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Why not review some Hegel amps?

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BikeSmith60

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You better stay away from most tube amps, too, then.

Wut? Why? Tell that to my Jadis and Audio Research power and preamps... which happen to be setup in rooms that require no tweaking, thanks anyway. However, and typically as well, the SS amps present more opportunities to require or atleast wish for a minimum of tone control and most certainly balance. I'm also happy to have balance control on my tube preamps as would any minimally experienced tube amp owner.
 

BikeSmith60

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Who is Brent Holter?

And, no, I didn't know that and have never heard of the guy.

Correct spelling is BENT HOLTER. He is the founder/head honcho and designer at Hegel. He's done a remarkable job as his products are indeed quite successful. They just aren't for me however.
 

watchnerd

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Wut? Why? Tell that to my Jadis and Audio Research power and preamps... which happen to be setup in rooms that require no tweaking, thanks anyway. However, and typically as well, the SS amps present more opportunities to require or atleast wish for a minimum of tone control and most certainly balance. I'm also happy to have balance control on my tube preamps as would any minimally experienced tube amp owner.

2 examples != most.

Try finding EQ or tone controls on the vast array of Chinese-made tube amps.

Even the higher end ones from Cayin and Line Magnetic typically don't have such features.

Nor do Prima Luna (Cayin factory), Allnic, or Conrad Johnson.
 

watchnerd

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Correct spelling is BENT HOLTER. He is the founder/head honcho and designer at Hegel. He's done a remarkable job as his products are indeed quite successful. They just aren't for me however.

Thanks.

I've still never heard of him nor had any idea of his relationship to Consonance.
 

direstraitsfan98

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2 examples != most.

Try finding EQ or tone controls on the vast array of Chinese-made tube amps.

Even the higher end ones from Cayin and Line Magnetic typically don't have such features.

Nor do Prima Luna (Cayin factory), Allnic, or Conrad Johnson.
Allnic is Korean made and Conrad Johnson is American made.
 

carlob

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Sorry for the typo. As already said Bent Holter is Hegel founder and chief designer.
 

DSJR

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So can we assume that some Consonace amps (A100?) are cheap knock-offs of Hegel then? (I'm playing devil's advocate as many in this thread accuse(d) Hegel of being the knock-off.

I daren't comment on nice looking geometric accuracy in the way an amp is laid out compared to a possible shorter signal path along what seems to be thin circuit tracks in both cases (plugs and sockets in the Accuphase pictured earlier too), but the main thing is reliability and stability over decades (hopefully) and maybe in the case of expensive gear, serviceability too when things eventually age too far.
 

watchnerd

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So can we assume that some Consonace amps (A100?) are cheap knock-offs of Hegel then? (I'm playing devil's advocate as many in this thread accuse(d) Hegel of being the knock-off.

I daren't comment on nice looking geometric accuracy in the way an amp is laid out compared to a possible shorter signal path along what seems to be thin circuit tracks in both cases (plugs and sockets in the Accuphase pictured earlier too), but the main thing is reliability and stability over decades (hopefully) and maybe in the case of expensive gear, serviceability too when things eventually age too far.

Is it a knock off or a clone?
 

DSJR

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Is it a knock off or a clone?

Don't know - and they may be totally different internally for all I know :) Anyway, I mean neither any ill and know and like the way the Hegel works and 'feels,' the simplicity, performance and cost fitting in well with a moderately comfortably off music lover buying nice speakers in the £4k (US $7k) region. Different people to forum watchers and posters and apparently most don't even know forums exist for audio gear and probably care even less frankly.
 

watchnerd

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like the way the Hegel works and 'feels,' the simplicity, performance and cost

Once you get to a basic level of competence in an amp, how it makes you feel, its usability, its features, its reliability, and how much you like the aesthetics is all that really matters....at whatever price point doesn't give you buyer's remorse and/or make you feel like you didn't treat yourself a little.

ASR members get a little too wrapped up in chasing SINAD porn sometimes.
 

orangejello

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No, we are just assuming (reasonably) because the cases and functionality are the same. For Chinese made gear, I like the Chinese designs and brands better anyway, so that is what I would do. We know how much talent there is in China.

Why involve a Western firm at all if they can't even make things themselves?

Why would they make the Western market version better?

