Working from the speakers backwards

[Tahoe]

I'm looking to put together the best sounding 2.1 system I can for my living room, with a maximum budget of 10K.
The room is quite large, with vaulted ceilings, and I'll be listening from approximately 10' away. I'll primarily be using a streaming source such as Tidal.

I've been reading through the forum, and it looks like the best speaker in my budget is the Revel F208, conveniently on sale at the moment for $3850 a pair. Unfortunately, no retailer offers these in my area to listen to - I've enjoyed the KEF R11 and Paradigm Founder F100 in person, but I'm inclined to trust the data and go with the Revels after reading the forum. I already own a Klipsch 12" sub I intend to use, and I'd love to be able to build this into a linked multi-room system with basic speakers in a couple of other rooms, 2 of which already have Yamaha RXV-4A receivers. In the past I've had success with the Yamaha musiccast system so I was thinking of using a Yamaha WXC-50 as the streamer, but I'm open to alternative ways to link up rooms if a better system exists.

My major questions are:
What amp would you recommend to drive these speakers? I see the Benchmark AHB2 has some of the best measurements, but I worry power output would be insufficient.
Would the WXC-50 significantly impair my system, and if so, is there another streamer I should look at that offers some way to link multiple rooms? Would bypassing the yamaha DAC and running in a miniDSP Flex significantly improve my outcome?

Thank you all for your input; its been eye opening reading the massive trove of knowledge contained within this forum.

 

[Waxx]

Here in Europe the Audiophonics HPA-S400ET would be a good candidate, but i don't know how expensive it is to import that from France (EU) to the US. The Nord Three SE 1ET400A is very similar and from the UK (using the same basic receipe with Purif modules, Hypex PSU and custom low noise input stage). It may be cheaper to import, but you will have to check with US Customs on this. Both are measuring very well, and the difference with the AHB2 is not really relevant (as we don't hear it, it's below our treshhold).

For streamer The WXC50 is unknown to me, but if it got the functionality you want and you only use the digital out it should not matter much. Alternative is the Blue Node, that is great and not that expensive. But i use a minipc as streaming device myself, it's more flexible in use and often cheaper than most good streamers.

 

[restorer-john]

I've been reading through the forum, and it looks like the best speaker in my budget is the Revel F208, conveniently on sale at the moment for $3850 a pair. Unfortunately, no retailer offers these in my area to listen to

Don't even consider for a second spending $3850 on a pair of speakers without listening to them first. Find a dealer, drive to a dealer, or buy/borrow a pair on appro.

 

[fpitas]

My major questions are:
What amp would you recommend to drive these speakers? I see the Benchmark AHB2 has some of the best measurements, but I worry power output would be insufficient.

I'd look at one of the class D amps based on NCORE or Purifi modules. There are threads about them here.

 

[Digby]

Don't even consider for a second spending $3850 on a pair of speakers without listening to them first. Find a dealer, drive to a dealer, or buy/borrow a pair on appro.

This - speakers are the biggest determiner of sound, and you may not get along with a speaker, even if it is highly rated. You want to listen yourself before putting down money.

 

[Sokel]

How large is your room?
Listening distance at 10 f dictates some 60-70 cm² room at least if I get it right and the big height makes the volume even larger.
I think you will need bigger speakers.

 

[fpitas]

How large is your room?
Listening distance at 10 f dictates some 60-70 cm² room at least if I get it right and the big height makes the volume even larger.
I think you will need bigger speakers.

Bigger speakers, or add subwoofers.

 

[DJNX]

I would not worry about the DAC, specially if it already has the functionality you need.
As for the amp, maybe I missed it but you don’t mention if you already have one for the main system. You also need to tell us your average listening level, in SPL.

As for the speakers, I would trust the data too and make a blind buy, however the most important thing with big towers is that you can count on official repair service near you, otherwise it can become a nightmare. (Imagine paying for shipping in case of a factory fault in the speakers…or any other issue)

Also, maybe you should provide details about your room. Seems there is no concern on your part on room acoustics, as you don’t mention anything about buying acoustic treatments. I would use part of that budget to buy a measurement mic to at least get an idea of the RT60 of your room. State of the art electronics is no replacement for good acoustics.

Last question would be how much of a dedicated room is this? How much freedom do you have to move stuff around? Because I would start by getting your listening position closer to the speakers.

 

[Tahoe]

Don't even consider for a second spending $3850 on a pair of speakers without listening to them first. Find a dealer, drive to a dealer, or buy/borrow a pair on appro.

I haven't found any dealers in my region with these speakers, unfortunately. There's a large hifi shop a few hours away that demos Triangle, Dali, YG acoustics, monitor, dynaudio and ELAC gear, but they charge a several hundred dollar consultation fee and don't carry the Revel for comparison.
I found the speakers on Crutchfield so presumably I could return them, though with a hefty shipping fee.
Would I be better off picking from the in-person selection, in your view?

 

[Robert C]

Speaker Placement Calculator

noaudiophile.com

 

[JayGilb]

There's a large hifi shop a few hours away that demos Triangle, Dali, YG acoustics, monitor, dynaudio and ELAC gear, but they charge a several hundred dollar consultation fee and don't carry the Revel for comparison.

