Would you consider an all-in-one active speaker system if the engineering is done right?

[whoselife]

I’m working on a concept for an all-in-one home audio system that integrates the streamer, DAC, amplifier, DSP and speakers into one enclosure.

The goal is not simply convenience. I’m interested in whether a highly integrated design can still achieve genuinely good measurable performance while reducing the complexity of a traditional Hi-Fi setup.

The current direction includes:

• active DSP crossover and room-related tuning
• integrated DAC and amplification
• network streaming and local playback
• Ethernet / Wi-Fi / Bluetooth / AirPlay
• a built-in display for playback and system control
• three possible speaker configurations, from nearfield desktop use to a larger bass-extended system

My main concern is the engineering trade-off.

Integration makes the signal path shorter and gives the manufacturer much more control over amplification, crossover, driver protection and DSP. On the other hand, it reduces modularity and makes upgrades or repairs more difficult.

For ASR members, I’d be interested in knowing:

1. What measurements would you consider essential before taking a product like this seriously?
2. Would you prefer fully active speakers with integrated electronics, or separate streamer/DAC/amplifier components?
3. How important is user-replaceable electronics or modularity?
4. Would good spinorama/directivity data, low distortion and sufficient SPL outweigh concerns about an all-in-one architecture?
5. What design mistakes in current active/all-in-one speakers would you most want to see avoided?

I’m still at the design stage, so critical feedback is more useful to me than encouragement.

I’d especially appreciate input from people who have experience with active speaker design, DSP, amplifier integration or loudspeaker measurements.

 

[Chazz6]

2. Maybe for a passable casual listening box. But if the customer wants high-quality audio, can you convince her that she will never wish she could substitute someone else's product for one or more of components?

 

[Kevin1956]

My biggest concern with all in one systems has always been losing the use of the entire system if any part of the system fails and needs to be taken for repair. Assuming someone locally could repair it.

 

[dshreter]

For me, playing nice with HDMI is an absolute requirement. It needs to accept HDMI-CEC for volume control, and it needs to work with HDMI ARC as an input.

You also mentioned it would have an integrated display? For aesthetic reasons, I would not buy any speaker that had a built in display.

Lastly, how do inputs work more generally? Do the speakers need to daisy chain? I have no problem with integrated solutions and electronics, but having a box somewhere serves some important logistical roles.

 

[Mr. Swordfish]

Lose the streamer, or at least provide a way to input digital audio (usb or spdif) and I would be interested.

If I was building a new system or starting over (which I am probably not).

Active biamplification internal to the speaker box is the obvious best approach to the engineering problem. Send the box a digital stream, do the crossover and whatever EQ is needed in the digital domain, and use internal amps to drive the drivers.

It probably will not catch on with "audiophiles" who like to tinker and swap individual components, but there's a reason almost all studio monitors are active bi- or tri-amped with the amps & crossovers in the box with the drivers.
-
Frankly, I don't understand why passive crossovers are still a thing in "high-end" audio other than that hobbyists like to fiddle with their setup, as pointed out above. And the sales reps won't be able to upsell the customer with high markup high commission magic speaker cables.

 

[terryforsythe]

1. What measurements would you consider essential before taking a product like this seriously?

Rather than provide an exhaustive list, essentially the same measurements made in the speaker reviews by Amir here in this forum and the speaker reviews by Erin's Audio Corner. If the speakers are active, the same measurements made by Amir for the electronics.

2. Would you prefer fully active speakers with integrated electronics, or separate streamer/DAC/amplifier components?

It depends on price, length of the warranty period and the availability of replacement parts. I like an all-in-one solution, but fom a new company, I probably would prefer separates unless the system is inexpensive enough that I don't mind replacing it in 5 years or the electronics are available elsewhere if the company goes out of business (e.g., Hypex plate amplifiers).

3. How important is user-replaceable electronics or modularity?

Very important. The more expensive the system, the more important it becomes to me to be able to repair it, which may include replacing failed components.

4. Would good spinorama/directivity data, low distortion and sufficient SPL outweigh concerns about an all-in-one architecture?

Good spinorama/directivity, low distortion and sufficient SPL are thresholds for me to even consider purchasing a system. Without them, I am not interested in the system, regardless of the architecture. Also, see answers to 2 and 3 above.

5. What design mistakes in current active/all-in-one speakers would you most want to see avoided?

Designs that are not rugged (e.g., see the Topping B100 amplifier thread - good measurements, but too many failures in customers' hands), lack of PEQ/room correction features, lack of full featured subwoofer output and speaker/subwoofer integration (selectable crossover frequencies, crossover topologies, crossover slopes, and continuously variable time delay), connectivity issues, and speakers that look more like industrial hardware than home furnishings. The ability to import and use FIR filters is a benefit, but do not forego the ability for the user also to define and set IIR filters.

