Why didn't I like my Revel Performa 3 F206 Towers?

[dcberti]

I'm just curious what your opinion might be. I just sold my Revel Performa 3 F206 because I just couldn't get myself to like them. I don't know a lot about sensitivity For speakers, But 87db doesn't seem very low from what i've read. The Revels seemed to need a lot volume to bring out detail. They seemed very "reserved". At the time that I sold them, I was comparing them to my Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary that had a supposed crossover upgrade. I liked those so much that I have since gotten the Super Lintons, and I couldn't be more pleased with them. I'm still curious about the Revels, though, and a little concerned that the new buyer won't like them. He bought them without listening to them. I was powering them with Schiit Vidar 2 monoblocks hooked to an Eversolo DMP-A8. I tried them with 2 REL T5x subs and without. Any opinions? Thank you!

 

[Koeitje]

Sensitivity has nothing to with the ability to play at low volumes.

 

[Astoneroad]

I'm just curious what your opinion might be. I just sold my Revel Performa 3 F206 because I just couldn't get myself to like them. I don't know a lot about sensitivity For speakers, But 87db doesn't seem very low from what i've read. The Revels seemed to need a lot volume to bring out detail. They seemed very "reserved". At the time that I sold them, I was comparing them to my Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary that had a supposed crossover upgrade. I liked those so much that I have since gotten the Super Lintons, and I couldn't be more pleased with them. I'm still curious about the Revels, though, and a little concerned that the new buyer won't like them. He bought them without listening to them. I was powering them with Schiit Vidar 2 monoblocks hooked to an Eversolo DMP-A8. I tried them with 2 REL T5x subs and without. Any opinions? Thank you!

I had the Salon2, F208 & F206 in the same room, at the same time to compare. It was an insightful, though subjective experience. In short, there were no surprises as to good, better, best, the Salon2's were everything that they are said to be. However, the cost of diminishing returns was eye opening. I paid $12k for the Salons, $2500 for the 208's and $1200 for the 206's, all used. I kept the 206's for the great sound and superior value and sold the others. They are the mains in both my 2 channel and HT setups. They have become my surprise end game speakers, when I bought the Salons to fit that bill. It may be your room, it's not the speakers... imho.

 

[Oddball]

I had the Salon2, F208 & F206 in the same room, at the same time to compare. It was an insightful, though subjective experience. In short, there were no surprises as to good, better, best, the Salon2's were everything that they are said to be. However, the cost of diminishing returns was eye opening. I paid $12k for the Salons, $2500 for the 208's and $1200 for the 206's, all used. I kept the 206's for the great sound and superior value. They are the mains in both my 2 channel and HT setups. They have become my surprise end game speakers, when I bought the Salons to fit that bill. It may be your room, it's not the speakers... imho.
View attachment 424576

When I see them nicely lined up like this, I would have no heart to sell any of them .

 

[Sokel]

Well,I wouldn't like them either side by side:

That bump up in the most sensitive area looks threatening to me.

 

[Astoneroad]

When I see them nicely lined up like this, I would have no heart to sell any of them .

I was honored to be in the same room with them... but it's nice to reclaim my space. The 206's were the only pair that visually melted into the background, which helps take my visual bias out of the experience.

 

[Astoneroad]

Well,I wouldn't like them either side by side:


View attachment 424579

That bump up in the most sensitive area looks threatening to me.

This setup was for the pic... not for the listening comparison when they had their own space and the others moved aside.

 

[Sokel]

This setup was for the pic... not for the listening comparison when they had their own space and the others moved aside.

Oh,no,that was for the OP,I would have quoted you if it was about your post.

 

[TurtlePaul]

Well,I wouldn't like them either side by side:



That bump up in the most sensitive area looks threatening to me.

That is a cabinet edge defraction around 4.5 khz because the F206 are much more narrow than its big brothers. If you toe them out 10 degrees or so, you don't hear that at all.

Wharfedale Lintons have a little scoop just above 1 khz because of their wiggle in the directivity index and in general will just sound brighter than the F206.

