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Will consumers buy the Dutch & Dutch 8C?

Frank Dernie

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But the ports are on the sides, not the front, and that makes a huge difference here. The distance between the mid driver and the ports is exploited to cancel energy that wraps around the cabinet, producing the cardioid pattern.
They are not reflex ports either, the speaker is closed box as far as bass loading is concerned. DSP bass control wouldn't work easily on a reflex loaded bass unit.
 
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Archsam

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I'm surprised to see many people considering this $10,000 speaker system not expensive?

I get that this is a system, combining speakers / amplifiers / DSP in one. The thing is most of us in the real world can't spend this sum of money in one go on this hobby, even if we wanted to?

My current system (DAC / disc player / amp / speakers / sub) is touching £8000, and it took 4 years to put together through incremental upgrades from my old £1000 system. Financially I don't think i will feel comfortable dropping $10k on a nearly complete system (just add DAC / preamp).

Don't get me wrong, I will love to give an active speaker system a try, just not at that price point. When I daydreamed about an active speaker system I ended up wanting a pair of Focal Trio6 Be, which is under £4000.
 

Frank Dernie

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I'm surprised to see many people considering this $10,000 speaker system not expensive?

I get that this is a system, combining speakers / amplifiers / DSP in one. The thing is most of us in the real world can't spend this sum of money in one go on this hobby, even if we wanted to?

My current system (DAC / disc player / amp / speakers / sub) is touching £8000, and it took 4 years to put together through incremental upgrades from my old £1000 system. Financially I don't think i will feel comfortable dropping $10k on a nearly complete system (just add DAC / preamp).

Don't get me wrong, I will love to give an active speaker system a try, just not at that price point. When I daydreamed about an active speaker system I ended up wanting a pair of Focal Trio6 Be, which is under £4000.
One gets more prosperous as one ages, usually, but IME the biggest barrier to affording one piece of exceptional kit is the temptation to buy lots of less expensive kit in bursts of enthusiasm rather than saving up carefully.
Don't ask me how I know.
 

Purité Audio

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I'm surprised to see many people considering this $10,000 speaker system not expensive?

I get that this is a system, combining speakers / amplifiers / DSP in one. The thing is most of us in the real world can't spend this sum of money in one go on this hobby, even if we wanted to?

My current system (DAC / disc player / amp / speakers / sub) is touching £8000, and it took 4 years to put together through incremental upgrades from my old £1000 system. Financially I don't think i will feel comfortable dropping $10k on a nearly complete system (just add DAC / preamp).

Don't get me wrong, I will love to give an active speaker system a try, just not at that price point. When I daydreamed about an active speaker system I ended up wanting a pair of Focal Trio6 Be, which is under £4000.
DACs/adcs and volume attenuation are built in, ultimately you have to decide whether you want the best sound quality or not, if you enjoy the ‘hobby’ aspect of audio then something like the 8Cs may not be right for you.
Keith
 

fredoamigo

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I'm surprised to see many people considering this $10,000 speaker system not expensive?

I get that this is a system, combining speakers / amplifiers / DSP in one. The thing is most of us in the real world can't spend this sum of money in one go on this hobby, even if we wanted to?

the price/quality ratio is sometimes subjective, but here I don't think so.

besides the fact that you don't need to buy other accessories, here you won't really need a subwoofer or to twist your brain for the development of your installation it's an injustice to those who have learned patiently and who know how to do it .................all of this comes at a price.
 

Archsam

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DACs/adcs and volume attenuation are built in, ultimately you have to decide whether you want the best sound quality or not, if you enjoy the ‘hobby’ aspect of audio then something like the 8Cs may not be right for you.
Keith

Completely agreed. I lust over lots of high end gears and I will love to try the latest advancement in DSP / room correction, etc. But $10k is $10k, it just isn't going to happen for many of us. Not all of us are constantly chasing new gears either - in the last 20 years I have only gone through 2 systems. First system was my second hand Ebay job that costed £1000 total, the second is my current system.

Edit: Fun fact - the Benchmark DAC1 under my 'retired' gear list was actually gifted to me by my old boss. I recommanded it to him way back in 2004 when it first came out, and 4 years ago he decided to give it to me when he upgraded to a high end DAC / streamer combo.

The question this thread asked is 'will consumer buy the Dutch & Dutch 8C', all I am trying to say that for those of us with a normal job and a mortgage, plus future plans on home renovations and a wedding, the answer is very likely no.

Maybe one day I will ascent to the level where I think $10,000 is not a big deal. But until then I will aspire to only what I can comfortably afford.

Edit: I am not against the D&D system at all. They seem to be really good quality gear and I will love to give them a try one day. The point is simply that it is a lot of money for many of us.
 
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ttimer

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But $10k is $10k, it just isn't going to happen for many of us. Not all of us are constantly chasing new gears either - in the last 20 years I have only gone through 2 systems.

There is a vast difference between "10k for a system that (depending on your age) might last for the rest of your life" and "10k for a consumable item like a car that will need to be replaced regularly with each replacement costing another 10k. "

Which one is the D&D?
 

Archsam

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There is a vast difference between "10k for a system that (depending on your age) might last for the rest of your life" and "10k for a consumable item like a car that will need to be replaced regularly with each replacement costing another 10k. "

Which one is the D&D?

It pains to say this, but a hifi system is not a necessity in life. It's a luxury item that none of us really 'need' (unless you are a audio professional who makes a living using audio gears). So it doesn't really fall into category A or B in my view.
 

