How would better sound quality manifest?
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Which upgrade path to take?
- Thread starter kolestonin
- Start date
Not having to fight with whichever OS the PC is running.
Not had that problem but generally don't run audio particularly thru the OS built in audio features.....can you be more specific?
Pareto Pragmatic
Active Member
I do think a measurement mic and REW is the best way to go to get improved sound. Actually, consider that if you post an REW measurement file here, people will do the work for you. And likely better than many pros out there (due to instant peer review of suggestions).
That said, I will give you my take on gear, since that's what you asked for. Not that I am an expert on all things gear.
Short version: you have very good gear, and any new product given your budget will give you improvements you might hear, or might not. Even with FAR more money improvements are going to be VERY slight from this point on.
Having used an E30 ii for a while, I recently got an SMSL do100, since I wanted balanced connections for the amp I just ordered. Comparing the Topping and the SMSL using single ended connections, the difference is pretty small. As in, I need to A/B to really hear that slight difference for sure, but just listening on first install.... maybe better, i think better, yup better a tiny bit, maybe?
I do think a streamer is a good upgrade. Wiim is good enough. Depending on your PC, since those can introduce noise, it might clean up the sound. But mostly it is a convenience thing for me to be able to switch things from my seat. Though the Wiim eq/peq options are nice to have, and fun to play with, even without measurements.
Speakers? I am sure if you spent a LOT more money you could get small improvements in measured performance (hearing that is another matter). But for me, I like a bit of variety. So maybe another pair of speakers to swap out to change things up? Something with horns, or an AMT or ribbon tweeter? I did recently look for sub $2000 USD speakers, and there are a lot of them that are very, very good. But different.
I don't think any change to the amp or preamp will give you any difference you can hear, unless it is negative. But, maybe a second amp, something with tubes (if you like that) or something with a "warmer" but no tubes like a Cambridge or something along those lines. Measurement downgrade, but maybe a good change of pace once in a while. There are a lot of used amps out there as well. .
If you stop thinking "better" and start thinking "different" then you will have a lot of options to change things. That might give you more enjoyment. Though I say that as someone who has 2 amps and 2 pairs of speakers on switches, so of course I think this way. Mostly I play one system, but at least once a week I switch things up. That helps me to enjoy my accurate system more, really. My other system is not accurate at all, but it is fun.
Enjoy!
That said, I will give you my take on gear, since that's what you asked for. Not that I am an expert on all things gear.
Short version: you have very good gear, and any new product given your budget will give you improvements you might hear, or might not. Even with FAR more money improvements are going to be VERY slight from this point on.
Having used an E30 ii for a while, I recently got an SMSL do100, since I wanted balanced connections for the amp I just ordered. Comparing the Topping and the SMSL using single ended connections, the difference is pretty small. As in, I need to A/B to really hear that slight difference for sure, but just listening on first install.... maybe better, i think better, yup better a tiny bit, maybe?
I do think a streamer is a good upgrade. Wiim is good enough. Depending on your PC, since those can introduce noise, it might clean up the sound. But mostly it is a convenience thing for me to be able to switch things from my seat. Though the Wiim eq/peq options are nice to have, and fun to play with, even without measurements.
Speakers? I am sure if you spent a LOT more money you could get small improvements in measured performance (hearing that is another matter). But for me, I like a bit of variety. So maybe another pair of speakers to swap out to change things up? Something with horns, or an AMT or ribbon tweeter? I did recently look for sub $2000 USD speakers, and there are a lot of them that are very, very good. But different.
I don't think any change to the amp or preamp will give you any difference you can hear, unless it is negative. But, maybe a second amp, something with tubes (if you like that) or something with a "warmer" but no tubes like a Cambridge or something along those lines. Measurement downgrade, but maybe a good change of pace once in a while. There are a lot of used amps out there as well. .
If you stop thinking "better" and start thinking "different" then you will have a lot of options to change things. That might give you more enjoyment. Though I say that as someone who has 2 amps and 2 pairs of speakers on switches, so of course I think this way. Mostly I play one system, but at least once a week I switch things up. That helps me to enjoy my accurate system more, really. My other system is not accurate at all, but it is fun.
