Who makes the best drivers in the world?

[YSDR]

That is not a fair comparison as the ATC is a bandwidth-limited dedicated midrange driver while the properties of the Purify are optimized for bass and lower midrange in a 2-way concept.

Of course the Purifi can go lower, that's not a secret, but I don't think it's inteded to be used mainly in a 2-way, as Purifi says it's a "Dedicated midrange driver with enhanced efficiency". That's why I brought for comparison. I edited my previous comment because the mentioned Purifi is the PTT6.5M08-NFA-01A, so it's a 8 Ohm driver, not 4 Ohm. Sorry, I misread the spec!

The result will be a pretty old-fashioned looking loudspeaker anyways.

What do you mean by "old fashioned"? I don't think a Neumann KH420 or an ATC SCM100 or 150 leaves too much to be desired if used as intended. These are some of the best speakers that man made.

 

[AnalogSteph]

If you think about a reasonable strategy to integrate a 3" dome, you end up with 3- or 4-way concepts integrating several chunky drivers into a more or less broad baffle. The result will be a pretty old-fashioned looking loudspeaker anyways.

Old-fashioned looking speaker?

Not in my book.

I wonder how far you can push a 3-way concept like that - let's say you put the 3" dome into a Big Ole Waveguide and cross it at 500ish Hz. Seems low enough for a 12", maybe even up to 18" woofer. Kind of like a Genelec 1238A crossed with a KH420. I wouldn't be too worried about the tweeter if you follow the same approach with a 1" having decently low fs - 2.5 kHz XO sounds doable.

 

[Arindal]

Old-fashioned looking speaker?

Regarding width of the baffle and shape - yes.

let's say you put the 3" dome into a Big Ole Waveguide and cross it at 500ish Hz.

For a speaker developer this means a lot of restrictions anyways. You have a chunky yet bandwidth-limited midrange on the baffle requiring a more or less chunky (mid)woofer next to it (or a 4-way concept). Due to the high x-over freq, placing them next to each other taking care of interference and directivity, is mandatory. Same is true to combining it with a tweeter as the x-over frequency is basically fixed by the design.

The midrange might show exemplary performance within its preferred frequency band, but the requirements when selecting woofer and tweeter are similar to what you have to take care of in a 2-way design.

 

[YSDR]

The midrange might show exemplary performance within its preferred frequency band, but the requirements when selecting woofer and tweeter are similar to what you have to take care of in a 2-way design.

No. For example, with the ATC dome, you can use a 15" woofer and a tweeter that plays clean 3+ kHz and the whole speaker still have wide dispersion pattern (not like a typical 15" 2-way).

 

[Arindal]

For example, with the ATC dome, you can use a 15" woofer and a tweeter that plays clean 3+ kHz and the whole speaker still have wide dispersion pattern (not like a typical 15" 2-way).

Certainly true, but this is what I meant by old-fashioned concept. You nevertheless have to choose and position the 15" according to how its midrange behavior will be like, even if it has to play just up to 500Hz.

 

[Birdy]

So the obvious question is: If it's so good why doesn't Dynaudio make it any more?

IT is e,s

My first questions when it comes to a midrange dome would actually be how it behaves below 500Hz regarding distortion and above 3K when it comes to directivity. In between I believe they are excellent.

A larger cone speaker, like a 8 inch is much better in the range between 300 HZ - 800 Hz. Forcing any dome, 2 or 3 inch to go low is in my opinion not a good idea. If you let it do what i does best with as less cone excursion as possible it shines with great dispersion and because of that, a natural impression of guitar, saxophone and voices.

 

[Birdy]

So the obvious question is: If it's so good why doesn't Dynaudio make it any more?

Companies primary goal is to make money (for shareholders), If a product is very good but expensive to produce they will stop. If they don’t make enough money on a product they will start cutting corners and produce less expensive units, spend more on marketing and sell a product with less quality for more money.

 

[YSDR]

A larger cone speaker, like a 8 inch is much better in the range between 300 HZ - 800 Hz. Forcing any dome, 2 or 3 inch to go low is in my opinion not a good idea.

It all depends on the actual driver. For example a 8" cone driver can have bad cone resonances in the 300-800 Hz region and at the same time an ATC dome don't have problem even if crossed to two 15" woofers (SCM300) at 380 Hz..

 

[Birdy]

It all depends on the actual driver. For example a 8" cone driver can have bad cone resonances in the 300-800 Hz region and at the same time an ATC dome don't have problem even if crossed to two 15" woofers (SCM300) at 380 Hz..

Of course it always depends of the quality of the driver and it's behavior. I use a 8 inch because it is relatively light (23 gr) and has no resonance issues in that area, it even goes to 2 Khz without problems. Large more bulky 12 or 15 inch drivers will have more mass inertia by the weight of it’s cone.

 

[Arindal]

Forcing any dome, 2 or 3 inch to go low is in my opinion not a good idea.

I agree, but this is mainly a matter of existing units´ resonance frequency, xmax and capabilities of their suspension keeping movements pistonic when being driven hard below 500Hz.

I do not think it is a matter of the size, as there are fine 3" to 4" cone midrange units available which do exactly what you expect from 150 to 3,000Hz. Maybe not as loud and as distortion-free as an ATC dome but in practical applications close enough.

