30.7 for Condos tour

[josh358]

Um, as I've said, I own 1.7is and have listened to them for many years. They are less accurate than $350 studio monitors. I don't know what to tell you. That's the reality of the matter.

I think I'm going to bow out of this thread though -- I'm not really interested in having this argument with multiple people who are convinced of the superiority of Magnepans. It's not productive.

Again, I have no idea why you claim that they're "more accurate" than Magnepans. As an audio engineer, I can tell you that they aren't: partial and in some cases grotesquely inaccurate measurements, improperly interpreted, tell you nothing. They're like assessing the taste of a food on the basis of an ingredients label -- one that is riddled with mistakes and omits half the ingredients. And I've tried to give you some reasons why, but it seems I haven't succeeded.

But to each his own. If you're familiar with the sound of live acoustical music, those $350 "studio monitors" (wonder whose basement that "studio" is in) aren't going to sound as realistic as your 1.7i's. If you aren't familiar with the sound of live acoustical music, or if you just listen primarily to studio pop, the $350 speakers may be the best choice -- but not because they're more "accurate." Though I'm skeptical that $350 speakers are good for anything -- at least, I've never heard speakers that price that don't sound like crap -- cheap speakers like the Elacs have gotten surprisingly good, but nothing anyone would term "high fidelity" as opposed to "good for a dorm room and a step up from Bose."

 

[Deleted member 2944]

"Accuracy" is in the eye of the beholder.......especially when it comes to speakers. I think it's more of a subjective term now.

Anyways, I have 1.7's as well, and can understand some folks objections to them. It depends upon the speaker reference(s, preferred program material, etc, etc.

Dave.

 

[josh358]

"Accuracy" is in the eye of the beholder.......especially when it comes to speakers. I think it's more of a subjective term now.

Anyways, I have 1.7's as well, and can understand some folks objections to them. It depends upon the speaker reference(s, preferred program material, etc, etc.

Dave.

I didn't know that, I thought you still had your MMG's with the built-in subs.

I think you're right that speakers are often chosen on the basis of their engineering trades, e.g., someone who listens to rock is going to prefer a speaker with a lot of midbass slam while someone who listens to jazz is going to prefer a speaker that sacrifices some midbass output but has more accurate bass in a modal listening room. (A speaker designer I know found that multiple subwoofers sounded as good as dipole bass because both did the same thing-- minimized the audibility of room modes.) So in a sense, you can't say that one of these speakers is more accurate than the other, since both sacrifice one kind of accuracy but improve another.

Which isn't to say that a $350 prosumer "monitor" is going to be more accurate than a 1.7i, that's risible! I sometimes wish that John Atkinson didn't publish those measurements, because while I find them interesting as an engineer, they're too easily misinterpreted by audiophiles. I mean, I wouldn't buy a speaker if I saw graphs like that without understanding their limitations.

 

[Deleted member 2944]

In my opinion, John Atkinson well outlines the caveats to his measurements of large speakers. That they can be misinterpreted by audiophiles is not surprising because audiophiles can misinterpret anything.

I've listened to many different Magnepan speakers, and have owned multiple pairs. All have a characteristic sound that is unlike what you'd experience with smallish reference monitors (or similar.) It's an apples/oranges comparison.
But proclaiming one more "accurate" than the other is a rather meaningless conclusion, in my opinion.

Regardless, this thread is about the Condo tour, and we should stay on that topic. What Wendell can glean from this effort is questionable, in my opinion.

Dave.

 

[josh358]

I've long suspected that readers ignore JA's comments and just look at the pretty pictures.

Wendell just copied me on an email about last night's Pittsburgh event and apparently it was the most successful so far. I think they're learning as they go along.

 

[Deleted member 2944]

If you have to focus group something like this, it's already a muddled process.

Personally, I think Magnepan should focus on value-based products and eschew the low value high-buck efforts like this. If that means the company can't survive ultimately in this changing market, then so be it. At least they kept their integrity and didn't succumb to the foolishness of what the "audiophile" market has become.
If they decide their target demographic is people who drive Ferrari's and live in $2M high-rise condominiums, then I'm not sure what to say. There are already numerous speaker systems for those folks in the "high-end" audio business. Why would Magnepan want to join that cadre?

Anyways, when Wendell makes available some "audio science" to review regarding this "Condo" effort I might take it more seriously....and it might become on-topic for this forum.

Dave.

 

[josh358]

If you have to focus group something like this, it's already a muddled process.

Personally, I think Magnepan should focus on value-based products and eschew the low value high-buck efforts like this. If that means the company can't survive ultimately in this changing market, then so be it. At least they kept their integrity and didn't succumb to the foolishness of what the "audiophile" market has become.
If they decide their target demographic is people who drive Ferrari's and live in $2M high-rise condominiums, then I'm not sure what to say. There are already numerous speaker systems for those folks in the "high-end" audio business. Why would Magnepan want to join that cadre?

Anyways, when Wendell makes available some "audio science" to review regarding this "Condo" effort I might take it more seriously....and it might become on-topic for this forum.

Dave.

I don't think they're after the high bucks market -- they're a value speaker company and always have been. But a flagship has publicity value and in this case, they decided to start with a flagship model (if they make it) and then move down the line. This is the "wife-friendly Maggie" that will let people get the sound they want without turning the living room into a set for "2001."

As to the science, well, Wendell doesn't even disclose crossover frequencies.