Enjoy!
Basic Channel
Active Member
REW and a cheap measurement microphone would be easy and cheap and probably help curb your enthusiasm to upgrade. You could see what speaker placement changes, or if not an option you could see all the issues that you are not going to fix with any equipment upgrade.
You maybe will leave the apartment in 2 years, but you could probably build too many DIY panels for about 100 EUR or thereabouts. They don't need to be installed really, they could be made to stand on their own up against a wall. And if you got rid of them in 2 years you'd be 1800 EUR up and have a measurement microphone for the new place.
You maybe will leave the apartment in 2 years, but you could probably build too many DIY panels for about 100 EUR or thereabouts. They don't need to be installed really, they could be made to stand on their own up against a wall. And if you got rid of them in 2 years you'd be 1800 EUR up and have a measurement microphone for the new place.
I don't remember the exact issue. I was trying to get the Amazon Music app to play in Windows 10 and kept having various issues. It may have been the Amazon app.
Solved the problem by switching to using streamers. (Wiim Pro Plus and Eversolo DMP-A6). They just work with no fuss.
er|κzvio1in
Member
As I already said in your other topic: there's a very substantial benefit by doing one simple thing: in your SVS subwoofers, use the parametric EQ function to bring down the enourmous 50 hz resonance of your room. This will give more sonic benefit than any investment in upgraded components ever will.
OP
kolestonin
Active Member
- Thread Starter
- #49
It was one of the first things I tried and if I can recall correctly it made 0 difference.
I also tried to tame that peak via EQ Apo, but again I remember I couldn't hear any difference with only that filter applied. There was some difference when combined with other filters in the low frequencies.
I am also pretty sure I experimented with different q factors, no matter it seems quite straightforward what to use in this case.
And keep in mind I consider my ears as very sensitive.
I will re-give it a try. As you say it's free, quick and easy.
Unfortunately, It seems I deleted them. I will eventually try to repeat the procedure.
OP
kolestonin
Active Member
- Thread Starter
- #50
@DWPress (or who wants to give a look)
I finally found the measurements I was sharing on the other post.
The mdat file is here
At least my first impression is that.
Bass is more defined and I would say pair(no matter it is giving me a false feeling it is less strong most probably cause it is somehow more spread/blury) in power.
It seems it also has an effect on medium frequencies but I need to listen more so to say what and how. For the moment my ears are focused on low.
And all that with just 1 sub connected, as a direct A/B comparison is not possible with two of them due to the loading time on the app.
I will go through my test tracks and then turn on the 2nd sub for more testing.
Measuring would also be very interesting. As I did not remember having tested before and after during my old tries.
Can't thank you enough for highlighting/insisting on that with your double posting.
It seems like a first win by just moving my fingers
ps: the filter I used was saved on my app from my previous tries and as you can see in the background the other two slots also have saved filters. Meaning more testing to do. Which frequencies would you tame if you had just two choices?
I finally found the measurements I was sharing on the other post.
The mdat file is here
I tried the attached filter and I need to say it does a distinguishably positive difference.
At least my first impression is that.
Bass is more defined and I would say pair(no matter it is giving me a false feeling it is less strong most probably cause it is somehow more spread/blury) in power.
It seems it also has an effect on medium frequencies but I need to listen more so to say what and how. For the moment my ears are focused on low.
And all that with just 1 sub connected, as a direct A/B comparison is not possible with two of them due to the loading time on the app.
I will go through my test tracks and then turn on the 2nd sub for more testing.
Measuring would also be very interesting. As I did not remember having tested before and after during my old tries.
Can't thank you enough for highlighting/insisting on that with your double posting.
It seems like a first win by just moving my fingers
ps: the filter I used was saved on my app from my previous tries and as you can see in the background the other two slots also have saved filters. Meaning more testing to do. Which frequencies would you tame if you had just two choices?
Attachments
Unfortunately, there is only one sweep in the file and it lacks all timing references and phase information. Also it looks like you didn't use a mic correction file so some of what you see in the sweep can't be trusted either.
