Willsenton R8

[Silgalias]

Plus 1 for Thofi reply.

I always went with solid state and enjoyed my Cyrus Mission 2 for many years.
But recently I decided to try a valve amp and after much research I decided on the Willsenton R8 with the basic KT88's . It seemed to be the best option without spending money I don't have.
I was not disappointed. It has made me enjoy the music again on a new level. I am really loving the 'tube' sound. I have even picked up a set of EL34's so I can try a different audio flavour.
Yes this can be done with EQ but the geek in me enjoys swapping out valves and listening for the difference.
But there is also a romanticism from sitting in a room with the lights low and seeing that tube glow.
I think the Willsenton R8 was a great buy.

 

[egellings]

For me, the allure of tube amps was the possibility of home brewing a pair of mono-blocks. Since tube circuitry is relatively simple and forgiving of minor errors, more so than semiconductor amps, chances of successfully building and ending up with a working amp are good.

 

[smgau]

I just pump it up because it pisses Rushton off as he gets no revenue from it. I love a good thread on SNA that runs 220 pages and he gets nothing out of it.

You seem to think I care We're doing alright, thanks for asking.

 

[raest]

You seem to think I care We're doing alright, thanks for asking.

you care enough to register on a forum for the sole purpose of replying that you do not care. apparently

quite a strange way to show the world how little you care...

as for the topic at hand: a tube amplifier is usually not hi-fi. it's actually lo-fi, no matter how "nice" you think it sounds. for a device to be "hi-fi" it needs to be, by definition, "high fidelity". a device that is consciously designed to inject artifacts no in the original recording is, again by definition, "low fidelity"

you like what you like, and don't let anyone get that away from you. but, as another user pointed out, you're wasting your money 'cause with a device like this you can only get "the tube sound" and nothing else. with a clean chain, with dsp, you can get whatever sound you want, whenever you want... while using less space, electricity and generating less electronic waste... and usually for less money

 

[egellings]

Tube amps, when properly designed, can be "hi-fi" quality. Many, like the so-called SET types are not, but that does not mean that all tube amps are "lo-fi". Of course, trying to get 0.001% THD will likely not happen with a tube amp (damned OPTs!), but the distortion figure does not need to be that good for hi-fi performance. 0.05%, well within reach of tube tech, will definitely get you so close to the definition of hi-fi that it doesn't matter if more zeros come to the right of the dismal [sic] point. As for preamps, it's easy to get excellent performance with tubes.

 

[raest]

i said "usually" and not "always"

besides, most people, i think, get tube (pre)amps for the tube sound, not because they can sound "hi-fi".

 

[Tasos1]

I wanted to try a tube integrated, so I purchased the R8 several weeks ago to replace a Primare integrated amp (which replaced a Rotel several years ago). I'm sure it measures far worse than those solid state amps, but it sounds extremely nice. There is body, dimensionality and presence in music that makes it sound far more real and engaging than my previous amps. It is also very impressively built, not far from the build quality of far more expensive amps. I did option for Gold Lion output KT88 tubes and the input tubes. The whole experience reminds me of my first serious integrated amp, the Naim Nait 2, which measured far worse than the Bryston amps of that era, but sounded way better. I remember dragging that amp into various hi-fi stores when I was looking to upgrade, and finding it very difficult to better the sound, particularly on more efficient loudspeakers.

 

[bplatypus]

Plus 1 for Thofi reply.

I always went with solid state and enjoyed my Cyrus Mission 2 for many years.
But recently I decided to try a valve amp and after much research I decided on the Willsenton R8 with the basic KT88's . It seemed to be the best option without spending money I don't have.
I was not disappointed. It has made me enjoy the music again on a new level. I am really loving the 'tube' sound. I have even picked up a set of EL34's so I can try a different audio flavour.
Yes this can be done with EQ but the geek in me enjoys swapping out valves and listening for the difference.
But there is also a romanticism from sitting in a room with the lights low and seeing that tube glow.
I think the Willsenton R8 was a great buy.

Hi! Did you try the EL34? Which one do you prefer?

I ordered the r8 with the el34 because I don’t want too much bass..,

 

[addiwei]

Hi! Did you try the EL34? Which one do you prefer?