Purité Audio

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This must be our fourth or fifth year with D&D, we had a cracked enclosure, which D&D replaced at once, a chap dropped one of his D&D replaced both rear drivers foc, but otherwise I can’t think of any other failures , oh a batch of led cables had an intermittent fault that’s it.
Keith
 

balletboy

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I'm surprised to see many people considering this $10,000 speaker system not expensive?

I get that this is a system, combining speakers / amplifiers / DSP in one. The thing is most of us in the real world can't spend this sum of money in one go on this hobby, even if we wanted to?

My current system (DAC / disc player / amp / speakers / sub) is touching £8000, and it took 4 years to put together through incremental upgrades from my old £1000 system. Financially I don't think i will feel comfortable dropping $10k on a nearly complete system (just add DAC / preamp).

Don't get me wrong, I will love to give an active speaker system a try, just not at that price point. When I daydreamed about an active speaker system I ended up wanting a pair of Focal Trio6 Be, which is under £4000.

This site goes on about the Benchmark ABH2 amplifier, but a pair of those (for decent power) costs $6,000 / £7,000 (i.e. $9,000 in the UK), and you still need source components and speakers, which starts making the Dutch & Dutch 8c look good value for money.

Using either an all-in-one system and passive speakers or a complete active system like 8c is generally overall cheaper (both my systems are speakers and an all-in-one) and removes the temptation to consider any change. They can easily be an end-game solution. The only change I've made in 5 years is to add a Roon server.

Consumer attitudes vary in different countries. For example, Germans tend to be averse to credit and only buy with free cash, whereas in the USA credit purchases for luxury items are almost standard. There was an article on CNN showing Americans in a food-bank line in expensive Mercedes that are likely to be repossessed very soon. The amount of credit in the UK is less, but may people live pay check to pay check.

I once refused to sell an amplifier to someone because he said he had to borrow money for it and he indicated it would be a struggle. I refused to live with the guilt.

People also have different concepts of status. Many Germans rent property long-term, but cars have high status value. In the UK housing is mostly owned and high status, cars much less so.

I can afford an expensive car, but drive a very cheap one, because it has no status value for me. My wife's car cost me three times as much. My audio system cost slightly more than my car, but I get a lot more pleasure from my audio system. We spend about that amount of money on live performance each year, because that is our main spending priority and gives us a huge amount of pleasure. As @Frank Dernie said, it is an age thing. I went to around 200 shows a year when I was a student, but got last minute tickets for £2 or sat behind a pillar at the opera with little or no view for £5. I still got to hear, if not see, the world's greatest performers. The Proms used to cost £1 to stand in the balcony at the RAH. In those days I did not lust after top price tickets, just as I didn't lust after audio I couldn't afford, but it's nice to enjoy when eventually you can.
 

FrantzM

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Hi

Trying to be short: The 8C is one of the best measuring speaker system around, is a ROON -compatible complete system with DAC amps, etc .It integrates well with normal environments , producing accurate in-room full range performance. For $10,000.
I would not call it this a bargain but would call it the answer to the dream of most audiophiles.
 

balletboy

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Hi

Trying to be short: The 8C is one of the best measuring speaker system around, is a ROON -compatible complete system with DAC amps, etc .It integrates well with normal environments , producing accurate in-room full range performance. For $10,000.
I would not call it this a bargain but would call it the answer to the dream of most audiophiles.

I would consider it is an answer for most people who just like listening to music. I'm not sure what being an audiophile has to do with it. I have no doubt that if she 8C was sold in the better department stores (Harrods, Selfridges in London for example, take your pick elsewhere), which may be the case, I don't know, it would do very well.

The only issue would be that you would have to explain to these "lifestyle" customers why they need to pay for subscriptions to Roon, Qobuz or Tidal when they have been perfectly happy with Spotify. For what it's worth, half the time my system is used with Spotify by my wife and kids.
 

Kundroc

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I would not call it this a bargain but would call it the answer to the dream of most audiophiles.
It's a very modern approach to satisfy the expectations of audiophiles, where simplicity if favored over complexity of the equipment. In the extreme, a tablet and speakers will suffice to enjoy the same features as a rack full of gear and still have the same level of performance.
 

Sal1950

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One gets more prosperous as one age
And suffers more from the accrued and accursed brain damage, the repercussions of a mis-spent youth.
Examplified by me spending just under $10 on my JBL's, forcing me to remove "The Audio Cheapskate" from my signature. LOL
 

Sal1950

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There is a vast difference between "10k for a system that (depending on your age) might last for the rest of your life" and "10k for a consumable item like a car that will need to be replaced regularly with each replacement costing another 10k. "
When was the last time you bought a new car for $10k? LOL
 

Lorenzo74

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I'm surprised to see many people considering this $10,000 speaker system not expensive?
Don't get me wrong, I will love to give an active speaker system a try, just not at that price point. When I daydreamed about an active speaker system I ended up wanting a pair of Focal Trio6 Be, which is under £4000.


try ELAC NAVIS ARF-51
maybe better than what you might guess.
My Best
L.
 

phoenixdogfan

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Even though I love the concept of DSP controlled active speakers, I am disappointed by the lack of available multichannel preamps with digital outputs (apart from some really expensive ones) to control them in multichannel/home theater setups, without the extra A to D/D to A conversion.

What about the Octo 8 which has an AES/EBU output? Does it do an extra A to D/D to A conversion?
 

Dimifoot

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What about the Octo 8 which has an AES/EBU output? Does it do an extra A to D/D to A conversion?
I believe the Okto doesn’t offer multichannel digital out.
 
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