Like sensitivity and efficiency ratings?
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Your loudspeakers are too small!
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What are those different meanings?
I've seen a pretty coherent, consistent use of the term and I supplied examples.
Remember I'm not proposing that it's a term with scientific precision. Only that it does have some meaning and so can be useful. Plus, one can always use an example of what we are referring to, to help clarify when using the term. So long as it's clarified...it can be a useful term.
But if there is a better alternative, that's great too. (Though, even a better alternative doesn't render the less precise alternative moot, any more than scientifically precise language would render musical notations referring to volume modulations - e.g. pianissimo, forte - useless).
Sure.
So how would you describe via the language or explanatory power of "transient reproduction" the differences referenced by "micro" and "macro" dynamics. In other words, please use "transient reproduction" to discern between a speaker that could realistically reproduce the playing dynamics of an acoustic guitar, but NOT the realistic acoustic power/dynamics of a full orchestra.
All I've seen from alternatives to "micro/macro dynamic" thus far are even more vague waves towards terms like "detail" and "transient reproduction." I'd like to see those put in to action so they actually can describe "micro/macro" dynamics, like the examples given, in a more useful way.
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Sure, that could play a part in explaining micro/macro dynamics.
But keep in mind, that's an explanation for the micro/macro dynamics, not a replacement.
Remember the term "micro dynamics" isn't simply applied to speakers, it's applied to the phenomena speakers are trying to reproduce. To music. In other words, a live acoustic guitarist plays with micro dynamics - but the guitarist doesn't have "sensitivity/efficiency" ratings.
So "micro dynamics" is a thing in the real world that a playback system is trying to reproduce. Explaining HOW a speaker can reproduce them - perhaps it will involve sensitivity/efficiency ratings - isn't a replacement for "micro dynamics," just the explanation for how you can reproduce them.
Ken1951
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Pico-dynamics perhaps? 
Again, just concentrating on describing loudspeaker performance, the terms you are using are vague. I can't use them to compare a set of loudspeakers. Their meaning is all over the place. .... and you're using them to also describe how well a guitarist plays.
Trell
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Nah, not at all.If that's directed toward me I'm afraid you've got the wrong guy
mhardy6647
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Well -- one may measure acoustic power (in watts), which can be kind of handy since it's independent of geometry. And of course, there's no such thing as an "RMS watt" -- even though the US Federal Trade Commission, apparently, thought that there was.
One may also measure loudspeaker efficiency in terms of the ratio of acoustic power out to electrical power in (usually expressed as percent). Spoiler alert: the efficiency of most loudspeakers is very, very low. I don't know if, e.g., the EU knows that or not -- they might start makin' rules or somethin'.
DanielT
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However, it is of course not wrong to express oneself subjectively in order to share one's impressions and feelings. We all do that all the time about everything possible. We like to hang out with each other and have something to talk about. The crux is if you think that another person's experiences give the same experiences for yourself and vice versa. I think that in itself that most people are aware of is the case. It's like a little basic psychology that we know. Sometimes we even ask about it: Was it a nice experience nice for you too, my darling? The answer may be, yes feel free to put on a new song by ..
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rowman.com
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Microdynamics - an overview | ScienceDirect Topics
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I'm not sure if you were being serious
Those are all examples of "micro dynamics" as used in other disciplines. I've been talking specifically about how people are using the term "micro dynamics" as applied to music, and music reproduction.
I mean...are you objecting to all the uses of the term "micro dynamics" that you just posted? Is the term "micro dynamics" in the biological discipline rendered vague because of all your other examples of how it's used by authors in psychology, history, geology etc?
A term can mean different things when applied to different disciplines, where it is defined for that discipline. Right?
Again: We are discussing "micro dynamics" as the term is used regarding musical performance/production and reproduction.
I am serious.I'm not sure if you were being serious
Those are all examples of "micro dynamics" as used in other disciplines. I've been talking specifically about how people are using the term "micro dynamics" as applied to music, and music reproduction.
Why don’t you show me a paper written about it? Or do you expect us to accept that just because people on audio forums talk about it, it is a term?
If you can’t measure it, if it doesn’t have a unit, if there is no mathematical model of it, then it has no place in science.
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mhardy6647
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... "we" already had those bad jokes way, way back on page 3 of this thread.Pico-dynamics perhaps?
Your loudspeakers are too small!
Or it has no meaning whatsoever but sounds good. I remember Allen Wright always using the slogan "downward dynamic range," which was similarly more of a fortune cookie slogan than anything with actual meaning. "downward dynamic range".. eh, that sounded as a waffle statement.:) You who are a...
www.audiosciencereview.com
Ken1951
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Oops! Saw the "nano" missed the "pico". My mind was likely numbed by some the excessive word salads!... "we" already had those bad jokes way, way back on page 3 of this thread.
Your loudspeakers are too small!
Or it has no meaning whatsoever but sounds good. I remember Allen Wright always using the slogan "downward dynamic range," which was similarly more of a fortune cookie slogan than anything with actual meaning. "downward dynamic range".. eh, that sounded as a waffle statement.:) You who are a...
Larry B. Larabee
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Talking about micro-dynamics. I don't remember this ability, if it exists, of a component being something attributed to speakers. I was under the impression that it was something that described low level delineation in complex musical passages of an amp or preamp that was related to its residual noise level for the most part. I think the guys called it 'an inky black background' (no offense, Kal).
