Why Is Hi-Fi Gear So Darn Expensive?!

[anmpr1]

-- but the current crop of luxury goods are aimed at least an order of magnitude (and frequently two) higher than even boomers' aspirations. An "average" boomer might spring for a Corvette -- but not a Veyron.

I have no problems with 'luxury' goods. Sure, in many cases its a 'feeling' thing. Feelings are important. If a Chanel bag makes my wife happy, that's fine with me. She's important to me and we need more happiness around the house. But one has to understand limits. Rolex doesn't claim their watch will give time better time than Timex. You buy the former for fit and finish, and exclusivity.

That said, anyone who can afford a Bugatti knows that they have one of the fastest cars on the planet. That is not negotiable, or arguable. Not that they will ever use its capability. But it is there, if needed. In that specific case, you get what you pay for.

What is idiotic are those who say that an Accuphase (or whatever) 'sounds' better than a _____ (fill in the blank). I'm sure an Accuphase would make me feel all right. Why wouldn't it? Built to high standards by skilled craftsmen. Nice to look at, for sure. Pride of ownership and all that. But I'm not going to kid myself that it will sound better than what I already have. And I certainly wouldn't advise anyone that it is 'better' than something much cheaper, from a sonic standpoint.

One must mediate and balance these matters. But one mustn't ever let the heart overbalance the head, or the hands. Fritz didn't exactly have it right...

 

[Old Listener]

The What's Best Forum is home territory for high-end audio subjectivists. I found this thread to be quite surprising in its frank discussion of some of the problems with the industry:

State of the industry - Roy Gregory Editorial

The thread starts with a link to this substantive blog post on another site:

Is There A Glass Ceiling Operating In Audio?

Of course, the posts are mostly (if not all) from subjectivists but it is interesting to see open acknowledgement of the conflicts of interest in the industry.

 

[JeffS7444]

Ultra high-end exists because ultra-moneyed people get bored too.

A $25 teakettle needs to boil water, whistle, be dependable, and look appealing. A $900 kettle mostly needs to be beautiful.

The cost of a tangible function tends to be apparent in a market economy. A $10 Casio watch, for example, is almost purely functional, thereby establishing that telling time has a utility value of perhaps $9. A Patek Phillippe watch can cost you $80,000, suggesting that almost all of it's value is sign value -- the status it grants it's wearer. Prestige, being an abstract quality, lacks a clear price standard.

- 101 Things I Learned in Product Design School
Sung Jang and Martin Thaler with Matthew Frederick.

 

[NormB]

I live in a oil rich region. I can see a major petroleum refinery from my window and we still pay full rate world prices on the stuff. Some peeps are very annoyed at that.

That pic you posted really epitomizes the era with the multiple signs of gas stations, "Mel's Garage" and the muscle cars topping up the fuel tanks.

‘
Funny, I grew up between living on the Gulf Coast and the West Coast (Monterey, later inSane Diego), Hawaii for a few years too, and fish prices were always crazy, but living so close to the source, one would figure it would be “free.”

TANSTAAFL

 

[Spkrdctr]

Like this Yorx...



which, as the photo clearly indicates, was outstanding in the field.

I had forgotten those!! I have seen many. What a blast from the past. Good old 80s all in one stack. Those sounded so bad I was shocked they ever sold any. I was by no means a super critical ear either.

 

[JeffS7444]

I figure that another factor making high-end products seem higher than ever before is that we now have greater exposure to what appears to be the lifestyles of the world's most lavish spenders.

 

[Doodski]

I had forgotten those!! I have seen many. What a blast from the past. Good old 80s all in one stack. Those sounded so bad I was shocked they ever sold any. I was by no mean a super critical ear either.

OOoo shudder. Love that Yorx plastic they used. It breaks and tears and is very non responsive to plastic welding/fusing and gluing. When I was servicing gear I had a couple of customers basically beg me to fix their Yorx machines. People with limited resources and needed their tunes. So I accepted on a trial basis and I don't even remember what the result was. I do know that after servicing Sony and other really nice to service stuff that a Yorx was pretty flimsy and cheapO.

 

[Ralph_Cramden]

Remember "Lifestyles of the Rich & Famous"? Robin Leach couldn't have been more appropriately named.

 

[Spkrdctr]

OOoo shudder. Love that Yorx plastic they used. It breaks and tears and is very non responsive to plastic welding/fusing and gluing. When I was servicing gear I had a couple of customers basically beg me to fix their Yorx machines. People with limited resources and needed their tunes. So I accepted on a trial basis and I don't even remember what the result was. I do know that after servicing Sony and other really nice to service stuff that a Yorx was pretty flimsy and cheapO.

You sir are a better person than me! I would have refused to repair a Yorx. I would not have wanted the cooties to jump onto my bench and infect my test equipment. Sometimes you have to be extra careful. Electronic cooties are so very hard to get rid of!

 

[Doodski]

You sir are a better person than me! I would have refused to repair a Yorx. I would not have wanted the cooties to jump onto my bench and infect my test equipment. Sometimes you have to be extra careful. Electronic cooties are so very hard to get rid of!

There are some customers that plead their case very well. Or the 9 year old that shows up with a Walkman, only has $30 and needs a thorough cleaning and a full tune-up. I can't say no. Oh the humanity! lol. In this kind of situation I service the product, charge what the customer can afford and make up for it somewhere else. It's community goodwill and makes for a better repertoire with the locals. The amount of kickback from this sort of community goodwill has been very good. People start arriving with entire stereos and say they heard about "us, "me" and they want their gear serviced now by somebody they trust. Otherwise I would not touch a Yorx with a ten foot pole.

