under the umbrella of the construction major. I have seen some places that provide dual majors so you get Civil - Construction Engineering degrees.