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PS Audio sent Erin their speaker??!!

MacClintock

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Sure, the speaker is very nicely designed and works great as a living room furniture piece. But comparing this ($10,000, PS Audio):
index.php



to this (Mechano23 DIY, $220 in parts):

index.php


let's you question some things.
 
OP
nerdemoji

nerdemoji

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Sure, the speaker is very nicely designed and works great as a living room furniture piece. But comparing this ($10,000, PS Audio):
index.php



to this (Mechano23 DIY, $220 in parts):

index.php


let's you question some things.
There is more to speakers than they’re estimated in room response. distortion is significantly better on the PS Audio. Also, a DIY bookshelf part price and a high end floorstander is not a great comparison imo.
 

MacClintock

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There is more to speakers than they’re estimated in room response. distortion is significantly better on the PS Audio. Also, a DIY bookshelf part price and a high end floorstander is not a great comparison imo.
That is all true, but still, why is it that some (very skilled, I assume) amateur managed to construct with cheap parts such a smooth response, while a company with a lot of money doesn't? I just can't wrap my head around that. To me it just looks like that PS Audio isn't doing it's homework. But charging premium prices. A Mercedes will not lose to a DIY car, in no respect.
 

amirm

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That is all true, but still, why is it that some (very skilled, I assume) amateur managed to construct with cheap parts such a smooth response, while a company with a lot of money doesn't?
I suspect that was not the design target for PS Audio.
 

boxerfan88

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Weighted toward tuned/voiced by ear vs. Weighted toward tuned/voiced by measurements ?

( I believe both use measurement & listening during the design. )
 

amirm

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To create a smooth estimated in-room response? Shouldn't it be the design target of everybody developing speakers?
By our book, yes. By others who tune by ear, going after some kind of showroom sound, etc., no. I don't get the feeling that measurements were the #1 criteria for release of this speaker.
 

JSmith

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a $10,000 speaker?
I think it could be better for this price as well... but this is PS Audio too, so pricey items are to be expected from them. @Chris Brunhaver is a very competent speaker designer though in his own right and these are pretty much his speakers with PS Audio branding. Working for a company like PS Audio, I gather there would be some design goals and restrictions on total design freedom to take into account as well.


JSmith
 

jhaider

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To create a smooth estimated in-room response? Shouldn't it be the design target of everybody developing speakers?
No. The target per the publicly available research should be flat and smooth on axis response, and smooth off axis response (especially horizontally).

Will that generally lead to a smooth PIR? I assume so. There are other ways to get smooth PIR that sound different, and worse iMO. PIR is a result, not the target.
 

Chris Brunhaver

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Well, I did not say it is not conforming to the specs, but +- 6 dB is a large tolerance, there are +- 3dB or +- 1.5 dB often quoted. Also, if you substract from the esimated in-room response curve, the -6dB are well above 32 Hz.
No, not +\- 6 db. -6 db referenced to 200 Hz in the on axis response. This is the same as KEF and many others do.

Your commenting about 60 hz shows a lack of familiarity with reading a graph like this . +\- 3 means the same thing WRT bass extension. +/- 1.5 or -3 db is the half power point but not a good indicator of usable extension, especially when considering room gain. This is why we and others spec at -6.
 

Chris Brunhaver

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Sure, the speaker is very nicely designed and works great as a living room furniture piece. But comparing this ($10,000, PS Audio):


to this (Mechano23 DIY, $220 in parts):

index.php


let's you question some things.
Do you want to build a kit, solder and supply/build the box and consider that for $0 (like your time is worth nothing). If you enjoy DIY, that’s one thing, but this obviously isn’t apples to apples.

I like DIY but to build a nice box, and make enough profit to resell and support the product, this might end up more like $1000+ (for a small 5.25” bookshelf).

There are plenty of other designs on the market using the very good sb acoustics and scan speak drivers but we are pursuing a line of planar magnet hybrid speakers which have certain technical benefits (wide dispersion, low distortion, rather high dynamic range , and low stored energy). Yes there are other designs which have smoother FR and in-room response.

However, the design target is still an even tonal balance and extended bass on all PS speakers so far.
 

