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The Laptop Thread

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Ron Texas

Ron Texas

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@AnalogSteph let's say I didn't expect that big of.a surprise. Non upgradable memory is a design feature (unfortunately) in many Windows laptops, especially the thin and light category. At the start of this thread the absence of upgrade options was one of the factors which made shopping for a laptop computer challenging.
 

srrxr71

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I would love to see a list. The situation has been improving as the latest builds of F00bar2000 for MacOS are very good. I finally learned how to split a single Flac into tracks using a cue sheet and XLD. It's not as convenient as fb2k for windows. Things are kind of fragmented. You can do this or that, but it's not like using fb2k for Windows where everything is there. I have no idea as to how to convert DSD to PCM on a Mac. Lots of free stuff yes, but not as much and some things are missing.
I’ve been researching an alternative to Equalizer APO on Mac and it’s a real pain.
 
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Ron Texas

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I’ve been researching an alternative to Equalizer APO on Mac and it’s a real pain.
Try using something called Blackhole with AU Lab from Apple. I have not tried it, but it's worth looking into.
 
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Ron Texas

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Microsoft announced AI enabled PC's. The big news is they run on Qualcomm CPU's meaning Intel is on the way out after over 40 years. Performance is claimed to be on a par with Mac's. Also, software written for Intel Windows machines is supposed to run on the Qualcomm machines using their version of Rossetta with performance comparable to recent Intel CPU's. This is a huge shakeup considering how large the Windows ecosystem is. No doubt some programs written for Intel will not run on the new systems, most likely anything which accesses hardware directly. Adobe has already announced versions of Creative Cloud for the Qualcomm processors.

These AI enabled PC's are said to remember everything done on them. That seems really creepy to me as I expect all this data is being uploaded to servers at Microsoft, Dell, HP or whatever. What's the benefit? Is this another wave of targeted advertising? Does the PC start to resemble the overly managed feed at Facebook. How about employer monitoring?
 

Doodski

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Microsoft announced AI enabled PC's. The big news is they run on Qualcomm CPU's meaning Intel is on the way out after over 40 years.
Hmmz. Intel is building a massive fab plant in the USA and a massive packaging plant in Quebec. Huge investments. It's about technology security and keeping the operations in North America.
These AI enabled PC's are said to remember everything done on them. That seems really creepy to me as I expect all this data is being uploaded to servers at Microsoft, Dell, HP or whatever. What's the benefit? Is this another wave of targeted advertising? Does the PC start to resemble the overly managed feed at Facebook. How about employer monitoring?
I don't like that. It seem unnecessary and over-reach.
 
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Ron Texas

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Hmmz. Intel is building a massive fab plant in the USA and a massive packaging plant in Quebec. Huge investments. It's about technology security and keeping the operations in North America.

I don't like that. It seem unnecessary and over-reach.
Congress passed a massive subsidy bill to get fabs built in the US. They are afraid China will take over Taiwan.
 

srrxr71

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Have you see the Github project called "Fan Control"?

Github Link

MainUI.png


JayzTwoCents did an overview in 2022 on this software here:

He says this software is miles ahead of all manufacturer's software related to fan control.
He says the software is amazing, and it's the most powerful software he's ever used.

I didn't test it.
I’ve used this on gaming PC, did not want to install that MSI/Asus nonsense spyware. It works great.
 

pablolie

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On the Windows 10/11 front, I learned that if you have an Office365 subscription (and why run Windows if you don't) you will continue to get Win10 security updates.

Way to monetize Win10 past its supposed lifetime... enterprises will most naturally pay for ESU... :)
 

somebodyelse

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if you have an Office365 subscription (and why run Windows if you don't)
Oddly enough Office365 mostly works pretty well on other platforms, so isn't so much of a reason to stick with Windows. It's the other bits of desirable/necessary hardware and software that are Windows-only that force its use. Wine and Proton do pretty well, but don't work for everything, and ther are gaps in the driver reverse engineering effort.
 

srrxr71

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The only point of Windows at this is PC gaming. My gaming machine does not contain any personal data. No email nothing.

Yes office works great on Mac and since all my data and passwords are on iPhone I just use Mac for my personal affairs.
 

somebodyelse

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The only point of Windows at this is PC gaming
For you maybe. For me it's SigmaStudio and the Hypex filter designer - they need a device driver loaded so won't work in Wine. I know people still using Win7 because the driver for their laser cutters won't work on anything higher. I gather there are similar situations for some much more expensive hardware.
 