 

[watchnerd]

Because there are boat loads of Rubes willing to shell out ridiculous amounts of money for Style over performance. Like buying a Ferrari with a lawnmower engine.

Hey now.

Just because some of us like to buy pretty things because they're pretty doesn't make us rubes, just spendthrifts.

Besides, that cash in my savings account is just losing to inflation, anyway.

Can only take so much time off of work each year to blow on vacations a year to burn it.

 

[MattHooper]

The fact is that most 'reviewing' (which is not really reviewing but paid 'influencing') simply offers up, in writing, what is an emotional response to the gear in question. If you read most of what passes for reviews today, the writers don't tell you how the device performs, but rather how it makes them feel.

I can't stand that type of subjective review. I was reading one recently and, as you say, it was one long blather about how "emotional" the product was and the "blissful listening sessions" the reviewer had. I'm on record for defending the use of putting sound characteristics in words, to convey the character of a component. But this mere appeal to someone's emotions is to me utterly useless.

 

[mhardy6647]

The Asian market, particularly Japan, Hong Kong and Singapore - affluent countries scarce in space - would likely drive a lot of the demand [i.e., for smaller luxury loudspeakers].

Yeah but the "Far East" (Historically Japan, but, as noted above, many other countries, now including Vietnam) market has for decades been snatching up classic Altec and JBL hardware that even I barely can accommodate.

photo above is from https://mellowgroovy.blogspot.com/2015/07/japan-trip-part-2.html

 

[mhardy6647]

Somewhere (I hope I'm not making this up) I read an interview with Dick Burwen. Now, for those young whipper snappers out there, Richard Burwen is essentially an audio god, knowing more about audio in his deep sleep than I'll ever know in my most lucid waking moments. But I digress.

Anyhow...back to the story... Burwen came up with the basic idea for the Cello Audio Palette (and the earlier LNP-2). NeXT, Tom Colengelo and Mark took his basic design/idea and built it with such a quality of parts and detail in construction that even Burwen couldn't relate to it. But, the best was the best, and that was the goal.


View attachment 210795

in re: Dick Burwen

Dick Burwen's Sound System

in re: all things Cello: Talk to Charles "Stellavox" King.

 

[Doodski]

Yeah but the "Far East" (including up Vietnam) market has for decades been snatching up classic Altec and JBL hardware that even I barely can accommodate.

photo above is from https://mellowgroovy.blogspot.com/2015/07/japan-trip-part-2.html

When I was working servicing audio gear in the early 1990's I heard accounts of wealthy collectors filling entire basements with gear they bought used. Some descriptions where along the lines of, "Stacked on shelves from floor to ceiling", "Racks and racks of it", "Entire basement was wall to wall stereo gear", etc. After a few years we all noticed the trade and buying/selling amongst us hobbyist enthusiasts dwindled away and there was very little buying and selling occurring amongst us because the gear was just not available.

 

[mhardy6647]

When I was working servicing audio gear in the early 1990's I heard accounts of wealthy collectors filling entire basements with gear they bought used. Some descriptions where along the lines of, "Stacked on shelves from floor to ceiling", "Racks and racks of it", "Entire basement was wall to wall stereo gear", etc. After a few years we all noticed the trade and buying/selling amongst us hobbyist enthusiasts dwindled away and there was very little buying and selling occurring amongst us because the gear was just not available.

Yeah... no comment.

 

[Doodski]

Yeah... no comment.

I've seen your shelves of gear. I'm describing a situation where the entire room/basement cannot be accessed because gear has been so densely crammed in there. No idea what they intended for the gear but for some it was said they where collectors, others selling it in Asia and even obsessive compulsive personalities. I consider your love of Yamaha and their love of everything American to be far apart on the scale of collection.

 

[Spkrdctr]

There are some customers that plead their case very well. Or the 9 year old that shows up with a Walkman, only has $30 and needs a thorough cleaning and a full tune-up. I can't say no. Oh the humanity! lol. In this kind of situation I service the product, charge what the customer can afford and make up for it somewhere else. It's community goodwill and makes for a better repertoire with the locals. The amount of kickback from this sort of community goodwill has been very good. People start arriving with entire stereos and say they heard about "us, "me" and they want their gear serviced now by somebody they trust. Otherwise I would not touch a Yorx with a ten foot pole.

You are a great humanitarian! Thanks for being you.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

I can't stand that type of subjective review. I was reading one recently and, as you say, it was one long blather about how "emotional" the product was and the "blissful listening sessions" the reviewer had. I'm on record for defending the use of putting sound characteristics in words, to convey the character of a component. But this mere appeal to someone's emotions is to me utterly useless.

Most current reviews consists of the 'reviewer' playing some track from some CD and saying things like "the guitar made me want to tap my feet" or some similar drivel. Totally and utterly useless, and this has filtered down to mass market type rags like Sound & Vision. Makes me really miss Julian Hirsch.

 

[Spkrdctr]

in re: Dick Burwen

Dick Burwen's Sound System

in re: all things Cello: Talk to Charles "Stellavox" King.

I have to say he was way ahead of his time. That is an amazing, over the top, crazy wild system! Digital finally caught up to him. The guy was certainly committed to going all out.