Harman Sells Out to Samsung

[Phelonious Ponk]

I agree that this could be the end of high-end at Harman. But I've long maintained that the high-end and even the pro audio business is really about people; not products. Harman has great people. If those people don't feel valued, they will simply leave and start a new firm so they can continue to pursue their interests. Most of the great people at Harman came from somewhere else before they arrived at Harman.

Individuals can't do what Harman does. What makes them exceptional is their broad dedication to fidelity, backed up by research and very deep pockets. Sean Olive could leave Harman and start a speaker company. That doesn't mean he'd be able to do what he did at Harman.

 

[Thomas savage]

Individuals can't do what Harman does. What makes them exceptional is their broad dedication to fidelity, backed up by research and very deep pockets. Sean Olive could leave Harman and start a speaker company. That doesn't mean he'd be able to do what he did at Harman.

Most don't have the budget or equipment to do what harman do.. Not by a long long way. That's one of the factors that limit relevant innovation in audio.

Not just that, the testing they do is not possible for the smaller companies. The professional manufacturing processes and practices can't be emulated by your every day audiophile boutique brand.

However countering that designers seem to often feel they are restricted by large corporate structures and this can stifle innovation as well.

In this regard we have to congratulate beolabs! Innovation, professional cutting edge manufacturing practices and backing design with huge research investment. No boutique companies can come close to this.

 

[Sal1950]

Breaks my heart every time I hear of a great old US corp like Harman selling out to foreign ownership. A very sad circumstance.

 

[Keith_W]

So Sal1950, what have you done lately to support U.S. made hifi?

 

[Thomas savage]

Breaks my heart every time I hear of a great old US corp like Harman selling out to foreign ownership. A very sad circumstance.

Could be worse our nuclear power is being funded by China and the French

 

[Sal1950]

So Sal1950, what have you done lately to support U.S. made hifi?

Hard to do in the realities of todays world.
My HSU speaker system is a US corp, though they are assembled in China I believe.
My Emotiva DC-1 DAC is the same as above.
My Adcom amps was a US corp though the amps were assembled in Japan.
Best I can do at my spending level. If I had more $ I'd be looking to one of the US high end builders.
I do try to buy domestic products when ever possible, from looking at the labels and options for much of what I purchase.
Hoping a new era of Trump leadership and some leveling of the import/export playing field will help to make us stronger.

 

[Sal1950]

So Sal1950, what have you done lately to support U.S. made hifi?

BTW, My prior system before retirement and moving to FL included
Klipsch La Scala speakers US owned and made.
HSU HRSW12 subwoofers, US owned and made
VTL monoblocks amps, US owned and made
McCormack passive preamp, US owned and made

 

[dallasjustice]

I read an article about the Harman purchase in the new Economist. Two thirds of Harmans income is automobiles and it's the fastest growing part of their business. It seems like this is a pure car play for Samsung and it's not just car stereos. From the article, Samsung views cars as the ultimate mobile interconnected device. IOW, Samsung wants in on automated driving, communication and infotainment.

This is THE biggest purchase Samsung has made. So they intend to capitalize on their investment. They must expand beyond cell phones and this is it. There's no guarantee Samsung will succeed with this endevour. This purchase requires that car companies continue to outsource this new automation. That's not clear right now. For example, Ford intends to develop similar technology totally in house. This approach makes a lot of sense considering the unbelievable potential liability involved if the 3rd party makes a mistake integrating automation technology.

I just bought a 2016 BMW 740i a couple of weeks ago. It has a lot of these automated driving/navigation/communication/infotainment technology. BMW prolly does it better than anyone (except maybe Tesla). I can certainly see how and why 3rd party integration can be potentially dangerous for drivers relying on it.

Where does Harman's huge acoustic research facility and budget factor into this new world?

 

[Thomas savage]

I read an article about the Harman purchase in the new Economist. Two thirds of Harmans income is automobiles and it's the fastest growing part of their business. It seems like this is a pure car play for Samsung. From the article, Samsung views cars as the ultimate mobile interconnected device. IOW, Samsung wants in on automated driving, communication and infotainment.

This is THE biggest purchase Samsung has made. So they intend to capitalize on their investment. They must expand beyond cell phones and this is it. There's no guarantee Samsung will succeed with this endevour. This purchase requires that car companies continue to outsource this new automation. That's not clear right now. For example, Ford intends to develop similar technology totally in house. This approach makes a lot of sense considering the unbelievable potential liability involved if the 3rd party makes a mistake integrating automation technology.