If you let it do what i does best with as less cone excursion as possible it shines with great dispersion and because of that, a natural impression of guitar, saxophone and voices.

Absolutely agree, but that requires a similarly careful choice of woofer and tweeter as the bands below 500Hz and above 2.6K also contribute to the impression of ´natural timbre´.

I use a 8 inch because it is relatively light (23 gr) and has no resonance issues in that area, it even goes to 2 Khz without problems.

May I ask which model and diaphragm that is? Any 8" going all the way up to 2K has been designed to avoid cone breakup, resonances or directivity narrowing down. The question is which side-effect comes with these measures.

 

[Birdy]

I agree, but this is mainly a matter of existing units´ resonance frequency, xmax and capabilities of their suspension keeping movements pistonic when being driven hard below 500Hz.

I do not think it is a matter of the size, as there are fine 3" to 4" cone midrange units available which do exactly what you expect from 150 to 3,000Hz. Maybe not as loud and as distortion-free as an ATC dome but in practical applications close enough.



Absolutely agree, but that requires a similarly careful choice of woofer and tweeter as the bands below 500Hz and above 2.6K also contribute to the impression of ´natural timbre´.



May I ask which model and diaphragm that is? Any 8" going all the way up to 2K has been designed to avoid cone breakup, resonances or directivity narrowing down. The question is which side-effect comes with these measures.

I use an 8 inch Vifa 21wp250 polycone which i roll off at 1 KHz with a subwoofer below 40Hz. The D54 dome midrange goes up to 5 KHz. (almost like a 2-way with a planar super tweeter)

 

[goat76]

I do not think it is a matter of the size, as there are fine 3" to 4" cone midrange units available which do exactly what you expect from 150 to 3,000Hz. Maybe not as loud and as distortion-free as an ATC dome but in practical applications close enough.

This thread is about finding out who makes the best drivers in the world. "Close enough" is not the best, and I think you just agreed that ATC makes the best midrange drivers in the world.

 

[C0mbat]

No mention of Viawave tweeters. I have the SRT-7 ribbon tweeters and they seem to be considered some of the best available elsewhere. I have them paired with the Purifi woofers in my Robson Acoustics Burlington MKIII and then a Kef KC62 sub and love them.

 

[YSDR]

I have the SRT-7

I have a pair of GRT-145W-8. I think all the Viawaves are really good.

 

[Arindal]

I think you just agreed that ATC makes the best midrange drivers in the world.

If ´best´ is defined as highest SPL and lowest THD in a strictly bandwidth-limited application, I indeed agree.

I personally would define ´best´ a bit differently, taking reasonable options to combine with other drivers and actual sound quality of the whole system into account.

 

[Audionaut]

If you are only looking for a very good 4-inch midrange / full range driver, you should take a look at this one, which is also very reasonably priced.

Faital Pro 4FE35

4FE35 (8Ω) by FaitalPRO

FaitalPRO combined the latest R&D methods and technologies with the most advanced industrial automation techniques and all FaitalPRO drivers are made in Italy with the highest level of quality, consistency and durability.

faitalpro.com

 

[Arindal]

If you are only looking for a very good 4-inch midrange / full range driver, you should take a look at this one,

fs=100Hz, Qts=0.83, xmax=2.7mm - does not really look like a fullrange driver to me as it seemingly does not allow any standard enclosure design to produce meaningful bass. Do you happen to know what the woven diaphragm is made of?

 

[goat76]

If ´best´ is defined as highest SPL and lowest THD in a strictly bandwidth-limited application, I indeed agree.

I personally would define ´best´ a bit differently, taking reasonable options to combine with other drivers and actual sound quality of the whole system into account.

Don't you think 380 Hz to 3.5 kHz covers a wide range for a dedicated midrange driver made for 3-way designs?

I’m sure 380 Hz and down is an easy job for most bass drivers, and that most tweeters can easily handle the area above 3.5 kHz.

 

[YSDR]

If ´best´ is defined as highest SPL and lowest THD in a strictly bandwidth-limited application, I indeed agree.

I don't think an ATC SCM150 is a bandwidth limited speaker. The ATC mid dome don't meant to be used alone but at least with a woofer and a tweeter.

If we look at it this way, we could classify all tweeters or woofers as weak or bad because their usable bandwidth is limited.

 

[Audionaut]

does not really look like a fullrange driver to me as it seemingly does not allow any standard enclosure design to produce meaningful bass

I know the chassis very well, otherwise I wouldn't recommend them. They are more robust and better than the pure data would suggest.

Here they are used as a full-range four-way speaker in a professional speaker system. Although it is the neodymium 4FE32 version, they hardly differ except for the magnets.

4FE32 (8Ω) by FaitalPRO

FaitalPRO combined the latest R&D methods and technologies with the most advanced industrial automation techniques and all FaitalPRO drivers are made in Italy with the highest level of quality, consistency and durability.

faitalpro.com

Test: IMG Stageline Flat-M200 und Flat-M100 Monitore - AMAZONA.de

Im Test: IMG Stageline Flat-M200 und Flat-M100 Monitore. Zwei flache Bühnenmonitore mit gutem Klang und kraftvollen Endstufen.

www.amazona.de