I ordered the r8 with the el34 because I don’t want too much bass..,

My R8 came with the willsenton KT88 config. I love the sound so far.

Yes, there is bass but never in a bad or overwhelming way and maybe it's due to my electrostatic speaker combination. There are those that will attest the KT88 sounds better than EL34 so don't take it too seriously that EL34 is automatically better.

This is my first tube amp coming from SS. I will try my best to be as unbiased as possible. The SS amps were more neutral and had a colder presentation. The R8 presents a warmer sound in the midrange with bass I have never heard from my Martin Logans. The sound is extremely dynamic due to the ability of turning up the volume more without hurting my ears. I could make the claim I never really heard the capability of my system because my previous amps could only be listened at low to moderate volume. With the R8, you just want to crank it up. Of course this is subject to the type of SS so this back door can't be entirely closed to back up the causal claim for now.

In terms of looks / design, the R8 really drew me in. I was really close to buying a Yaqin years ago but the gold, silver and green color combination was just disgusting looking. The R8 in black looks like a vintage Nakamichi design, very masculine and badass looking.

Here is some info on main equipment:
Tidal Hifi -> Topping D90 MQA -> Audio Magic Excalibur II interconnect -> R8 -> Martin Logan SL3.

 

[Nicknack]

Wish someone would measure/confirm the performance of some of the OTL(output transformer less) 6C33 or 6080 based tube amps. I’ve seen some with low distortion over wide range(0.05 or less)upto rated output power and low output impedance of 0.1 to 0.3 Ohms. Bandwidths covering easily 10Hz to 100+kHz flat. Or for more conventional output transformer types measure the performance of say an upgraded/restored MC75/MC30 that were used in the navy sonar application back in the 50s. Here’s an example of one https://www.ebay.com/itm/265371867035?hash=item3dc965579b:g:SDIAAOSw5JJhcd9G
Or performance of one of the well designed transmitting tube 845/813/805/211/833 SET types with internal distortion cancellation and nearly no feedback (most commercial designs don’t have proper drive circuits)

 

[Nicknack]

By the way I found the willsenton R8 schematics online, took a quick look. The amp is a very conventional ultra linear design, no cathode feedback or McIntosh type unity feedback. Probably cost about 200 to 500 to DIY build the amp if using good “audiophile” (haha) resistors&capacitors and budget another max 500 to 1000 or for better output transformers from llundahl or iso-tango or Sowter types.

 

[cavedriver]

By the way I found the willsenton R8 schematics online, took a quick look. The amp is a very conventional ultra linear design, no cathode feedback or McIntosh type unity feedback. Probably cost about 200 to 500 to DIY build the amp if using good “audiophile” (haha) resistors&capacitors and budget another max 500 to 1000 or for better output transformers from llundahl or iso-tango or Sowter types.

sounds like you should publish some "hot rodding" instructions for the R8

 

[bkatbamna]

I love my Quicksilver Mid-Mono tube amps. I also have a yamaha M4 hooked up to my system and can switch. They sound more similar than different. The Quicksilvers though seem more 3-D though. One of the things that I like about them is that they are made in the US and you can email the guy who runs the company and he answers back.

 

[cavedriver]

I picked up one of these used to play around with. Seller had replaced the output tubes with PSVane KT88's and PSVane for the 6SL7 and 6SN7 tubes. First thing I notice is significant idle hiss. Louder than my recently rebuilt Scott 296 pentode tube amp. Not acceptable long term but for now I'm just using it as a reference against other tube amps I plan on testing out. At moderately high volumes the distortion was producing some listener fatigue. I could see using the first 10-20 W of power (approximately). I didn't measure the output I was using but through my 91 dB efficient Snell's I hit unacceptable distortion before I got to symphony concert volumes so chamber music, moderate rock volumes ok. Also played around with the ultralinear/triode switch and triode mode sounds more like simply turning up the bass and treble on an 80's equalizer than the magic I know from listening to straight up triode 300B amps. I'll try to remember to update my comments after testing more amps, but my short term assessment is "pleasant but no magic here".

