With EQ, HD 600 or HD 650?

[Jose Hidalgo]

Ah, we all like some techno/dance stuff early in the morning, don't we?

 

[Robin L]

Ah, we all like some techno/dance stuff early in the morning, don't we?

Sure Do:

 

[Berwhale]

Sure Do:

Sounds great in the evening on my HD 660s with or without EQ

 

[L5730]

Picking through the DIYAudioHeaven (sorry to keep stealing your bandwidth @solderdude), I get the impression that after EQing HD660s and HD650 to the same target, there will be slightly less distortion around the midrange on 660s, but perhaps the nod the to the HD650 for smoother treble.

What is clear is that the differences would be subtle between 600, 650 and 660s, and without a level-matched AB comparison a walk between shops to compare the other model would relegate the differences to maybes.

On a personal note:
I might just pull the trigger on the HD660s on Amazon before they go back up... but I am Mr. indecisive.
My opinion of Sennheiser is a bit negative if only based on their European pricing of HD650 when the USA gets cheap HD6XX. R&D has been paid for, it'd be nice if they just reduced the price for all. Yes, yes, I understand how one doesn't reduce a price as it 'devalues' the product, but they have done that with a MassDrop partnership, so there's that. Just seems like taking Europeans for a ride because they can.
I have been very tempted by the HiFiMan Sundara, but the more I read the more I get the feeling that Sennheiser HD6-- series would be more my preference.

It'd be nice to find a shop with all three units and give 'em a like-for-like comparison. That ain't happening anytime this year though.

 

[Berwhale]

but I am Mr. indecisive.

Me too. I waited for a pair of HD660s to appear on the Sennhieser outlet, then I couldn't commit to buying them and they went. Then I had to wait another 4 or 5 months for them to appear on the outlet again. It was worth the wait though, I paid £270 for them. I've not seem them on the outlet since and 3 or 4 pairs of HD800s have been and gone in the interim.

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

I have been very tempted by the HiFiMan Sundara, but the more I read the more I get the feeling that Sennheiser HD6-- series would be more my preference.

Get both: a Sundara and a HD600 or a HD650 depending on the price (no need for a more expensive one). Best of both worlds.
As for HD600 vs 660S : https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/bcbz8g

 

[L5730]

Get both: a Sundara and a HD600 or a HD650 depending on the price (no need for a more expensive one). Best of both worlds.
As for HD600 vs 660S : https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/bcbz8g

Yeah, but when EQ'd - which so many people just don't seem to mention - that area around 2-5kHz could be boosted a smidge and the top end could possibly be curve-smoothed some (though not as smooth-plotting as HD600 seem to be). There are some dips at particular frequencies in the 660s HF plots, but how much of a real thing they are is questionable.
Also 120 ohm vs 300 ohm, I wonder if people's amp output impedance is making bigger sonics differences than would be with a 1 oh or less output impedance?
Everyone will hear headphones a bit differently due to head/ear shape and other factors.

I've read there are two HD660s versions, and last year they updated the physical look. Apparently everything else was the same in terms of sonics. Who knows.

Just for the sake of comparing UK prices:
£360 for HD660s
£310 for HD650
£270 for HD600 (documented less driver matching).
£170 for HD560s

We don't get a bargain price HD6XX here, else we'd have them or all have had them

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

1. Oratory has already done as much as can be done to the curves, probably better than all of us. That's why everybody trusts him, even Jaako. After EQ the HD600 is the closest to the ideal, more than the two others. It's a fact. All that with a very reasonable EQ gain of only -4.9 dB. That says a lot. Of course that ranking alone isn't enough, but if it's only to differentiate the three 6-- cans on the EQ side, then it's useful.
   
   
2. All Senn 6-- series cans were updated last year : cosmetics, packaging, and NO sound difference. That has been documented.
   
   
3. You can buy a HD6XX for 235$ including shipping to Europe. That's less than 180£, and definitely less than 200£ even including conversion rates. So if price is an issue there's no discussing at all. Apparently they're in stock right now.
   
   
4. If for some obscure reason you could hear a driver matching difference in your particular pair of HD600 (which you probably won't), you could easily exchange them, either in your shop or via Sennheiser. That's what warranty is for.

 

[L5730]

You can buy a HD6XX for 235$ including shipping to Europe. That's less than 180£, and definitely less than 200£ even including conversion rates. So if price is an issue there's no discussing at all. Apparently they're in stock right now.

One must factor in Import Duty and VAT and 'handling fee'
Comes in at around £250 (if calculations are correct). Makes more sense to buy local for £60 more and have an easier time with potential warranty issues. There is a chance the import charges may be missed, and then it's a bargain, but one has to expect to be charged.
I may be wrong and miscalculating, as I've also seen 0% duty and just 20% VAT (+ 'handling fee'), which would be closer to £230.

But anyway, the point of this topic wasn't so much about me and what I'm gonna do, but more of a general overview of the subtle or not audible differences between these models once frequency response has been ironed out.

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Bottom line : nobody has been able to really differentiate 600 and 650 after EQ, so you could just get whichever is the cheapest one in your country.
The 650 has slightly better bass extension and a warmer (but less neutral) sound, but that's out of the box, before EQ. After EQ they're both virtually indistinguishable. It's an endless discussion and you will never get a clear winner. It can't be done.
One more recent review that says pretty much the same as I just said :

 

[Patrick1958]

Bottom line : nobody has been able to really differentiate 600 and 650 after EQ, so you could just get whichever is the cheapest one in your country.
The 650 has slightly better bass extension and a warmer (but less neutral) sound, but that's out of the box, before EQ. After EQ they're both virtually indistinguishable. It's an endless discussion and you will never get a clear winner. It can't be done.
One more recent review that says pretty much the same as I just said :

I can !!! But then my HD 650 is one of the bottom tier, veiled, measured by Solderdude. Scroll to bottom. In essence the PEQ profile from Oratory doesn't work on my specimen, after eq it still sound way to dark, early roll off in bass. So both headphones EQ'ed with oratory's curve does not sound the same (to me)

 

[Robin L]

Drop 6XX here. I've got +/- 6db adjustment within the audible range, with very sharp cutoffs outside the audible range. There's a boost of 3db centered at 2300hz, spread from 1k to 4k, a cut of 1.5 db centered at 170 hz. The frequency extremes of 20hz and 20khz show up as +10 db on the display. The treble is lifted after 4khz, starting around 4khz, sloping up to 10db at 20khz, the bass starts sloping up around 70 hz, maxes out at 30 hz with a shelf at +10 db that falls right after 20 hz. Net result is that eq-ed, these headphones don't sound "dark", have extraordinarily clean, detailed treble and plenty of bass.