OP
kolestonin
Active Member
I bought a miniDSP FlexHtx and use it for the DSP (you could probably get by with one of the smaller/cheaper units, I just wanted it to do anything and everything I would ever ask of it). It honestly has done more for the sound quality and my enjoyment of the system than anything else that I have purchased. It makes me not want to upgrade anything else.
OP
kolestonin
Active Member
- Thread Starter
- #54
Most probably I will have to think of giving Flex a second try when I have some time.
In the meantime I can make mind on how to insert it in the chain.
The plan could be as I was advised on the other thread:
PC->Flex Digital->DAC->Preamp->Power Amp
or
PC->Flex Digital->Power Amp
The second one seems the way to go. It will cost less money, and also give me simplicity, less devices, less cables, less heat, even power consumption.
It's just that I love my DAC and Preamp and I would like to keep them, but in all cases I can compare and see if I miss something by taking them out of the chain.
In the meantime I can make mind on how to insert it in the chain.
The plan could be as I was advised on the other thread:
PC->Flex Digital->DAC->Preamp->Power Amp
or
PC->Flex Digital->Power Amp
The second one seems the way to go. It will cost less money, and also give me simplicity, less devices, less cables, less heat, even power consumption.
It's just that I love my DAC and Preamp and I would like to keep them, but in all cases I can compare and see if I miss something by taking them out of the chain.
The Flex HTx made my preamp completely obsolete. You don't even really need a DAC, but I have an RME ADI-2 which I like quite a bit.
er|κzvio1in
Member
@DWPress (or who wants to give a look)
I tried the attached filter and I need to say it does a distinguishably positive difference.
At least my first impression is that.
Bass is more defined and I would say pair(no matter it is giving me a false feeling it is less strong most probably cause it is somehow more spread/blury) in power.
It seems it also has an effect on medium frequencies but I need to listen more so to say what and how. For the moment my ears are focused on low.
And all that with just 1 sub connected, as a direct A/B comparison is not possible with two of them due to the loading time on the app.
I will go through my test tracks and then turn on the 2nd sub for more testing.
Measuring would also be very interesting. As I did not remember having tested before and after during my old tries.
Can't thank you enough for highlighting/insisting on that with your double posting.
It seems like a first win by just moving my fingers
ps: the filter I used was saved on my app from my previous tries and as you can see in the background the other two slots also have saved filters. Meaning more testing to do. Which frequencies would you tame if you had just two choices?
The effect on the other frequencies is logical: because the 50 hz is no longer dominating it "frees up" the other frequencies to shine through. That's the power of room correction.
I don't know the details of the capabilities of the SVS app, but a next step would be time alignment of the sub with the 2 front speakers and then time aligning the sub+speakers with the second sub. Am I correct to assume you currently don't have a cross over with a high pass filter on your main speakers? You want to take away some low frequencies from the main speakers and let the sub take care of that, you can do that with DSP but also simply by turning down the bass control on the amp of your speakers. I found Obsessive Compulse Audio's video on youtube very helpful in getting subs time aligned.
OP
kolestonin
Active Member
- Thread Starter
- #57
I had some ground loops issues with the current placement but completely sorted it out by splitting the gear in two different wall plugs. The issue is completely eliminated.
Is it risky to go with the unbalanced Flex? Or I am safe to go as long as I will use the same plugs?
Asking cause I already have all the cables.
Also:
How the below scenario can be viable at the level of windows?
PC->Flex Digital->DAC->Preamp->Power Amp
Windows will have both(flex+topping e30) drivers installed? And then see two DAC's?
I shall maybe completely abandon this idea as literally it as adding complexity for no apparent reason/gain?
Is it risky to go with the unbalanced Flex? Or I am safe to go as long as I will use the same plugs?
Asking cause I already have all the cables.
Also:
How the below scenario can be viable at the level of windows?
PC->Flex Digital->DAC->Preamp->Power Amp
Windows will have both(flex+topping e30) drivers installed? And then see two DAC's?
I shall maybe completely abandon this idea as literally it as adding complexity for no apparent reason/gain?
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