 

[Astoneroad]

That is a cabinet edge defraction around 4.5 khz because the F206 are much more narrow than its big brothers. If you toe them out 10 degrees or so, you don't hear that at all.

Which is how I've got them toed in and the room has "some" treatment and my 67 year old ears can't detect the bump... lol. For the price, I love the 206's.

 

[kma100]

That is a cabinet edge defraction around 4.5 khz because the F206 are much more narrow than its big brothers. If you toe them out 10 degrees or so, you don't hear that at all.

Wharfedale Lintons have a little scoop just above 1 khz because of their wiggle in the directivity index and in general will just sound brighter than the F206.

Does that apply to the F208's as well?

 

[Sokel]

That is a cabinet edge defraction around 4.5 khz because the F206 are much more narrow than its big brothers. If you toe them out 10 degrees or so, you don't hear that at all.

Wharfedale Lintons have a little scoop just above 1 khz because of their wiggle in the directivity index and in general will just sound brighter than the F206.

That's why it needs to be the flattest possible there,so toe in will further reduce it (like lintons or even more) for the ones like me who can't stand it.
For example I'd rather listen to a nice chainsaw than the second generation B&W Matrix 801 which had the same thing (along with thin midbass,the horror)

But that's me,I wanna be clear about it,I have this since my teens,others may like it.

 

[Pareto Pragmatic]

The Revels seemed to need a lot volume to bring out detail. They seemed very "reserved". At the time that I sold them, I was comparing them to my Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary ...

Looking at the measurements, Revels have a bass bump at 140hz or so, Wharfedales have a bit of a dip at 1k and more treble extension. The Revels have a bit of a dip at 2khz.

So I am guessing the dip at 2k and the earlier roll off on the high end are the cause of the "missing" detail you experienced.

I'm glad you found something you like! That's what really matters.

 

[Petrushka]

Speaking from personal experience, when I read that speakers need to be played louder to bring out detail, I want to ask, how old is the listener.

 

[Astoneroad]

Speaking from personal experience, when I read that speakers need to be played louder to bring out detail, I want to ask, how old is the listener.

WHAT??

 

[Oddball]

Speaking from personal experience, when I read that speakers need to be played louder to bring out detail, I want to ask, how old is the listener.

I have to say that older I get I crave less of the head-banging volumes of the past.

 

[Petrushka]

WHAT??

My post was a bit sarcastic, but should have been understandable. As I got older, higher frequencies dropped out at low volume. Turn the volume up, more detail. Hearing aids turn up the volume, but are crap for music.

 

[Astoneroad]

My post was a bit sarcastic, but should have been understandable. As I got older, higher frequencies dropped out at low volume. Turn the volume up, more detail. Hearing aids turn up the volume, but are crap for music.

Yeah... my response was yelling to say it LOUDER ... I'm an old guy too and it was my attempt at a joke... lost in transmission.

 

[TurtlePaul]

Does that apply to the F208's as well?

Amir has measured both the F208 and F206. The F208 do not exhibit this. Look at the picture above with the F206, F208 and Salon 2. See how the sides of the F206 waveguide reach almost to the sides of the cabinet but the F208 has a lot of space around the tweeter waveguide? i suspect that is why the F206 has this issue.

I have a pair of F206, but I have them angled to point at a spot that is about 10 ft behind my couch. I don't hear this issue. But I do EQ up the treble a bit at 2.15 khz as I get a little but of a crossover dip here and the EQ gives it more presence.

 

[Overseas]

This is another example of a buyer wanting a bit of treble in the speaker EQ and not having an RME ADI-2 DAC FS with the Loudness control configured to his preference. Using the Loudness control I can easily make the Revel sound like the Wharfedale or the Wharfedale more like the Revel. I was even able to make my BMR Monitor's sound amazingly close to the Revel F328Be.

When you don't have the RME ADI-2 DAC FS with the ADI-2 software installed, your listening options are more limited and people think switching out speakers is the only way to find their ideal sound. It's crazy how different your perception becomes when you have the right tools and know how to use them.

What about mixing the loudness RME with Room correction from Wiim? Is it possible?