If your talking about the same ability of a speaker being able to resolve this then it should be easier to realize when the widest range of frequencies and flattest amplitude response were able to be reproduced, so as to not obscure anything in the background(any instrument playing at a low sound level). So, more the extent of the low frequency response and frequency accuracy (transfer function?) in a smaller speaker rather than efficiency and dynamic range. As Sarumbear says 'all recordings are compressed' so why be concerned with something that is seldom there in the first place.
So, does size matter, in this case, of course not because the measured performance can be quite similar between a bookshelf (these days) and a floorstanding speaker.
I say that subjectively nothing less than 2 cu. ft.,an 8 in. woofer and 2 crossover points is the least I would be willing to consider no matter what the outcome. This is strictly an opinion, of course.
If your talking about the same ability of a speaker being able to resolve this then it should be easier to realize when the widest range of frequencies and flattest amplitude response were able to be reproduced, so as to not obscure anything in the background(any instrument playing at a low sound level). So, more the extent of the low frequency response and frequency accuracy (transfer function?) in a smaller speaker rather than efficiency and dynamic range. As Sarumbear says 'all recordings are compressed' so why be concerned with something that is seldom there in the first place.
So, does size matter, in this case, of course not because the measured performance can be quite similar between a bookshelf (these days) and a floorstanding speaker.
I say that subjectively nothing less than 2 cu. ft.,an 8 in. woofer and 2 crossover points is the least I would be willing to consider no matter what the outcome. This is strictly an opinion, of course.
Well -- one may measure acoustic power (in watts), which can be kind of handy since it's independent of geometry. And of course, there's no such thing as an "RMS watt" -- even though the US Federal Trade Commission, apparently, thought that there was.
One may also measure loudspeaker efficiency in terms of the ratio of acoustic power out to electrical power in (usually expressed as percent). Spoiler alert: the efficiency of most loudspeakers is very, very low. I don't know if, e.g., the EU knows that or not -- they might start makin' rules or somethin'.
Yeah, so much confusion and misuse of terms float around.
I feel pretty well versed with the terms like speaker efficiency and sensitivity. Making speaker measurements is a large facet of my audio hobby....study/practice it regularly.
As far as RMS....to me, all it means is root mean square...just a statistical technique for finding a particular type of average.
Larry B. Larabee
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The assumption that rms power is referring to continuous power has been the case for decades. The problem is, if you are anal, the mathematical resut of rms voltage times rms current turns out to be zero. Or something like that.
Not anal but have an EE degree
killdozzer
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From what has been offered so far, one might think that micro-dynamics describe speakers' ability to play heavily compressed music.
I can't see it as satisfying. Imagine how hard it would be to tie such a vague term directly to either big or small speakers (one having more or less of the property). And then proving that this makes them sound "big" or "small".
I can't see it as satisfying. Imagine how hard it would be to tie such a vague term directly to either big or small speakers (one having more or less of the property). And then proving that this makes them sound "big" or "small".
I always thought it was technically defined as what you hear through the plankton.
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No, a poster did provide a relatively comprehensive answer some pages back about how "micro-dynamics" might relate to directivity, larger speakers being more directional at lower frequencies.
Nobody, as far I can remember, has talked about whether speakers sound big or small.
If you go back to my first post:
That was what I said. I also added something, perhaps unwisely about micro-dynamics, which may well be a thing, according to some posters, even if the term is incorrect. The argument seemed more that the term was incorrect - because once described, a number of people provided better terminology for what I had described.
Ultimately, the posts of sarumbear, rdenney, even SIY agree somewhat with what was said in the quote above. They may not agree wholly, but each of these posters have given reasons why smaller speakers will be limited in SPL compared to larger ones/ones with more cone area. SIY uses drivers on the smaller side, but in a 4-way configuration with the 6.5" driver crossed to larger woofers at 120hz, 4th order. So, quite different than typical 2 way satellites + sub crossed at 80hz.
I will make a summary post for the thread so far soon.
MattHooper did go to bat for micro-dynamics quite vigorously, but micro-dynamics is not the main point of the thread, so let's move the conversation on. Some of the jokes were funny at first, but like all jokes, tend to become rather stale after the 5th, 6th, 10th time of hearing.
Nobody, as far I can remember, has talked about whether speakers sound big or small.
If you go back to my first post:
That was what I said. I also added something, perhaps unwisely about micro-dynamics, which may well be a thing, according to some posters, even if the term is incorrect. The argument seemed more that the term was incorrect - because once described, a number of people provided better terminology for what I had described.
Ultimately, the posts of sarumbear, rdenney, even SIY agree somewhat with what was said in the quote above. They may not agree wholly, but each of these posters have given reasons why smaller speakers will be limited in SPL compared to larger ones/ones with more cone area. SIY uses drivers on the smaller side, but in a 4-way configuration with the 6.5" driver crossed to larger woofers at 120hz, 4th order. So, quite different than typical 2 way satellites + sub crossed at 80hz.
I will make a summary post for the thread so far soon.
MattHooper did go to bat for micro-dynamics quite vigorously, but micro-dynamics is not the main point of the thread, so let's move the conversation on. Some of the jokes were funny at first, but like all jokes, tend to become rather stale after the 5th, 6th, 10th time of hearing.
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