You don't have to use their consultation services. I can't imagine they wouldn't allow you to demo a few pairs of their speakers.

 

[Tahoe]

I would not worry about the DAC, specially if it already has the functionality you need.
As for the amp, maybe I missed it but you don’t mention if you already have one for the main system. You also need to tell us your average listening level, in SPL.

As for the speakers, I would trust the data too and make a blind buy, however the most important thing with big towers is that you can count on official repair service near you, otherwise it can become a nightmare. (Imagine paying for shipping in case of a factory fault in the speakers…or any other issue)

Also, maybe you should provide details about your room. Seems there is no concern on your part on room acoustics, as you don’t mention anything about buying acoustic treatments. I would use part of that budget to buy a measurement mic to at least get an idea of the RT60 of your room. State of the art electronics is no replacement for good acoustics.

Last question would be how much of a dedicated room is this? How much freedom do you have to move stuff around? Because I would start by getting your listening position closer to the speakers.

This system would be going into the main living room, so my ability to move furniture closer is limited. I'll measure out the room when Im home later today.

Part of my thinking with the minidsp was the dirac correction; I was planning to purchase a microphone with that. Not sure where to even start when it comes to acoustic correction.

 

[Tahoe]

You don't have to use their consultation services. I can't imagine they wouldn't allow you to demo a few pairs of their speakers.

Unfortunately, they don't demo anything without me agreeing to a consultation. Not a very friendly way of doing business, but the only other dealer in my area only carries Paradigm, Sonus Faber, and Wilson speakers - which is limiting, particularly when none rank too highly on this forum's testing and I cant afford anything Wilson makes.

 

[Andretti60]

Unfortunately, they don't demo anything without me agreeing to a consultation. Not a very friendly way of doing business, but the only other dealer in my area only carries Paradigm, Sonus Faber, and Wilson speakers - which is limiting, particularly when none rank too highly on this forum's testing and I cant afford anything Wilson makes.

It is normal nowadays, people use local stores to test components and then go buy them online, something that is completely unethical.
You need to test the speakers in “your” room, not even in the demo room of a store, adjusting their position, furnitures and the acoustic of the room. The demo room of a store is fine to compare different models, if the setup is correct (many times is not), but it does not tell you how that speakers will sound in another place.

If you are willing to spend that money, you can afford to pay for a consultation.

Either that, or be ready to buy online many models at the same, from stores that can accept returns. The problem with that is that if you have only one amp it will perform better with some of the speakers and worst with others, pairing speakers with amp is another big issue here.

 

[Waxx]

This - speakers are the biggest determiner of sound, and you may not get along with a speaker, even if it is highly rated. You want to listen yourself before putting down money.

In a lot of places, this is not possible. If you live in a big city or a dense populated region this is normal, but if you live a bit remote or in countries where the average living standard is lower than the US or EU, this is not possible at all.

Even in my country, i need to drive at least an hour before i see a shop with higher end equipment, and most stuff is only availeble online, often from other countries (especially the Netherlands or France) within the EU, not from local Belgian shops.

 

[617]

Consider Genelecs and other active options. My advice.

 

[fpitas]

In your position, I would choose the most likely speaker I could afford, then be prepared to EQ to my taste. Most good amps will tend to sound alike, but speakers definitely vary.

 

[NTK]

Unfortunately, they don't demo anything without me agreeing to a consultation. Not a very friendly way of doing business, but the only other dealer in my area only carries Paradigm, Sonus Faber, and Wilson speakers - which is limiting, particularly when none rank too highly on this forum's testing and I cant afford anything Wilson makes.

The value of auditioning at a dealer is overexaggerated. It is mostly useful to see if you like the look. Quoting Dr. Toole from this post:

https://www.avsforum.com/threads/how-to-choose-a-loudspeaker-what-the-science-shows.3038828/page-164#post-58262690

Listening to different speakers in different rooms at different times is a guessing game. You will have opinions, but you will never know what value they have.

 

[DanielT]

I already own a Klipsch 12" sub I intend to use,...

In any case, one thing is simple. Buy at least one more Klipsch 12" sub.

Edit:
Or rather, I would have done that anyway. If you can fit a few more subwoofers in your room then think about that solution.

Of the 302 who voted, 39.4% use two subwoofers or more:

Are you using a subwoofer/subwoofers?

I'm interested to see what percentage of users here use a subwoofer/subwoofers for audio playback. You can list reasons for doing so or not in your reply, along with mains used.

audiosciencereview.com

 

[DanielT]

If you are willing to spend that money, you can afford to pay for a consultation.

Do you mean for example:

Hire a professional acoustician

Hire a professional acoustician. Anyone done that? I can suspect that it is well-invested money regarding the hunt for good sound. Or what do you think? A professional acoustician who goes through the conditions in the listening room who gives tips and advice on how the room can be optimized...

audiosciencereview.com

Consider Genelecs and other active options. My advice.

It can absolutely be a good (maybe the best?) option.