 

[TrippRyder]

I picked up one of these used to play around with. Seller had replaced the output tubes with PSVane KT88's and PSVane for the 6SL7 and 6SN7 tubes. First thing I notice is significant idle hiss. Louder than my recently rebuilt Scott 296 pentode tube amp. Not acceptable long term but for now I'm just using it as a reference against other tube amps I plan on testing out. At moderately high volumes the distortion was producing some listener fatigue. I could see using the first 10-20 W of power (approximately). I didn't measure the output I was using but through my 91 dB efficient Snell's I hit unacceptable distortion before I got to symphony concert volumes so chamber music, moderate rock volumes ok. Also played around with the ultralinear/triode switch and triode mode sounds more like simply turning up the bass and treble on an 80's equalizer than the magic I know from listening to straight up triode 300B amps. I'll try to remember to update my comments after testing more amps, but my short term assessment is "pleasant but no magic here".

I dont own an R8, and havent even heard one, but if you have "significant idle hiss", then i would think maybe there is a problem with your amp? From many reviews ive read online, this amp is dead quiet.

A triode-tied pp pair of tetrodes\pentodes is never going to sound the same as a SET 300B.

Would you expect a PP transistor amp to sound the same as a SET transistor amp?

From your post, it seems youre expecting the impossible, and that from an amp that might not even be running correctly.

 

[cavedriver]

I dont own an R8, and havent even heard one, but if you have "significant idle hiss", then i would think maybe there is a problem with your amp? From many reviews ive read online, this amp is dead quiet.

A triode-tied pp pair of tetrodes\pentodes is never going to sound the same as a SET 300B.

Would you expect a PP transistor amp to sound the same as a SET transistor amp?

From your post, it seems youre expecting the impossible, and that from an amp that might not even be running correctly.

There's this thing people say about the culture at MIT and Harvard that was supposed to be just a funny anecdote when it was told to me but I keep running into the opposite of it on the internet. The anecdote was that the community up there has this weird trait that people in conversations just assume the other party knows what they are talking about and takes it as a starting point whenever conversing about something. You should try it some time. I'll update when I have something unequivocally insightful to share.

 

[TrippRyder]

There's this thing people say about the culture at MIT and Harvard that was supposed to be just a funny anecdote when it was told to me but I keep running into the opposite of it on the internet. The anecdote was that the community up there has this weird trait that people in conversations just assume the other party knows what they are talking about and takes it as a starting point whenever conversing about something. You should try it some time. I'll update when I have something unequivocally insightful to share.

Not sure if i quite understand your point. I think youre trying to say that i came across as saying you dont know what youre talking about?

Thats not what i said.

I said what i said. Your comment about hiss is uncommon based on the many reviews of this amp that i have read. It makes me wonder if there is something wrong with the amp.

In addition to that, many of the reviews were done using speakers that are far more efficient than your 91db Snells, so hiss should have been more readily apparent.

So, if there is something wrong with your amp, maybe thats why it doesnt sound as good as you were lead to believe it should?

Not trying to troll. Just pointing out a possibility.

 

[cavedriver]

Well, long story short, most of the amp's hiss is coming from a plasma TV whenever it is plugged in and connected via HDMI to the same old Onkyo receiver that analog music was being sourced through to the Willsenton's pre-in. Fascinating problem but of course annoying because I'd prefer not to take the Onkyo out of the signal path for the "everyday" room I was primarily testing it in. It's possible there are other sources of noise in my other room - this needs further investigation. Note that none of my A/B or D amps have complained when used in the same signal path. I am of course familiar with some of the noise vulnerability of tube amps having used a variety of headphone tube amps but this was something new to me. Now to check the other listening room for noise issues.

 

[ThoFi]

For Infos, measurements a.s.o. of the R8 have a look at the YT channel

 

[egellings]

Plus 1 for Thofi reply.

I always went with solid state and enjoyed my Cyrus Mission 2 for many years.
But recently I decided to try a valve amp and after much research I decided on the Willsenton R8 with the basic KT88's . It seemed to be the best option without spending money I don't have.
I was not disappointed. It has made me enjoy the music again on a new level. I am really loving the 'tube' sound. I have even picked up a set of EL34's so I can try a different audio flavour.
Yes this can be done with EQ but the geek in me enjoys swapping out valves and listening for the difference.
But there is also a romanticism from sitting in a room with the lights low and seeing that tube glow.
I think the Willsenton R8 was a great buy.

EQ-ing can correct frequency response errors but it will not remove distortion products.