Why is the wall behind our speakers so often called the rear wall?

[MattHooper]

It still stuns me when I hear a fellow American tell me that the wall behind the seating area is the back wall. I always answer: "Not to the speakers. The rear wall to them is the rear wall that matters the most. As far as they are concerned, the wall behind our listening are is their front wall. If you want to improve your sound, that is a concept that you will need to understand. All walls are as referenced from the front stereo or stereo & center speaker positions".
Some apparently made it through life not understanding basic geometry, however...
They also (more often than not) seem to be people that you are not comfortable with when you are a passenger in their car.

If you walk into a room and sit down, it is natural to see it oriented in terms of your own perspective.

There’s a wall in front of you. There are walls to the sides of you. There’s a wall behind you to your rear.

When I walk into a room with a pair of loudspeakers, I don’t suddenly take the view of the loudspeakers. I still take the view that feels natural which is of my own listening perspective.

I also don’t find terming the wall behind the loudspeakers as the “rear wall” aids my understanding of the sonic relationship between the two. I’m quite aware of how placement near that front wall can affect the sound.

Also, as I mentioned, my room also has a surround system, and it would be very odd for me to refer to the speakers behind me properly as the rear surround speakers, and for some reason refer to the speakers in front of me flanking the screen as being on the rear wall as well.

Considering the wall in front of me being the front wall and the wall behind me being the rear wall maintains a natural consistency, and how I describe the placement of the loudspeakers whether it’s surround sound or stereo.

I certainly understand why other people have termed it the rear wall. Perfectly fine.
I’m just pointing out why that feels less natural for me (and many others I guess).

 

[EJ3]

If I turn my sub 180 degrees to face the wall instead of the listening position, then the front wall transforms into the rear wall. OMG, with a downward firing sub, the floor becomes the front wall.
Or perhaps the wall description should be referencing the listener orientation...

obviously some people are trying to change it to that, although it was the standard since the inception of speakers that were not using the wall as sides like Klipschehorns.
Why change a standard just because some numb nuts (yes, that IS what I meant) are trying to start a trend of thinking like them, when they have shown:
that they do not even bother to find out the standards of what they are talking about to begin with.

 

[EJ3]

If you walk into a room and sit down, it is natural to see it oriented in terms of your own perspective.

There’s a wall in front of you. There are walls to the sides of you. There’s a wall behind you to your rear.

When I walk into a room with a pair of loudspeakers, I don’t suddenly take the view of the loudspeakers. I still take the view that feels natural which is of my own listening perspective.

I also don’t find terming the wall behind the loudspeakers as the “rear wall” aids my understanding of the sonic relationship between the two. I’m quite aware of how placement near that front wall can affect the sound.

Also, as I mentioned, my room also has a surround system, and it would be very odd for me to refer to the speakers behind me properly as the rear surround speakers, and for some reason refer to the speakers in front of me flanking the screen as being on the rear wall as well.

Considering the wall in front of me being the front wall and the wall behind me being the rear wall maintains a natural consistency, and how I describe the placement of the loudspeakers whether it’s surround sound or stereo.

I certainly understand why other people have termed it the rear wall. Perfectly fine.
I’m just pointing out why that feels less natural for me (and many others I guess).

I just look at it as a standard so that everyone knows what they are talking about. Sort of like, if you are using Morse code to communicate, those that are using it need t be using the standard.
There are lots of things in life that are part of some type of engineering that it helps others understand you if you use the standard terminology.
Maybe I just adapt too easily: I switch from German to English & back during group conversation that uses both languages without losing a split second.
I can sit & talk about the décor of the back wall behind me with my wife how it affects the relictions involving the back wall of my speakers that are 10 feet in front of me in the same sentence.
Could I use trig. to phase an array of 5 antennas to a certain directionality these days? Nope, I don't even remember the terminology that I needed in order to do that, when I did in 1975.
Ask me anything about how that is was done by me back then & what comes out out of my mouth is about as useful as the musings of a person that has severe dementia.