 

[MouseOnMars]

Other than a display, Kii Audio has been making those for years. You're way behind the curve on this.

 

[Multicore]

Sure i would.

Display on the remote, e.g. phone app, is the better solution for UI reasons.

Isn't Sonos 5 an example?

 

[RexrothPigeon]

I basically already use this: Dutch & Dutch 8c speakers are roon endpoints, so my primary listening room consists of the speakers and nothing more (an old laptop in another room is my roon server).

 

[shuppatsu]

Other than a display, Kii Audio has been making those for years. You're way behind the curve on this.

KEF too, but OP wasn't claiming to be the first.

 

[Talisman]

I don't consider any hardware device that requires software to function (in the audio context). We've heard a lot about "all-in-one" products becoming junk after a bad software update or because the software is no longer available. It simply doesn't make sense to me. A streamer costs €100 and tends to become obsolete very quickly. A good amplifier and good speakers can last decades; I don't want them both.

 

[MouseOnMars]

KEF too, but OP wasn't claiming to be the first.

If not the first, then exactly what is he creating?

 

[shuppatsu]

Active speakers with integrated streaming! Imagine if there was just one model for every concept.

 

[respice finem]

Such all-in-ones already exist (e.g. Nubert). They even feature room correction.

Find your Active Speaker now! | Nubert

Discover Active Speakers here now ► nubert.de/en! Best quality ✓ Fast delivery ✓ Top service ✓

www.nubert.de

My main concern would be the hassle (and loss of the whole system), should anything fail.
So, preferably, the electronics should be a module, easily removable to be sent in for repair / replacement, instead of having to ship a whole loudspeaker.

And, many like to be able to "play" with all sorts of hardware, and an all-in-one solution takes this away.

 

[terryforsythe]

If not the first, then exactly what is he creating?

We don't have enough details. But, competition breeds innovation and value for consumers. Maybe whoselife will bring Genelec, Dutch and Dutch and KEF levels of active speaker performance at lower prices and with more features that we want. At this point we don't know, but give him a chance to prove himself.

 

[MouseOnMars]

We don't have enough details. But, competition breeds innovation and value for consumers. Maybe whoselife will bring Genelec, Dutch and Dutch and KEF levels of active speaker performance at lower prices and with more features that we want. At this point we don't know, but give him a chance to prove himself.

But his ideas are already implemented. To begin a startup to create what already exists is what we call dumb.

 

[terryforsythe]

Such all-in-ones already exist (e.g. Nubert). They even feature room correction.

But his ideas are already implemented. To begin a startup to create what already exists is what we call dumb.

High performance mid-engine sports cars have been around since at least as far back as the 1960s, but in 2020 Chevy came out with the C8 offering competative mid-engine performance at much lower prices. Many consumers view that as a win - it now outsells every other high performance mid-engine sports car on the market.

 

[MouseOnMars]

High performance mid-engine sports cars have been around since at least as far back as the 1960s, but in 2020 Chevy came out with the C8 offering competative mid-engine performance at much lower prices. Many consumers view that as a win - it now outsells every other high performance mid-engine sports car on the market.

He never mentioned recreating existing products at a lower price. He clearly thinks such a product would be a new and innovative invention. It's not.

BTW - chevy never had a mid-engined car until very recently with the corvette

 

[terryforsythe]

He never mentioned recreating existing products at a lower price.

He didn't mention price whatsoever. Instead of assuming anything, wait and see what he offers.

BTW - chevy never had a mid-engined car until very recently with the corvette

Ferrari, Lamborghini, Porsche, Lotus, Audi, Koenigsegg, McClaren, etc. all did. Chevy sells more C8s than all of those companies' mid-engine sports cars combined, and by a large amount. Some of those companies had been around for a long time making mid-engine sports cars. Chevy came in with the C8 and disrupted the market, making a high performance mid-engine sports car attainable to more consumers.

BTW - Chevy is part of GM, as was Pontiac before GM's bankruptcy. Pontiac had a mid-engine sports car, the Fiero, but I wouldn't call it high performance. Chevy released the C8 Corvette in 2020.

 

[terryforsythe]

It's strange to me to see people opposed to competition in the market place. If another company comes out with a new product, if you don't like it, don't buy it. Other people may want it, though. Let's see what he comes up with. There are niche's still to be filled.