JSmith

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What's the problem with sending it to him ?
I don't recall anyone having an issue with PS Audio sending these to Erin to test, however I think a few were wondering why they didn't also send a pair to Amir to test, especially since @Chris Brunhaver is a member here. It would have been good to see both sets of measurements and from PS Audio's perspective it would have been extra verification of the measurements, which surely would have been a positive thing for sales. Maybe the Boss had some issues with ASR... who knows. ;)


JSmith
 

YSC

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I don't recall anyone having an issue with PS Audio sending these to Erin to test, however I think a few were wondering why they didn't also send a pair to Amir to test, especially since @Chris Brunhaver is a member here. It would have been good to see both sets of measurements and from PS Audio's perspective it would have been extra verification of the measurements, which surely would have been a positive thing for sales. Maybe the Boss had some issues with ASR... who knows. ;)


JSmith
I would believe it's related to Amirm's back, those big ___ speakers arn't nice to Amirm's spine unless he's trying to sit in a wheelchair frm now on;)
Do you want to build a kit, solder and supply/build the box and consider that for $0 (like your time is worth nothing). If you enjoy DIY, that’s one thing, but this obviously isn’t apples to apples.

I like DIY but to build a nice box, and make enough profit to resell and support the product, this might end up more like $1000+ (for a small 5.25” bookshelf).

There are plenty of other designs on the market using the very good sb acoustics and scan speak drivers but we are pursuing a line of planar magnet hybrid speakers which have certain technical benefits (wide dispersion, low distortion, rather high dynamic range , and low stored energy). Yes there are other designs which have smoother FR and in-room response.

However, the design target is still an even tonal balance and extended bass on all PS speakers so far.
understand and respectful speaker in it's own, if it's me I personally would likely opt for a Revel or KEF (No offense), but when very high SPL is wanted and maybe have some sort of lust for planar tweeter or even it's look, this is a fine speaker in practice to say the least
 

Chris Brunhaver

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I would believe it's related to Amirm's back, those big ___ speakers arn't nice to Amirm's spine unless he's trying to sit in a wheelchair frm now on;)

understand and respectful speaker in it's own, if it's me I personally would likely opt for a Revel or KEF (No offense), but when very high SPL is wanted and maybe have some sort of lust for planar tweeter or even it's look, this is a fine speaker in practice to say the least
Well, I don't mean to sound defensive. There are some great speakers on the market (some of which are very aggressively priced) but I don't think that additional choice is a bad thing. My friend in town is getting a pair of Blade 1 meta next week or so and I'm looking forward to hearing those in a more familiar setting than the showrooms and trade shows I've heard them.

I'm continuing to work on R&D and improving the technical aspects of future products and plan to keep engaging with ASR and elsewhere to talk about the design stuff.
 

WillBrink

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I was just surprised, happy, and impressed they got as thumbs up from Erin. It's not uncommon for a brand to have a "house sound" which may not always measure flat. Some will like it, some will not. Erin's review put those speakers on the list of worth listening to some time for me.
 

MaxBuck

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Sure, the speaker is very nicely designed and works great as a living room furniture piece. But comparing this ($10,000, PS Audio):
index.php



to this (Mechano23 DIY, $220 in parts):

index.php


let's you question some things.
That's scarcely a reasonable comparison.
 

YSC

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Well, I don't mean to sound defensive. There are some great speakers on the market (some of which are very aggressively priced) but I don't think that additional choice is a bad thing. My friend in town is getting a pair of Blade 1 meta next week or so and I'm looking forward to hearing those in a more familiar setting than the showrooms and trade shows I've heard them.

I'm continuing to work on R&D and improving the technical aspects of future products and plan to keep engaging with ASR and elsewhere to talk about the design stuff.
Surely you didn’t sound defensive to me, at least not “ungrounded defense” in my feeling, and I don’t want to sound dismissive also. We all have different needs and weightings in own own book, and IIRC objectively this speaker measures way better than what JA did in the pre production model did( I recall there was a boosting highs with a big ass dip and peak near 20khz or so, my memory isn’t great though)

We all have different priority and use cases. And salute to the design which falls in what I would call “objectively good enough” To be among the option list when purchasing a new speaker
 

Pearljam5000

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What's the the reason the woofers look like that , what are they made of ?
Screenshot_20240511_065347_YouTube.jpg
 
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