 

[EJ3]

obviously some people are trying to change it to that, although it was the standard since the inception of speakers that were not using the wall as sides like Klipschehorns.
Why change a standard just because some numb nuts (yes, that IS what I meant) are trying to start a trend of thinking like them, when they have shown:
that they do not even bother to find out the standards of what they are talking about to begin with.

Please note, I am not talking about folks that naturally feel a little obscure, obtuse or out of place when their perspective is from sitting in the listening position. I'm talking about those that started he trend toward obfuscating the norm standard that was understood by most in the past.

 

[-Matt-]

For those who prefer to rigidly stick to the listener frame of reference, where the wall behind the front speakers is the front wall...

It would follow that the front baffle (of the front speaker) is the one nearest the front wall. I.e. You would call the panel which usually has speaker terminals and perhaps ports, the front baffle?

...And the speaker panel nearest to the listener, where the tweeters and most of the other drivers are mounted, you would term this the rear baffle?

 

[EJ3]

For those who prefer to rigidly stick to the listener frame of reference, where the wall behind the front speakers is the front wall...

It would follow that the front baffle (of the front speaker) is the one nearest the front wall. I.e. You would call the panel which usually has speaker terminals and perhaps ports, the front baffle?

...And the speaker panel nearest to the listener, where the tweeters and most of the other drivers are mounted, you would term this the rear baffle?

The terminal side (perhaps with ports is to the rear of the speaker, just as the rear wall is). The front baffle (of the front of the speaker) is facing the front wall, wich is behing where one is sitting, standing, making love or whatever. Yes, that is correct.
Just as when you are sitting in the bed of a pickup truck, with your back up against the front of the pickup truck bed & simultaneously the upper part of your back and your head are against the pickup trucks rear window, you would be facing rearward & looking toward the rear of the pickup truck bed, while the front of the truck is behind you.
Why you are sitting like this in the bed of my truck, I have no idea.
The audio from the not so great Bose system that emits from inside of the truck. Perhaps you should join me in the comfort of the trucks touring package in the cab & we can just listen to some music, go for a drive to a nice place to eat (in my case, get away from my wife (who, doesn't like music [that's the only true negative thing that I can say about her, but that is a tough one to live with]) and talk some audio.
And let the walls be wherever it is that the walls are.

 

[AdrianusG]

Probably because it's the wall that faces the rear of the speakers right?
the Drivers (in most cases anyways) are facing "the open room" , directed towards the listener.

 

[Alannn]

For those who prefer to rigidly stick to the listener frame of reference, where the wall behind the front speakers is the front wall...

It would follow that the front baffle (of the front speaker) is the one nearest the front wall. I.e. You would call the panel which usually has speaker terminals and perhaps ports, the front baffle?

...And the speaker panel nearest to the listener, where the tweeters and most of the other drivers are mounted, you would term this the rear baffle?

You are correct that the listener frame of reference to determine front wall is a flawed idea. If the listener turns 180 degrees that should not change which wall is the front wall, and should only change which wall is in front of the listener.

But,
"Front" and "in front" are different concepts. And "at the front" has a slightly different meaning than "in front." The front wall is not in front of the front speakers. Is that difficult for you?

It's actually all about the orientation of the sound field, btw.

The source of the sound field is at the front by definition. The wall behind the source is also at the front. Straight out from where the sound field is mostly directed is the rear.

 

[MAB]

"Why is the wall behind our speakers so often called the rear wall?" It seems like it is called that 50% of the time these days, in a random way, since people don't read literature despite posting strong opinions.

There is a convention. For instance read one of Floyd Toole's books, or go get some AES papers that discuss speakers in rooms and it becomes quickly apparent that people already thought through this since before most of us were on the scene.
Even better, those same people tend to follow good scientific writing practices and define the term on first usage in an article, then consistently use it for the rest of the text.

For example, Floyd Toole's book, I scanned a page, I hope that doesn't infringe, but instead spurs people to go out and read and learn:

For venues and rooms:
Front Wall - Behind the speakers
Back Wall - Behind the listener

The idea of going to a trusted source is lost here. Rather anecdote and appeals to reason rule the day. Fortunately audiophiles getting terminology for back and front mixed up is completely inconsequential, even if a bit confusing.