I know there are possible reasons, but personally, I would rather just get a 120V version of something initially designed for the Asian markets.
Yup. My thinking as well. “Designed in the USA” means nothing to me when it comes to electronics. The Chinese sent a spacecraft to the moon and returned it. They have all of the talent they need to deliver competent audio product. Hey but we sure do make great speaker cables and interconnects. Pretty sure we are unsurpassed in our ability to deliver snake oil.

That said I definitely have major respect for the Class D stuff coming from Europe. That takes serious EE and math chops to design.
 

amper42

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OPERA-Figaro-32bit-DSD-DAC-DigitalPlayer-USB-network-HD-HIFI-audio-player-Stereo-1.jpg

MohicanFront.jpg



operac13.jpg

517hegel.bac.jpg


I would also show you how similar the amps look but it appears they've recently removed them from the Opera Audio website. But the H190 was basically a clone of the Opera Audio amp.

Not sure where you got that Hegel image but it doesn't look anything like my Hegel H90. I use the USB input connected to a MacBook Pro. I don't use the other four inputs much. The sound and power handling is amazing for an integrated amp rated at only 60W. It offers a quality all in one system setup for streaming from my computer. I tried other setups but the sound quality keeps drawing me back to my Hegel H90. Obviously, this is just my personal experience. Everyone has their own favorite.

H90Back.jpg
 

DSJR

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Once you get to a basic level of competence in an amp, how it makes you feel, its usability, its features, its reliability, and how much you like the aesthetics is all that really matters....at whatever price point doesn't give you buyer's remorse and/or make you feel like you didn't treat yourself a little.

ASR members get a little too wrapped up in chasing SINAD porn sometimes.


I wouldn't disagree at all with those sentiments. Thing is, I still tend to 'listen with my eyes' over a certain price point, I do still have the remnants of 'gear lust' when I see a top Luxman amp (my vibes on Accuphase are mixed as it seems the bench performance is merely competent rather than excellent and probably worse than the sensible Yamaha integrateds and now discontinued class A-B pro amps that seemed to measure really well under a grand)). I look lovingly at a new big Luxman but don't lust after it as I know how much has gone into the casework engineering. I do feel that getting top cases outside of the far east may well be expensive (it certainly is for UK makers) and in the past, our audio manufacturers had a terrible time finding good cost effective ways of clothing their designs (Meridian managed though in their heyday but spoiled it with constant 'subjective' design twiddling internally, at least with their CD players back then - from 200 to 500 model ranges definitely)

An old friend and dealer just told me he's had occasional contact with Bent from Hegel and seems to feel Hegel came first before any design work for others. Second hand info so please take it as such.

I think this place is wonderful for tests and discussions on state of the art less expensive (bargain priced) gear bought by a 'head' rather than a 'heart' consideration. Not sure the audiophile (mostly audiophool sadly) community has even begun to acknowledge, let alone change, their eye-fi perspectives yet. Best we can do is smile quietly to ourselves while the audiophile fraternity chases its collective tail trying to find audio nirvana which they'll never find no matter how much money they spend...
 
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ENG

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I own Hegel H390, H190 and H80 and I want Amir to measure them. But I can't afford to send them to USA, they are pretty heavy. Isn't there some members in NW USA who can drop a Hegel to Amir ?
 

Geert

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Thing is, I still tend to 'listen with my eyes' over a certain price point
Nothing wrong with that I think, otherwise we would all drive a Toyota.

I do feel that getting top cases outside of the far east may well be expensive (it certainly is for UK makers) and in the past, our audio manufacturers had a terrible time finding good cost effective ways of clothing their designs
Somehow 'Atoll' manages to pull it off (at least to a certain point). 100% build in France, build like a tank, sounds perfect, close to half the price of a Hegel. (DAC included, however doesn't provide streaming).

So with Hegel it looks like you pay a lot for their (SoundEngine) technology. Last week I noticed the new Creek integrated amp is also top dollar now. According to them it's also state of the art technology, which also comes in a pretty basic package:
voyage-i20-inside-angle__large_full.jpg

Source: https://www.stereonet.co.uk/reviews/creek-audio-voyage-i20-integrated-amplifier-review

It would be nice to know if those technologies deliver.
 

DSJR

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I wonder if Mike Creek designed that? Some of these new designs are incredibly 'busy' to me.
 
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