007Shortz

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For you maybe. For me it's SigmaStudio and the Hypex filter designer - they need a device driver loaded so won't work in Wine. I know people still using Win7 because the driver for their laser cutters won't work on anything higher. I gather there are similar situations for some much more expensive hardware.
Yep! A lot of engineering software is running on Windows (CAD/simulation/measurement).
 
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If anyone hasn't considered it yet, we have been in WWIII for some time now.
 
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kelesh

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I'm going to start off with a generality. Laptops are at least an order of magnitude harder to design, manufacture and select than desktop computers. Weight, power consumption, screen size, trackpad, keyboard, cooling, CPU, GPU and memory all present difficulties not present in desktop computers (except for all in one designs). Desktops allow for the easy upgrade of GPU's and memory. Laptop GPU's (there might be an exception) are not upgradable. Memory is sometimes upgradable.

My next generality is every Windows laptop I have owned for at least the last 7 years has a way of running hot and getting noisy. This happens even on relatively modest tasks like web surfing. Sometimes a fan utility will fix this, sometimes not. Maybe someone makes one which adapts automatically, but all of my experience is either there is a manual utility setting or nothing at all.

This next general observation about Windows laptops is something which was not so bad in the past, but I find it very annoying and have returned a Lenovo Legion 5 and a Dell Inspiron 16 in the last year because of it. Remember third party crapware? Trials of McAfee are still on most new laptops. However there is now third party stuff with telemetry. Dell has some program claimed to optimize network performance. Fortunately, it's easy to remove. Gaming laptops have Nehemic Audio. This is considered to be spyware by many. It's nearly impossible to remove. I attempted to remove it from the Legion 5 and it clobbered the audio stack to where Equalizer APO would no longer work. I did a reset which fixed the audio stack but when removing the McAfee trial I found Microsoft Defender had been disabled, so I returned the thing. Windows gaming computers carry a lot of manufacturer installed utilities some of which keep track of and report back on the games one plays. Their fan and power utilities are essential for optimum operation.

There is something worse than 3rd party crapware. That is manufacturer installed telemetry. On the Inspiron 16 which I briefly owned the services running had all kinds of sinister names like "Dell Data Vault" and telemetry this and that. These things are being marketed as utilities which optimize the user experience, but some comments I found elsewhere was employers could access data vault to see how the employee was using the machine. I'm sure all this info goes back to Dell although there is probably a way out for enterprise customers purchasing boatloads of Dell's. I tried to remove this stuff on the Inspiron but found it disabled the utility which controls the fan and some other useful items. Reinstallation did not work so I did a reset. Since the system image was done months earlier lots of stuff had to be updated. It turns out these days you may be stuck with your manufacturer updating utility because they are not putting everything on Windows Update anymore. The system did not update properly. Icons and links disappeared for essential utilities. I took it back. I will note here that out of the box it did not update without problems. In other words, you can do a clean install, but your machine will lack fan control and might not update properly. Maybe you can get a third party fan control working, maybe not. Do you really want to have to mess with on your brand new laptop.

Intel integrated GPU's are OK for office work and video playback. The Iris Xe (about to be replaced by a faster IGPU with an Arc designation) can output 8K video at 60 Hz. What the Iris can't do competently is any task which utilizes GPU acceleration. It performs abysmally compared to discreet GPU's or the IGPU in my MacBook Pro M3 Pro (11/14 cores). A Denoise operation in Lightroom took 6 minutes. The Mac did it in 45 seconds. An RTX 4080 with an uncapped 145 watt TDP is more than twice as fast at that operation, but will be packaged in a machine weighing around 9 pounds (4 kg) when the power supply is considered. I will note here that manufacturer specification only give the weight of the computer. The power supply is listed by wattage. As a rule of thumb laptop power supplies weigh 1 lb (454 gr) per 100 watts. The brick which comes with gaming and other high power drain laptops will also have a heavy duty power cord which can add even more weight.

More later...

The problem with thermal management is that all manufacturers are so obsessed with making laptops thinner and lighter that they are losing functionality. Yes, newer chips are more efficient and running cooler, but do you really need a 5mm thick laptop? If you want something that portable, get a tablet or mobile phone. I recently bought a new HP laptop and while I'll admit that the aluminium case is nice looking, stronger and does provide better heat dissipation than plastic, it is too thin to allow even a normal RJ45 port. That and the lack of an optical drive is a PITA. I just checked the age of my last "proper" laptop, a 2014 ThinkPad, this makes it 10 years old and I still use it constantly without any issues, plus I can easily swap out storage and other parts because most of it is easily accessible. When I first bought it, I immediately clean installed W7 Pro and got a spare fan just in case, but I have not needed to replace it. There are some current manufacturers that are attempting to bring back modular design such as Framework.
 
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