 

[EJ3]

Probably because it's the wall that faces the rear of the speakers right?
the Drivers (in most cases anyways) are facing "the open room" , directed towards the listener.

Correct!

 

[kyuu]

"Why is the wall behind our speakers so often called the rear wall?" It seems like it is called that 50% of the time these days, in a random way, since people don't read literature despite posting strong opinions.

There is a convention. For instance read one of Floyd Toole's books, or go get some AES papers that discuss speakers in rooms and it becomes quickly apparent that people already thought through this since before most of us were on the scene.
Even better, those same people tend to follow good scientific writing practices and define the term on first usage in an article, then consistently use it for the rest of the text.

For example, Floyd Toole's book, I scanned a page, I hope that doesn't infringe, but instead spurs people to go out and read and learn:

View attachment 473811

For venues and rooms:
Front Wall - Behind the speakers
Back Wall - Behind the listener

The idea of going to a trusted source is lost here. Rather anecdote and appeals to reason rule the day. Fortunately audiophiles getting terminology for back and front mixed up is completely inconsequential, even if a bit confusing.

While Toole is obviously a trusted source, I'm not sure that's showing an established convention. If it was, it doesn't seem like Toole would have had to define the term immediately after using it. The important part here seems to be providing clarity by defining the term since it can be ambiguous, as he did.

 

[MAB]

While Toole is obviously a trusted source, I'm not sure that's showing an established convention. If it was, it doesn't seem like Toole would have had to define the term immediately after using it. The important part here seems to be providing clarity by defining the term since it can be ambiguous, as he did.

I didn’t attach dozens of AES papers I have read using the same terminology. They are behind a paywall. It is a bit of a convention. While it might be interesting to discuss exceptions, but they are just that, exceptions.

Toole does follow another convention: introduce terms and acronyms with the generally accepted definition on first use. He does this throughout his book for many common terms and acronyms. It’s good scientific writing. That clip is first-use in his book.

 

[ErVikingo]

Tomato/Tomato ? Pants/pants? (the brits will understand)...

Rear wall of the stage to those focused in the sound stage we try to recreate at home

a fellow listener says "there is no rear wall when i use my headphones; i'm in the middle of the stage"

 

[EJ3]

"Why is the wall behind our speakers so often called the rear wall?" It seems like it is called that 50% of the time these days, in a random way, since people don't read literature despite posting strong opinions.

There is a convention. For instance read one of Floyd Toole's books, or go get some AES papers that discuss speakers in rooms and it becomes quickly apparent that people already thought through this since before most of us were on the scene.
Even better, those same people tend to follow good scientific writing practices and define the term on first usage in an article, then consistently use it for the rest of the text.

For example, Floyd Toole's book, I scanned a page, I hope that doesn't infringe, but instead spurs people to go out and read and learn:

View attachment 473811

For venues and rooms:
Front Wall - Behind the speakers
Back Wall - Behind the listener

The idea of going to a trusted source is lost here. Rather anecdote and appeals to reason rule the day. Fortunately audiophiles getting terminology for back and front mixed up is completely inconsequential, even if a bit confusing.

Well, then either it has changed (or all the people in the Audio/Video clubs in the early 1970's that were my mentors) were simply wrong.
But most were professionals in the field (working at TV, Radio, recording studios, the local Symphony, Community bands, and owning, operating & setting wealthy peoples homes up with audio/video & screening rooms. Because the ones owning the main stereo store (Read Brothers Stereo) were very wealthy & very low key, not pushy, not flashy and did things like sponsor the local symphony, community band, theatre productions, etc. So they were connected to the types of folks that could easily afford things like the Advent Projection screen TV's, etc. Unfortunately, those types of stores are gone from this area now.
All audio/video at that time (1971-1979) [at least with the people that I was involved with]: was referenced from the speaker's & television screen's projecting direction.