I just bought a 2016 BMW 740i a couple of weeks ago. It has a lot of these automated driving/navigation/communication/infotainment technology. BMW prolly does it better than anyone (except maybe Tesla). I can certainly see how and why 3rd party integration can be potentially dangerous for drivers relying on it.

Where does Harman's huge acoustic research facility and budget factor into this new world?

That was my take...the acoustic research division might be split off and sold or just annexed. However contemporary tech companies tend to steer clear of the 'silo' like separation preferring a more intergraded philosophy..

Who knows!

 

[Thomas savage]

If I were pioneer or Sony I would not mind a punt at buying the acoustic research department...

 

[dallasjustice]

If I were pioneer or Sony I would not mind a punt at buying the acoustic research department...

"Punt" is a funny word. I know how you used it in this context. I think it the same as "bet." However, the verb "punt" in U.S. English means the opposite. It's derived from American football and it means to give-up on a risky proposition to prevent additional future losses.

IOW, Samsung may also "punt" on Harman's substantial research/audiophile segments.

 

[amirm]

Breaks my heart every time I hear of a great old US corp like Harman selling out to foreign ownership. A very sad circumstance.

They didn't sell out. Harman is a public company and Samsung offered to buy all the shares well above the market price. The board has a fiduciary responsibility to drive higher value and had no choice but to vote in favor. In other words, it is the individual shareholders of the company that sold out to Samsung.

If it were a private company it would be another matter but it is not. In this case, Samsung took advantage of our open market and economy. The only way that could be changed would have been legislation against foreign owned entities.

 

[amirm]

If I were pioneer or Sony I would not mind a punt at buying the acoustic research department...

Pioneer is a tiny company so has no ability to make such purchases. It has been close to bankruptcy a couple of times to boot.

Sony has its own automotive division and pride would have stopped them before making such decision.

 

[amirm]

Where does Harman's huge acoustic research facility and budget factor into this new world?

That budget is justified by the automotive division research actually. So to the extent that connection can continue to be "sold" to Samsung management, all should be quite well. Getting good sound in a car is very tough challenge but one that is solved using similar research.

 

[Thomas savage]

That budget is justified by the automotive division research actually. So to the extent that connection can continue to be "sold" to Samsung management, all should be quite well. Getting good sound in a car is very tough challenge but one that is solved using similar research.

The car is a tough acoustic environment in terms of the accurate reproduction of music.. If you can make things sound great there the living room should be easy..

 

[dallasjustice]

At least the articles I've read so far indicate Samsung didn't buy Harman for car stereos.

That budget is justified by the automotive division research actually. So to the extent that connection can continue to be "sold" to Samsung management, all should be quite well. Getting good sound in a car is very tough challenge but one that is solved using similar research.

 

[amirm]

The car is a tough acoustic environment in terms of the accurate reproduction of music.. If you can make things sound great there the living room should be easy..

Correct. To expand, there is always a transition region below which the "room" dominates the sound, not the loudspeaker. See this article: http://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/subwoofer-low-frequency-optimization.15/

This transition region is 100% dependent on the volume of the room. For home environment per above, that is in 100 to 200 Hz so the low bass becomes problematic. Now shrink the room like in a car and the transition frequencies go up to hundreds of hertz, impacting much more of the music content. So solving those problems is one in the same as in the home.

 

[amirm]

At least the articles I've read so far indicate Samsung didn't buy Harman for car stereos.

When I say car stereos, I mean the OEM business of selling the infotainment system which includes audio. I am not talking about aftermarket car stereos which are some other business.

 

[dallasjustice]

That's what I mean. Samsung wants to compete with Google and Apple. Just look at where Google and Apple are focusing their R&D. Samsung wants Harman's "relationships" with auto makers.

When I say car stereos, I mean the OEM business of selling the infotainment system which includes audio. I am not talking about aftermarket car stereos which are some other business.

 

[Sal1950]

They didn't sell out. Harman is a public company and Samsung offered to buy all the shares well above the market price. The board has a fiduciary responsibility to drive higher value and had no choice but to vote in favor. In other words, it is the individual shareholders of the company that sold out to Samsung.

If it were a private company it would be another matter but it is not. In this case, Samsung took advantage of our open market and economy. The only way that could be changed would have been legislation against foreign owned entities.

That doesn't make it any easier to swallow here.
To have great old US audio companies like H-K, JBL, Infinity, Crown, Mark Levinson, etc; become the property of a South Korean corp makes me ill and angry.